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oh, of course! thanks to the various ways the macro is simplified (repeat queue, B hotkey, etc), the tech tree can and should be more complex I've seen the various testers and the players who have checked the debut mission out so far take wildly varied approaches to the macro game. I anticipate you'll see those problem areas I described while the tech tree is in its unfinished state when you eventually get the chance to give this debut mission a shot, but it's hopefully also much more interesting than vanilla d2k's handling of upgrades and teching up, even at this juncture eh, that's not too difficult, if ya ask me... if a mission is meant to spotlight a certain kind of unit, and those units are already balanced with certain roles in mind, then we already know where that role shines. the mission just needs adjustment to emphasize that role. frankly, the tougher part is getting a player to realize "this unit is imba on this mission" because everybody just spams Troopers, Quads and Combat Tanks. xD before yelling at me for locking Rocket Turrets behind T3 because they're OP and very much desired on hard mode. ...maybe with a new faction in play we'll see players pick up what I'm laying down more often, ya know? lol not that I want to make that unit the only viable answer on its associated mission or whatever. that's the other tough part. Starcraft 2 leaned a bit too heavily into that, in some places. some very one-note missions that wind up feeling like a glorified tutorial. I get the sentiment that campaigns may be meant to lead the player onto the ladder or something, but for those who want only to enjoy the campaign, I've gotta take special care in gearing a mission towards a certain kind of unit so all the other stuff the player has been picking up still applies. better experience that way regarding the multiplayer thing: that's unfortunately nothing more than theory until they get access to the new features we've got in single-player that make stuff like this new faction's units possible. I hear they're making good progress on it, but who knows when they'll formally wrap that up. the theory can be important for making a satisfying balance in single-player, but it ultimately only applies to single-player even if we do wind up with some overpowered stuff though, uhh... I mean, RA2 is unbalanced as hell and still very popular just cuz its wacky roster of units is so much fun. so, while balance is absolutely a consideration as you can see from... all of the above, and all to follow, it does actually take a backseat to fun factor and rule-of-cool. cool / fun new thing comes first, attempt to balance cool / fun thing comes second that's a good approach. I went a bit of a different direction with maps like S02V1 back in SS... that was balanced as a 'skillgate mission,' a tougher mission that appears early on just to ask the player, "hey, are you comfortable with the difficulty level? if not, turn it down. if so, carry on." that sort of thing takes players off-guard, but helps shape their experience in the rest of the campaign in a more positive light. or so that's the intent. it worked out well for a lot of players who, after butting heads with S02V1, started experimenting more on the later maps and discovering subtleties to the submods that really helped them survive in ways they may not have found if not for S02V1 frontloading some pain in their faces I had spotlighty missions too. like, S06V2 very much so encourages the use of stuff like Siege Tanks or Duelist Tanks. it was more about missions like S02V1 though, strategically raising or lowering the difficulty level to gauge or tamper with the player's expectations, or for story reasons doing things a bit more traditionally in some respects this time around, I don't think there will be maps like that where the enemy has high/end tech early on, like on S02V1. specifically because it involves a new faction and players are 100% not going to be familiar with it from vanilla. I'll thus probably be doing it that way, spotlighting units as they become available through subtle mission design tricks to encourage the player to try them out in favorable conditions and understand those favorable conditions. smoother difficulty curve. strategically-placed difficulty spikes can do a campaign favors, but they're not for every campaign

Have you any thoughts on a tech tree? How will it progress? Sorry to say, the techtree needs to be balanced as well. And this might be the hardest job. Since you introduce a player to a new unit. The mission might depend on that particular unit. And the multiplayer techtree should be balanced as well. I think, the latter is even more important than the single player campaign. Because a new unit might actually be over powered for its first job. Just for the fun of it It is how I introduced some of my units in the past. "o my, we don't have enough resources for dealing with the bunkers. Let's get 1 artillery unit, we know it is expensive, but that attack range of 13 is more than enough to protect it from wandering survivors".

