TMA_1 Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 Throughout the novels, this guy is the backbone and anchor morally throughout everything. This is the connection for us when usually its so weird and out there.lol From what I can see, he is the hero of the whole story. Not paul, or leto II, or anything obvious like that. Sure, they are what the stories are about. How messiahs arent always a blessing for mankind and usually end up being a curse. How they lead us to paths that are needless to say, dangerous. Even with Leto II. though he saved humanity, he fixed what was partly a fault of paul's and just the empire in gneneral. He had to do things that were evil though. No, not those guys. Its Duncan Idaho. He is the one guy that doesnt change. Just think of it, leto turns into this super intelligent (and ultra cool sounding. hehe) inhuman creature. He lost all humanity. Paul as well changed from being a strong leader to in the end, losing his resolve (in my opinion.) and the only real strong characters usually die out. Duncan is always there though. That is why he is the hero of the series for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital Guerrilla Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 Warning contains spoilers about the series (Novels)Duncan was not my hero of the series but I do find his character to be very strong. I think this becomes obvious in 'Dune Messiah' and then again in 'God Emperor of Dune'. In GEoD we see Leto II no matter how many times he kills Duncan to still use Duncan within his empire and IMO admire Duncan to a certain degree. I always wonder how did Duncan felt about these people that kept bringing him back from the dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exatreide Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 IMHO duncan is used as nothing more than a pawn. A pawn by Leto, Paul, Leto II and the Sisterhood. He is not a main character but only a suporting one.Paul was the true cool guy ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMA_1 Posted March 24, 2003 Author Share Posted March 24, 2003 thats not the point though, the hero doesnt always ahve to be successful and victorious. he is the connection for people. a more down to earth figure that we cna feel comfortable with. the hero is the one that you empathize andcare for and who you wish to see victorious. thats my opinion at least. Duncan isnt my favorite character, but he is so important to the whole series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahdi Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 I completly agree. Duncan is the hero of the Dune novels. He is not the protaginist, as some people confuse "hero" with meaning, but he is no doubt the hero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel_Worf Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 I've really grown attached to Duncan. From House Atreides to God Emperor he's a steady, moral presence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunenewt Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 Gurney in my opinion was also a hero as was Miles Teg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 I'd almost be inclined to call him an anti-hero, because he is forced into many of his decisions, either directly from other characters, or through his own morality (his tragic flaw, IMO).Mainly, I see him as a sort of X constant, as you said, TMA. Times change; people (and peoples) change; planets change; but Duncan remains. I think because of this, he acts as a liason between these new universes and the reader. For example, in GEoD, he is given history lessons by the Tlailaxu, but he's still not very "up to date" in Leto II's Empire. Because of this, he asks the questions you can't ask, thus acquiring the answers for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander_Ordos Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Exactly Vanguard, Duncan is like a tool helping you to understand the novel. It's like you view the story from Duncan's eyes. And talking about heroes - each novel had it's own heroe - House Atreides-Corrino, C'tair...oh sorry "not cannon" ::) In Dune-Dune Messiah (Paul), Children of Dune-God Emperor of Dune (Leto II), Heretics of Dune (Miles Teg) and Chapter House: Dune (Darwi Odrade). I think the eternal presence of Duncan Idaho is one of the things, that makes Dune special... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Keep in mind, Alex, that there can be more than one hero/heroine in a story. You could also debate who was the "hero" and who was the "villain". For example: Was LetoII a hero, a villain, or both?Personally, I believe Duncan was the most "heroic" in GEoD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 I think i have an article to the heros in dune..or at least the person talk about heros and how they are bad for people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMA_1 Posted March 26, 2003 Author Share Posted March 26, 2003 I think that Duncan acts as a pillar of normality and a basic set of morals. You can see that in how the fish speakers act. Duncan absolutely hates some of the things they do because to him, they are immoral. He is one of the only guys in the books that holds to identical morals to us reading the books. He also acts as a tool of focus. He is the guy that keeps our memories straight. "this is Dune". I mean near the end with the last books, they are so damn different.(on a side note, isnt it genius how Frank can change a story like that? make it it's own universe.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 I agree - Duncan does not change despite the millenia of time that pass, and so we can often identify with him more than we can the society in which he is placed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acriku Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 It's surprising that his character doesn't change throughout the years, and in the many different environments and situations, makes you wonder how strong his character is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander_Ordos Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 As I have said earlier, we view the new era we're placed in, through Duncan.You know Vanguard, that most "heroes" are called "heroes" after their deaths. "Heroes" are admired for their sacrifice. In most case, and offcourse it's just my opinion ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 A hero doesn't have to die to become a hero. True, many of the soldiers who got the Victoria Cross in WWI never lived to have it pinned on them, but death is certainly not a must.And besides, dead or otherwise, you could still debate that people like Leto II were either a hero or villain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Heroes, in the old sense of the word were certainly heroes when they were alive, and recognised as such by themselves and others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMA_1 Posted March 27, 2003 Author Share Posted March 27, 2003 hmm, could that be why its "the church of the divided God"? evil/righteousness all in one? for leto II that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander_Ordos Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Debating on Leto II as a heroe - He was a heroe, he achieved his golden path through "vile" things, but The Golden path itself, was salvation of humanity :- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brutus Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 Still not understanding... ??? What the heck did Leto II save humanity from!?With everyone saying "Oh yes, he saved humanity!", it sounds like everyone has just been brainwashed by the "propaganda" in the books, saying he saved humantiy, but not really telling from WHAT.*sigh* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 That is what Dune 7 is for maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 LetoII saved humanity from itself. The less cryptic answer is longer.The "pre-Letonian" empire was doomed. People lived under an absolute ruler (or a group of rulers), and humanity was becoming apathetic, like before the Jihad. Leto II saw this, and so he started humanity on the Golden Path.The Golden Path was essentially a 3500 year disciplinary action. Through his iron-fisted rule and restrictions, he forced people to resent existing under a single ruler. When Leto died, the people scattered out into the universe, under their own rule, where people could explore and be free. This saved humanity from "stagnation". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan_ghola Posted April 3, 2003 Share Posted April 3, 2003 i agree, but then again there is miles teg who is even greater than duncan idaho in a few ways Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted April 3, 2003 Share Posted April 3, 2003 Such as? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander_Ordos Posted April 3, 2003 Share Posted April 3, 2003 I'd agree that Duncan and Teg'd be very good friends, but Teg greater :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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