lowzeewee Posted November 3, 2003 Share Posted November 3, 2003 Wow,so aggressive,I will leave this thread for good before you flame me on MSN or something! :-XWith shivering regards before leaving,Lowzeewee,a Singaporean. :- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alchemi2 Posted November 3, 2003 Share Posted November 3, 2003 not flaming you lowzeewee just pointing out the obvious and ive talk to you often MSN so get a grip and find out the facts so you know what your on about ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 3, 2003 Share Posted November 3, 2003 I will not concede defeat yet!I will be back!To go to the "against" side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sneakgab Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 ''Edit:I did read a small history book that said that it was originally an arab area. ''Lol... Chomsky's perhaps? j/k egeidesBTW, even if Israeli media is heavily biased about this matter, it is still probably less biased than palestinian scources because the Israeli media has more freedom of speech. I don't see valid reason for the scources from leo,mrwhatever,Noam to be questioned so much because they all have many different scources (some international) and experience the situation upfront... besides, even with the palestinian scources their was no actual evidence of bombardment of residential areas or anything like that... only propoganda in the form of suggesting certain things and the likeOne thing though, are you sure we should really take into account the fact that the Jews were in Israel 5 millinia ago? I suppose though that the Palestinians often go crazy about how the Jews took their territory when they're really just a refugee nation made up from some of the other Arabs state's populace anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Its a FYI-type history handbook. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supremmmm Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 what is a terrorist??? a boy with a stone in his hand??? what makes a terrorist???? if u dont got the fancy weapons( tanks, helis, plane etc.) u r a terrorist???? what was it bush once said about Ariel sharon.. He is a man of peace... when i heard that i was almost falling down of the chair.... We all know that bush is stupid... American policy sure do what they can to make "terrorist" idont say that JIhad or any of the other groups r innoncents... hell no... arafat has nothing to say over them anymore... they see him as a week.... there r many aspects to this... we will never agreed no matter how much we discuss this... there r two side of the coin ::) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 And most of the people in this discussion are forcing me to turn my coin around. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noam Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Supreme guy: You are questioning the reliability of my sources, while I question yours. It goes like this - I'm smarter, older, meaner and I FUCKING LIVE INSIDE ALL OF THIS. My sources are the news, the paper, what I see myself. Are you trying to tell me that the bus that exploded right under my house was blown up by innocent people? You don't know anything, and but anything I mean ANYTHING about the situation. I won't even bother retorting this time. Just a waste of time...Sneakgab: I don't care about the ancient history, as I see it what was thousands of years ago shouldn't matter when discussing present. I was just answering the guy who said that there were no jews in Israel before the establishment of the Zionism. Last - The Israeli media is not biased. We have all the information available about our PM's criminal investigation, probably much more than you know actually, we know everything that goes. We're not like the "The American will never get close to Baghdad" guys, the media here is professional. I don't see a reason to doubt it.PS: The Matrix: Revolution is a disappointing movie. Watch only if you can't live without knowing what happens in the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 The Israeli media is not biasedWow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noam Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Point=Israeli Media is also biased... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotsman Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Building walls will never solve problems or even contain them; history has shown us that. Haydrians wall, The Great Wall of China and even the Berlin wall to name but a few. Human beings are very adaptable people at ways to climb, go around, go through or bring these obstacles down. Both sides in this conflict are doing wrongs. A solution may well be a long time off. Terrorism feeds from fear and the entropy of a just cause with a population. I believe the suicide bombings carried out by the Palestinians help gel their people together for a just cause in the same way it gels the Israeli people against them. Terrorists require a world stage to tell everybody how just their cause is and the hardships they are trying to stop. With every Palestinian terrorist action there is a televised Israeli reaction. This is exactly the opposite of what should be happening. Attention should not be drawn to acts of terrorism, because this is exactly what they want. Fight terrorism with terrorism, the British took long enough to realise this with Ireland. In this case SAS were sent in to assassinated prime targets quietly, nothing got into the papers so the IRA could not claim any wrong doing. The Mossad I am sure are equal to the task, they may already be doing it! Let the experts deal with terrorism and not government departments. Stop the televised helicopter gunship attacks it only helps the terrorists. I can’t believe all Palestinians want war over peace. Find out where the brain or brains behind the attacks come from and remove them QUIETLY.A solution to this problem will not come from the West, it has to come from within. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Exactly the help I need!Thank you,scotsman! :)Sharing the place would be a solution peacefully but is there a way to start a ceasefire? ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warskum Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 First its a lot easier to say "kill the brain(s)" then to do this cuz these brains arent stupid.IF u kill these brains other ones will come because a lots of the Palestin ppl want the jews dead( I am NOT saying ALL the Palestin want war but most of them want the jews dead and the hole country back)I had posted this a while ago but non of u answer it so i ask lowzeewee and sctotsman to aswer this plz:"To every1 against Israel:What would u do if ur neighbour run into ur house and blows himself up killin ur wife and children?Would u go into his house and make a peace agreement or would u kill his wife and children?Lets say u want a peace agreement but the next day his son runs into ur families house and blows himself up killin a lots of ur family,what would u do then??Ask him nicely not to do that anymore?I think a lots of ppl would grab a knife or something and run into the house of the neighbour and kill his wife and children. If u look it this way I would say Israel has been very very gentil to those palestines." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 We are talking about country-country where diplomacy can save thousands of lives and stop the shit while what you are talking about will not stop the shit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warskum Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Low plz tell how the Israeli can stop this shit?