thanks very much!! ah, I don't like to restrict the player too much even on missions with pure defense objectives, I've gotta account for if the player's gonna be aggressive and attack the enemy and stuff. quite a few players have been taken off guard on S02V1 by trying to beat up the high-tech enemy lol there are some exceptions, of course. like, S02V2 was designed to introduce hero units in a controlled environment, to teach the player to sacrifice ANYTHING to keep them alive, and show their strength without the macro game in the picture. that was only for like... 22.5k ticks or something? and I don't think we'll need missions like that in the next series. no hero units so yeah, defense-oriented missions, sure, but I gotta spice it up if it's pure defense, somehow xD ah yeah, and the Wings of Liberty campaign had that one with the supernova and the banshees and all that. terran buildings being able to pick up and wander the map was integral to that one. fun concept, very memorable it took the forefront in that mission though, whereas the natural progression of wandering the map for resources is, uhh... more of an encouraged course of action than a necessity. an underlying gameplay mechanic supporting the main gameplay loop, the focus remains on defeating the enemy. less, uhh... distinct, but hopefully more fun to be had with more flexibility on more missions. less linearity and stuff damn, mate. aye, I've lost some missions too. dang computers perhaps what I refer to as gimmicks are what you're referring to here as secondary objectives ^^ I would classify the end stage of S06V2 as being its secondary objective. the production goals on SBON2 are secondary objectives. perhaps 'xyz hero unit must survive' is more of a secondary objective than a gimmick even if it's all primary though, missions can remain interesting with a strong enough gameplay loop. I've replayed Halo: CE lots of times just because its gameplay loop is so well-conceived, despite its repetition in mission layout and stuff aye, that's the plan ^^ actually, that was chiefly what I was looking for in Kipp's test run of the variables example map in the thread I linked in the last post! he had to expand a bit to support his offensive, but wasn't overwhelmed by the enemy before he could do that. target hard mode balance achieved! and now I've got the data to go off of for future missions' designs. a factor in helping to balance this debut mission, despite it being very different from that variables example map didn't mean it was perfect from the get-go though. not that that was my fault... during this process, we discovered the AI on hard mode in d2k gets a x.75 modifier on its unit build rate, which was enough to screw up my calculations without an AI parameter-adjusting event using the index number of the assigned variable as opposed to the variable's stored value too. that also happened. what a headache xD after those problems were accounted for though, the theoretical balance I had been aiming for worked out perfectly. the testers reported it was quite manageable! thank goodness Klofkac really went all the way with enabling us mappers to do stuff ^^ impossible to overstate the meaning of his contributions aye. the variables example map was more dramatic on this front, allowing the player to start in the top right, bottom left or bottom right corners, so you'd get three very different ways to approach the rest of the map. this debut mission already introduces lotsa new units, not to mention the new environment, so the three start locations here just change the order in which you get the units you're meant to start with. the player gets an MCV at the same place on the debut mission no matter which start location was chosen oh, yeah well, time will tell about the Keravnos. it's probably in a pretty good spot for an MBT, but some other units may need adjustment. the Diakotn for one feels weak, but with its low cost and some other stuff, maybe that's just fine. I already made some other adjustments, like to its armor type

I like your train of thoughts. I like that you also considered balance around resource managment. But also allow for turtling. That is a very awesome approach. I am glad that you called them RTS enjoyers. It is true, campers on RTS are enjoying their line of defence. I had this in Warcraft 2, Starcraft and also in Tiberiun dawn and sun. Would be funny though, if you slip in 1 mission that requires the player to camp first for an hour or something. Like, being stuck in the mountains with limited resources that grow slowly overtime. I did something similar in regards to resources. Although resources were limited. And expansion should be done if you are an agressive player. A turtle player could camp. till the resources were depleted. Then all the forces should move. That kind of deal. That was a so called mission 8 I once made in Starcraft. (It is lost forever ) In short, you could camp with the correct defenders. And for an attack, you could either repair/heal them almost indifinately. And after defeating 1 of the 2 bases, you got that expand. I literly made that mission with the goal in mind. Defeat 1 base, and you could spend the remaining resources entirely on only half your units. As for secondairy objectives. I feel like they should be there from time to time. Especially in later missions. But they should be there for adding a reward for the player, during the mission. Which would help the player. One such secondairy objective was often the capture of enemy structures in C&C td. But the resque of units or whatever, are also valuable options. Unless, you have secondairy objectives being part of the primairy one. Then it is simply all primairy though. Perhaps, when the campaign is almost done. You could test the different difficulties, together with the resource managment. Where on easy difficulty, expansion is not needed. On normal, recommended. And on hard, a nessesary objective. Something like that. It is very hard to achieve though. So, if you manage, you can consider it as a trophy as designer. I will come back later on that editor. I never used it. But you mentioned it by name specifically. Once I have more time. And after playing the mission. I might ask for the other stuff. Wow, you can allow the player to select their start location? That is awesome! I always liked that. Ehm. you mentioned theoratical balance at the end for multiplayer. I meant that theoratical balance is solely based on numbers and formula's. For all the other balances to grow on. An example would be that the bazooka infantry in C&C td costs 300. But testing already showed that they are too weak that way. Practically speaking, they needed more health or cost less. This was even the case for single player. In multiplayer, they are only used as anti air units at the start. They were....tested very late. You can see the result in tiberian sun. Where the Nod rocket soldier has A. more health, and B. costs 250.

