Mentat_One's "review" and information is FALSE

[NeoDevilbane]

I just got a reply from KJA... he says Mentat_One's spoiler "reviews" and supposed inside information here : http://dune2k.com/forum/index.php?topic=18063.0 and also here : http://dune2k.com/forum/index.php?topic=18248.0 is false.

KJA says, "Nobody has read a draft of either HUNTERS or SANDWORMS yet, NOBODY -- not our editors, not even my wife.  It

[Egeides]

But they didn't say my review is bunk so there are still aliens in their next books.

[me=Egeides]goes back to his whole with a good book[/me]

[Andrew]

Well, that is good news.

Although the part where they bring back all the old characters (says on the jacket) still makes it a "team atreides f*ck yah!" storyline.

My question is, why is the jacket produced if the book is not ready?

[erjin999]

Or the conspiracy theory: They realised we didnt like the ideas, and are at this very moment rewriting huge parts of the books.  :P

[ordos45]

Or the conspiracy theory: They realised we didnt like the ideas, and are at this very moment rewriting huge parts of the books.  :P

We can only hope.

[Khan]

Either way we win. :D

[Davidu]

You think they are reading what we are writing here?

My, my... they'll be quite dissapointed.

[Dante]

And educated, hopefully.

Guys, if you are reading this, you suck. Please either improve or stop writing. Preferably the latter.

Regarding the first post... Wow, it really looks like someone is on a mission to support the new writers. God, is that what I sound like when I talk about Frank Herbert?

[erjin999]

Maybe you have some justification, in our eyes, at least ;)

[NeoDevilbane]

I'm not on a mission to support the new writers... look at some of my posts and you'll see 75% of them are very much less than positive about their endeavors (and endeavors to come... Junior Fremen Knights isn't far behind, folks, they've said so).

First, I don't like to see them get crap for the wrong reasons. Second -- and most importantly -- Dune 7 (forget about if it's being split into two, three, of ten novels) is the CLOSEST thing ... and from all indications, it's going to be very close, going from a "detailed," "expansive," and "complete" outline ... we'll ever get in our lifetime or any other to a new Frank Herbert novel. And it's not just any Frank Herbert novel... it's the conclusion to a series that's been cliffhung for close to 20 years. Why can no one here look past a little bit of KJA/BH hating to appreciate at least this much?

Forget about the prequels, forget about the Legends of Dune... none of those were outlined by FH and, for all we know, he never intended to write about. Like them or hate them, forget about them -- while they may tell us what kind of writing style or prose to maybe or maybe not expect in Dune 7, they're not relevant to the fact. Every facet of Dune 7 has been outlined and intended to be written by FH... and now will finally be realized.

[Dante]

In some cases, no book is better than a bad book. This is very likely to be one of those times. Better that the series remain indefinately open-ended than be shoehorned into a BH/KJA blasphemy.

Besides which, I still have absolutely no faith that this is what Frank Herbert indended to do with his series.

[erjin999]

Personally I would like to read what happens after the last jump made by the Idaho and his crew.

But thats just my weak will and curiosity !  :-

[MrFlibble]

it's the conclusion to a series that's been cliffhung for close to 20 years.

I, for one, believe that the CH:D ending was not at all insufficient as the end of the story. I think it's perfect. The Golden Path continues, what else to say?

it's going to be very close, going from a "detailed," "expansive," and "complete" outline ...

Every facet of Dune 7 has been outlined and intended to be written by FH... and now will finally be realized.

Again, you put too much faith in the "detailed outline". Despite some controversial statements that I've heard about it - e.g., it was first said (or, at least, I've heard so) that the outline was found among FH's personal belongings in an attic or so. Now it's said the outline was stored in a bank cell...

And even if there really is something, how do you know that "every facet has been outlined"?

EDIT: Another thought of mine. KJA says that this quote proves that FH wanted to resurrect Muad'Dib:

Paul Atreides and his beloved Chani were there. (Oh what that had cost in searching garments of the dead for random cells!) The original Duncan Idaho was there with other Atreides minions-the Mentat Thufir Hawat, Gurney Halleck, the Fremen Naib Stilgar . . . enough potential servants and slaves to people a Tleilaxu universe.

But of we take the quote literally (meaning that the possibilities outlined there are FH's intentions), we may make a conclusion that FH wanted to resurrect all those Dune characters as slaves to Scytale and his Tleilaxu ilk...

[erjin999]

Lets compromise. Realease his notes as they were, original FH works. We can use that to satisfy our needs, if we have them, of course !

How does that sound ?  8)

[MrFlibble]

Heya, that's good. Very good indeed. Everyone's happy then, right?

[Davidu]

That sounds good.