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 There is no possible way at the moment.So no discussion. ;)The only thing I can think of is sharing the wall but how is that possible when both need the whole wall... :- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warskum Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Well if there is no way to stop this shit for now that means Palestines will continu with terorirst attacks so Israel has to defend himself, wenn defending himself Israel might kill more ppl the Palestines did, then u will start about it that Israeli are killing more ppl then the Palestines but what should they do?? all they want is to protect their families and while their are doing this inocent Palestines might die but thats a part of war, atleast Iraeli are trying to avoid killing inocent ppl while palestine kill inocent ppl on purpuse. Even Palestines using terrorist attacks israel is willing to share the country with them and instead of beeing thankful for this the Palestines attack the Israeli. Israel could conquer the Palestine part cuz he is strong enough, but they don`t because they are satisvied with their part of the country while Palestines want THE HOLE COUNTRY and this is the problem because if Palestines would be satisvied with their part and stop the terrorist attacks this conflict would be over and both sides could live in peace. I AM NOT SAYING ITS ONLY THE FAULT OF THE PALESTINES, but I think the source of this conflict lies in the Palestine part.BTW: Low if u don`t know the past u won`t understand the present ( thats why we get history on school, to understand the present) so I don`t understand why u keep on going without even understanding how the conflict started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 History in my school only teaches about skills of learning History,Singapore's history,and modern world 1910-1980. ;)Btw,then why go SURGE into Palestine and mow down homes and then just camp there and send colonists? :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotsman Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 "To every1 against Israel:What would u do if ur neighbour run into ur house and blows himself up killin ur wife and children?Would u go into his house and make a peace agreement or would u kill his wife and children?Lets say u want a peace agreement but the next day his son runs into ur families house and blows himself up killin a lots of ur family,what would u do then??Ask him nicely not to do that anymore?I think a lots of ppl would grab a knife or something and run into the house of the neighbour and kill his wife and children. If u look it this way I would say Israel has been very very gentil to those palestines." There is no right in war or conflict just a lessor wrong. But to answer your question:If my family were killed due to the act of one person, you would be right, I would hunt that person down. If that person died while killing my family, then my grief and anger would be turned to those who sent him/her, not at the persons family, unless they knowingly helped carry out the killing.If you are taught from birth to hate, is it the person being taught that is wrong or is it the teachers? After all, no child is born to hate!If a solution to the problem could be found in words, this thread would have finished a long time ago. The issue is more a mind set and will unfortunately take a long time to change.Terrorism is a hard nut to crack. To slow the bombings, you should look at the profiteers, the people selling the weapons and explosives to the Palestinians and the smugglers bringing this ordinance in. Hit these people hard and this will have a slow down effect. It will not stop the bombings but will give a little breathing space.You need the Palestinian people to show intolerance to the terrorism. This will be very difficult while they look at these people as martyrs.Involve Palestinians in many areas of protection, dual border patrol, dual incursions into Palestinian land, if required. By doing this you are putting Palestinians in the firing line of these terrorists and may bring about a slow change in attitude when they’re own people are dying at the hands of the very people they revere. Both sides need an honourable way out of this for peace to exist. Back one side into a corner will only involve more bloodshed.Never negotiate with terrorists, it will only legitimise their cause. Look for the true leaders inside Palestine. These people are the listeners and work hard in the background. The bullies are the loud ones, and who’s only power comes from the weapons they carry.If peace is to exist, change is inevitable. Both sides must realise they cannot stay the way they are. Both sides must be willing to give up or share things they treasure if a commitment to peace is desired.Relations between bordering countries I think must be like a marriage. A perfect partnership only exists in books that usually begin with “Once Upon A Time”. In real life it is usually on partner that puts more into the relationship, gives in a little easier or refrains from arguments more often. This could be true between Israel and Palestine.I think at this point in time both are trying to be dominating, as giving in to some areas may show a sign of weakness. If one country gives a little more than expected by the other, it could be seen as a sign of self-strength. Especially, if it is seen as a gift and not a war victory.These are only my thoughts. I do not pretend to have an in-depth knowledge about the conflict. I have simply answered what was asked at the very start of this threadI’m fascinated to hear what you guys think about it.I am sorry for the loss that the innocent on both sides has gone through, and the loss of innocence the young on both sides are living through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noam Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 We are talking about country-country where diplomacy can save thousands of lives and stop the shit while what you are talking about will not stop the shit...Excuse me, but diplomacy with WHOM exactly?! We tried negotiating with Abu Mazen's former Palestinian government, and did have a significant progress with the negotiation. Arafat saw this, and made his movement in any direction extremely difficult. Abu Mazen has made a speech in front of the Palestinian parliament blaming Arafat for preventing him from moving on in the way to peace. He quit, and Arafat appoint a new PM. Diplomacy is a really nice word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 Yes,it IS a nice word. ;)Without diplomacy,there is no way this thing will stop unless USA comes in and say that Palestine has WMD and invades them with the help of Israel. ;)So basically,this will go on forever unless war is declared... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noam Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 By the way, look at that:http://uploaded.fresh.co.il/3fab534f48f82996.jpgALERT - What happened to his head may be difficult to view. Not for pregnant women / people with high blood pressure.You can read what the Palestinian propaganda people made out of it, while if you look closely at the fourth picture you can notice the blood very easily. What really happened, as it was on the news and on any possible site/magazine/newspaper except for we-love-palestine.com, is that the soldiers took him, identified him, noticed the explosive belt under his clothes, immediately shot his head and then undressed him to remove the explosive belt. You don't have to be a hawk in order to notice that there is a red stain where his head was supposed to be.Pictures may be deceiving... Especially when taken by someone who takes sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 Its a banner advertising apples with some wording I can't understand... ??? :- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noam Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 No support for remote linking. C&P to the URL bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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