appreciated, mate. take your time ah, you're unfamiliar with Klofkac's editor? if you've used it at all since v2.0 or so, it'll be familiar enough. otherwise if you're talking, like, shai-hulud editing or something like that, Klofkac's editor will spoil you rotten with the amount of stuff we're capable of now. for reference, v2.0 is the most advanced version of the editor BEFORE new features were added, and remains suitable for co-op or multiplayer mapping. the vanilla-sized version of the tileset I published can be mapped with via v2.0. we're currently on v2.3! if ya got any questions about the editor, I should be able to answer 'em. I frequent the Landsraad Discord if you gotta rapid-fire 'em, otherwise I try to check back here. oh yeah, you're preachin' to the choir here I hope that's enough insight for ya into my thought process on the design front xD

I will put it in my todo list. Although, it is one mission. I understand you need proper feedback on it. Since I did one on Barkhan, why not. Right now, I am in a flow, right before a very busy month. So, earliest would be December I think. Would love to poke around. But it is new territory for me. Still, it is similar to how Forge looked like. So a traditional editor. I will find my way. (I mis Forge) I got some insights on balance. It can be a tricky thing. There are several steps (not in order). - Theoratical balance; all designs follow the same formula. This formula is based on the combat mechanics. Unique to every RTS. All numbers that I like to crush. - Practical balance; some designs might be a bit too unique, or are part of a group of similar designs. Uniqueness means less choice. And it depends on how it can be countered, thus a buff or nerv would be required by mapping the RPS between designs. Practical balance is also depending on a map layout. Personally, I like adding new units to cover this section. Or redesign others. - Skill balance; due to certain players being extra good. Some units might be overpowered. If they are bad in the hands of noobs, you are all good. But if they are also good in the hands of noobs, they certainly need a nerv. - Single player balance; can often be different than the multiplayer balance. All steps are important. Most discussions appear around the practical balance. But their true roots are in skill balance. I had one a couple of days ago about the new axethrowers and archers in the remaster of WC2. The skilled player felt it was too powerfull for now for him. He mostly plays chokepoint maps. Yet the balance that Blizzard had in mind was for the single player campaign. The balance that YOU pick, is YOURS. You can ask for Feedback from others. But YOU as the game designer are never wrong in this for YOUR own game. Meaning, no matter what I or others throw at you. The decision is yours. You need to feel comfortable playing your own game. Well, having said that. Consider Feedback as advice. And you can organise advice. So, if you want to collect the massive feedback in landsraad. Perhaps make a simple tickbox poll. Not sure if it is possible. But a table per unit design would be usefull for you. The columns could be: cost, health, damage, firerate etc. While the rows cold be: way to low, to low, good, to high, way to high. People could change the tickboxes. Maybe prepare an excel file with this and some explanation. Firerate....i know it as Rate of Fire, Cooldown, DPS. Well, people gave it all kind of names. But make sure that you and the one filling in the questionaire are on the same wavelength. Because some think of Rate of Fire as Cooldown, yet they are each others opposites. Rate of Fire in physics means, the rate, on firing. Thus higher is faster. Cooldown is the time between shots. I don't care if people still get it wrong and strongly believe they are right, just make sure you are on the same wavelength. I also spotted time between shots, this is good, there is salvo. I could explain to you in a PM/DM how salvo balancing works It is theoratical though. Well, cheers, X3M