[NeoDevilbane]

Personally I would like to read what happens after the last jump made by the Idaho and his crew.

But thats just my weak will and curiosity !

[NeoDevilbane]

I, for one, believe that the CH:D ending was not at all insufficient as the end of the story. I think it's perfect. The Golden Path continues, what else to say?

Learn who's hunting the Honored Matres, for one, and why.

Again, you put too much faith in the "detailed outline". Despite some controversial statements that I've heard about it - e.g., it was first said (or, at least, I've heard so) that the outline was found among FH's personal belongings in an attic or so. Now it's said the outline was stored in a bank cell...

Huh? Where did you hear that? The outline was very first mentioned, as far as I know, in the afterword kind of a thing at the end of "House Atreides," and it was mentioned found in a then-recently discovered safety deposit box... they've never changed their story, if that's what you're implying. You're probably thinking of the general notes and passages and missing/cut chapters from the Dune novels FH never put in a deposit box that they've mentioned many times as having as resource material on the Dune prequels so far.

And even if there really is something, how do you know that "every facet has been outlined"?

I don't, but "detailed," "expansive," and the key word of "complete" seems to imply something very close to that.

Another thought of mine. KJA says that this quote proves that FH wanted to resurrect Muad'Dib:But of we take the quote literally (meaning that the possibilities outlined there are FH's intentions), we may make a conclusion that FH wanted to resurrect all those Dune characters as slaves to Scytale and his Tleilaxu ilk...

Hey, that may not end up being far from the truth... Mentat_One's "review" is proven as bunk, so we'll have to wait and see what really happens.

[3ngel]

Or the conspiracy theory: They realised we didnt like the ideas, and are at this very moment rewriting huge parts of the books

This would be a bless :D

You think they are reading what we are writing here?

My, my... they'll be quite dissapointed.

If you're reading guys, you greatly s*ck at all.

You could have done books that could insert themselves in the "dune" word, without touching any of the story of Dune (with big D), and no one would have said a word... but no! you wanted to writing something related, in order to feel yourselves kinda important.

And so at this point..... well i've already said what you would do for me :)

[MrFlibble]

Learn who's hunting the Honored Matres, for one, and why.

May I quote:

And the Ones of Many Faces, curse them through eternity, had caused the disaster. Them and their Futars! (p. 21)

Now complete the sentence: "The Ones of Many Faces actually are..."

a) Giant Space Wasps;

b) Horrible Galactic Blobs;

c) Anyone you look at after a pint of moonshine;

d) Face Dancers from the Scattering;

f) Thinking Machines!!!

Now, why do Face Dancers hunt Honored Matres? I guess because they both are rivaling powers. FDs are intelligent, powerful, sneaky and deadly. Ordinary people fear them for a reason. This gives the FDs, along with the Tleilaxu technologies they possess, control over population, or, at least, the possiblity of such control. On the other hand, HMs have their power in fighting skills and, much more important, in sexual bondage they excercise upon men. Thus, here's the point of conflict: both factions, being political powers, pursue control over the population and one another.

Every religious, business and governmental question has the single derivative: 'Who will excersise the power?' Alliances, combines, complexes, they all chase mirages unless they go for the power. (p. 22)

BTW, the enemies of HMs cannot be the machines for the only reason that The Weapon the HMs rely upon ("Our last resort") is a biological weapon, thus not suited to kill non-organic beings.

Another question is how the FDs broke free from their Tleilaxu Masters ???

[3ngel]

Another question is how the FDs broke free from their Tleilaxu Masters

For the same reason the Dune FD puppet priest Tuaek (if i remember correctly the name) assumed an independant personality (see Dune V: the meeting between Tleilaxu,BG and Dune Priests), 'cause he copied too perfectly the original Tuaek. He copied so much he forgot he was a FD.

[MrFlibble]

The FD from Heretics was so perfect at mimicking he (it?) actually became Tuek. Yet the FDs from the scattering retain their shapeshifting abilities but seemingly are the masters of their own.

Probably it was this way: the Tleilaxu sent only a few Masters into the Scattering, accompanied by large numbers of expendable FD servants. Eventually, due to certain circumstances we are not aware of, the Tleilaxu faced a crisis, and only FDs survived it, being much stronger than ordinary humans. Without the Masters to control them, the FDs have become self-dependent and utilized the technological legacy of the Tleilaxu.

[Mahdi]

Ignoring everything but the original topic, thank you Neodevilbane.  I apologize for not making a news post or seeing this earlier.  I will attempt to make a news post sometime in the next week or so, but no garuntees.  I have been very busy recently.

[Colonel_Worf]

I quit paying attention to it the moment I read it. It's just way too obvious.