1. The demand in the game menu is restored at a constant rate: 1-(11)-2-(7)-3-(4)-4-(4)-5-(3)-6-(3)-7-(2)-8-(2)-9 (the number of months is indicated). When delivering goods, it may occupy intermediate values. 2. The fractional part of the demand number is discarded. Two or more identical plants covered by one station will have the following demand: 1) the fractional part of the number will be discarded 2) the obtained results will be added up (this is the Conversions sheet). Therefore, in the "Conversions" table, values less than 1 will always be equal to 0. The data from the "Cargo" sheet is first summed up, and then the fractional part of the resulting sum is discarded (this is for the towns and cities). Result/max in the game menu: 0.0 / 4; For industry, it's not recovering (demand from the Conversions sheet). For cities, it's recovering (demand from the Cargo sheet). 1.0 / 5; 2.0 / 6; 3.0 / 7; 4.0 / 8; 5.0 and above / 9. 3. Several stations cover a single plant, and the plant's demand is divided equally. For example, if demand is 4.0, and 3 stations are involved, each station will have 4.0/3 = 1 (the fractional part of the number is discarded). 4. Deliver to the station the amount of cargo per year corresponding to the demand number from the Conversions sheet - the demand in the menu will be kept at 3. Deliver twice as much - the menu will maintain a value of 1. Deliver half as much - the menu grows to the maximum (see maximum in paragraph 2). Note: production runs slightly faster than indicated in the menu (1 per year, in the game menu = during a crash it will be 1.1; during a boom it will be 1.6).

thank you very much! I'm enormously grateful to my clinically insanely generous sister, and to Klofkac who enabled us to use all the tiles she whipped up for us at once is it? I had no idea it was only a weird alien world from a dream many thanks! most of the new units don't have lines finished yet, but we've got plenty of placeholders. I'll still be using plenty of lines for more traditional units that were whipped up for the Summers' Solstice campaign, but the new ones are intended to get their own setups. there are even additional 'generic' versions of some takes I've got just for the purposes of other modders who may not refer to the units by the same monikers, like 'laser tank ready to cook' or 'MLRS, death from afar' as opposed to Keravnos or Pyrkagia technically, we only need 12 new lines for any new faction, but... if we do the lines up based on units as opposed to factions, then they're good for any faction. so that was my approach I'd love to! there are quite a few numbers though, and there's a lot to go into! just the Pyrkagia is subject to a multitude of new features, each of which could be its own topic of conversation so, uhh... do you mean unit stats, weapon damage, new warheads, build speeds, costs, new systems like bulk shot or shields, all of the above...? although I included unit stats under a spoiler over in the Summers' Solstice campaign thread, these new units don't really have finalized stats just yet ^^ and the testers over in the Landsraad Discord server have no shortage of feedback! hence not producing a similar section over here just yet. however, umm... included in the zips up there (in the second post in this thread, counting the OP) is a version of the editor capable of reading the debut mission. ctrl + X is the hotkey to bring up the 'structures editor' as seen there, and if you tap F11 and peek at the events, most of the various systems are notated like so: which can offer some insight into what this stuff does, even being unfamiliar with the new events and such Klofkac has developed I invite you to go poking around on your own! if you have any questions about something more specific, I would be happy to answer them I'll be working on it after getting some other stuff sorted. first priority was releasing the tileset so other mappers can mess around. next, I've gotta polish up some new spritework PsYcHo lined up for me (many units in the debut mission have unfinished / unpolished art assets. the Mavrys is considered complete, and the Keravnos just got a new body so that needs work). after that I can do some more mapping and stuff in the meantime though, there's at least this debut mission to showcase the new tileset in all respects! technical, aesthetic, gameplay... it's packaged with the cutting-edge editor over in the second post in this thread none of the testers have reported random crashes, but they have been able to break the map in various ways, and one player today ran into a random crash for unknown reasons. but that might just be related to his machine and not to the debut mission itself; some players get random crashes no matter what d2k mission they're on and just need to save the game on occasion. we dunno why lol, 1998 game voodoo. anyway yeah, although i expect it to be smooth-sailing it's best to save on occasion regardless if you give that debut mission a play, I'd love to know how it goes! any feedback helps polish things up for 'real' missions later

Looks awesome... ... Went back to the start... watched the video... Wow.... Went back to the start again. Read it all. This is a remarkeble work dude!!! Many of us must have dreamt to be able to such a thing like what you did. You got an entire new theme to it all. Although, dark and purple is in these days. Yet, you just did it. My hats of for you. And your sister, she did an awesome job on the tileset etc. I couldn't help, but chuckle at the voice lines. Still, you got your own voice lines. Consider the chuckle as a nod to a job well done! I love to crush numbers. Care to share the stats you are using for your designs? Once you are done with the campaign etc. Would love to play it, if you know what I mean.

Missions: -Added: Starport Struggles - By PsYcHo -Added: Forgotten - By PsYcHo -Arkanon Debut mission - By Fey Tileset: -Arkanon tileset - By Fey Campaign: -Removed: Mercenary campaign By Domaithianus. (duplicated line, It was an incomplete version of "A Secret Plot: Mercenary Campaign" by the same author.

This is a post done for preservation purposes. Name: Starport Struggles Player House: Atreides Game Speed: Fastest preferred It's a mess down there, House Ordos has a massive amount of shipments being delivered to this region. They have the help of the smugglers to make this possible. They've also hired mercenaries to help keep the area secure. If Ordos keeps hold of this region they'll be able to launch large attacks on nearby Territories. We have an Outpost setup in the area to track the shipments so you'll have an early warning system to their arrival. A friendly reminder to build on concrete, the weather hasn't been kind in this region. Objective 1: Destroy all Starports ||| Difficulty differences ||| == Easy: - 15min Frigate Timer - Frigates contain less enemies == Normal: - 12min Frigate Timer - Frigates contain moderate amount of enemies == Hard: - 10min Frigate Timer - Frigates contain large amount of enemies Easy: 100% Production / 25% cheaper costs Hard: 100% Production / 25% more expensive costs The AI gets more aggressive the more frigate waves happen up to a cap. This isn't changed for any of the difficulties Download file: StarportStruggles.zip

This is a post done for preservation purposes. Player House: Harkonnen Game Speed: Any The Atreides have launched an attack against our early warning system. If they take out any outposts they will be able to sneak more enemy troops in undetected. If an Outpost is destroyed expect more enemy resistance. Objective: Eliminate the Atreides from the region. ||| Difficulty differences ||| == Easy: - Enemy reinforcements have less units == Normal: - Enemy reinforcements have normal amount of units == Hard: - Enemy reinforcements have larger amount of units Easy: 100% Production / 25% cheaper costs Hard: 100% Production / 25% more expensive costs =================================== Dev Note: I didn't do anything special for this mission. It was being made cause i wanted to mess with the tileset and try out defense zones. AI doesn't get more difficult during the mission or more aggressive based on difficulty. The only quirk on this map is every outpost you lose the enemy gets more reinforcements. Pretty easy mission this time around. This version should work Forgotten.zip

My notes are sketchy, and I don't have the game at hand, so I suggest opening the map in the game editor and reading the briefing / announcements (events 21, 74, 82, 126, 436, 466). My fuzzy memory is that you must deliver a load or two from your starting territory to a target city on the west coast (e.g. Canada -> Vancouver, US -> SF). Mexico might be inverted (deliver from Cal to Matamoros). Each has a news announcement during the game telling the award and its conditions.

How are transcontinental missions accomplished?

Very cool -- That info could get someone into at least part of the code (perhaps the most interesting part). The "engine" might not crack as easily, and I don't know how that would affect a reverse-engineering project.

The game is written in C++

Waste can make electricity cheaper. Surplus lumber & steel can make rail-building cheaper. Surplus diesel can make fuel cheaper for diesel locomotives. None specifically discount bridges.

A Fuel Rules 1) waste to landfills - will electric locomotive fuel be cheaper? 2) lumber (later cement), steel or diesel - bridges and fuel for diesel locomotives?

o7 godspeed, mate! see ya in the Landsraad, if ya stop by

Hi ! No worries, it's a minor glitch. I've tried with 640*480, but it didn't work:/ Anyway, it's still a pleasure to be able to play this game after so many years ^^ Case closed and thanks a lot!

Open up the map in the editor and copy out the texts of these briefing events: 1: Briefing 7: SP - Goals 21: Transcon Rules 39: Designer's Notes 239: A Fuel Rules 449: Civ War Race Then find help translating them from English

the time has come! https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vjWZ9eoLXpar6STEkWh8i9-ijP7VsRWz/ ^^^ you'll find it under "Atreides" in "All Missions" in the Mission Launcher, as "Arkanon Debut Mission." many thanks to, primarily, Nguyen, Fo-ehn and PsYcHo, for having a look at so many drafts of this debut mission! y'all really helped during the design process details and, if you need them, install instructions below: here's some info about the new guys' roster of units, or at least those that are finished so far, along with VA credits if the units have new voiceovers already that's all for now, guys. although this debut mission is a bit rough around the edges, I hope it proves to be a beautiful show of the new tileset, and a fun play nonetheless. it is NOT designed to be difficult, either, since it's meant to just show new stuff. still, you will find substantial differences between easy, normal and hard. even if it's easier on any of those difficulties than you might expect. enjoy! hopefully!! EDIT 9/30/25: I'm told that the debut mission is a little harder than expected xD at least on hard mode. so, umm... well, here's Nguyen's run from, uhh... today. and some other details about design goals and also a helpful build order in this section ah, I'm rambling. I have spritework to do, so I guess I'll get on with that. this all has merely been some insight into my thought process, I suppose EDIT 10/1/25: some other folks are saying the debut mission is not hard enough fine!! here's a "hell mode" version of the mission for y'all masochists out there then!!! https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kZOtzJr--mwttcEE1aHarocH-A_8X3_j this zip assumes you have the regular game assets in place from the first zip in this post, such as the cutting-edge exe. be sure to download that first! i also tested the first ~20m. seems totally doable to me! so, good luck! https://streamable.com/b8rwm8 https://streamable.com/23vtej i noticed the special weapons were broken due to an oversight in my last round of bug-fixing. that's only in these clips; they work properly in the uploaded draft if you thought easy was too easy or normal was too normal and want a bit more spice without going up to the level of hard in the prior version of the map, you can give them a shot in 'hell mode.' details for that are in this section here there. take it!! take it and like it!! EDIT 10/2/25: updated the regular version of the debut mission with the new sidebar icons, and moved them into their proper places. AK Lasgunners, Lyovros and Diakotns now are represented on the sidebar. this is just a cosmetic change, so... ya know, no worries about redownloading or replaying if you already checked out the map or w/e. just saying. it's the same link at the top of this post the unknown mimicry used by the Imperials doesn't have a sidebar icon yet, so that one's still got a placeholder if you happen to capture an Imperial Heavy Factory please note that if you redownload anyway and have a saved game on the version without the new sidebar icons, I expect that saved game would be broken! moving stuff around on the sidebar involves a mod change!

ah, sorry we didn't see this sooner, mate! aye, old game voodoo. the 'cinematic' part of the map showing up is kinda screwy on modern systems, but the map loads just fine. it's only a cosmetic glitch, so I guess nobody's really looked into it and we're not sure what to do about it there might be a solution if you mess around in the video settings, but definitely take note of what's currently working before messing with those as a side note, that you're seeing those cinematics means you're going through the game exe, yeah? Feda built some lovely extensions for Funky's Mission Launcher application, enabling some very fancy custom campaigns. some which come by default with gruntmods or dunemaster nowadays. and, the Mission Launcher has a dedicated section for the original campaign missions at the top of the "All Missions" page. if you haven't tried going through the Mission Launcher, I'd suggest giving it a look! although it doesn't have those cutscenes or pre-game maps like the original campaigns, perhaps having a broken map screen is a bit more immersion-breaking. if you'd like more info about the Mission Launcher (which you should have by default nowadays, but there's still this thread for it), I'll point ya over here: and if ya got any other questions, I'd invite ya to drop by the Landsraad Discord over here. apologies about the pre-game map issue; wish we knew what to do about that. still, I hope this helps! EDIT: I was just made aware of a potential fix. try running the game in 640x400, the vanilla game's resolution. apparently that solves it? apparently, a friend forgot to up his resolution before playing and accidentally discovered this possibility. what a fortunate coincidence lol

I understand that the map tells a story. I don't speak the language, so they'll skip a lot of messages without understanding their meaning. So I need to know: 1. What tasks lie ahead of me to win? 2. What obstacles await me on the way to completing the tasks?

Which information would help?