Warlord Ripskar Posted February 25, 2003 Share Posted February 25, 2003 If you read the books it is clear that the Fremen only wear the stillsuits when they leave the seitch. In Children of Dune Leto and his sister check each others suits before they leave the seitch.Also if you compare them to the Bedouin who have very specific customs regarding this sort of thing. If you ever meet a Bedouin NEVER offer them your left hand.They will regard you as someone who eats waste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted February 25, 2003 Share Posted February 25, 2003 In the book there are Fremen-made stillsuits and non-fremen made ones. Would there be any difference in treating the stuff with these 2 types, and considering the non-fremen made ones to be inferior :OYes but those 'museum Fremen' are during the time of Leto II's regin as the God Emperor. In that time the Fremen are not what they were before the coming of Maud'dib.I think he's referring to the inferior stillsuits made at the time. At the Atreides banquet in Dune, there was a stillsuit maker, but it was revealed that these stillsuits were inferior, and that no Fremen would be caught wearing anything but the high-quality Fremen stillsuits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital Guerrilla Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 I thought all of that came from the same thing my mistake. I do remember somewhere in the books about someone making an observation of the Fremen centuries after Maud'dib that is why I was thinking your correction and what I posted before were the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chani Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 This is a really interesting post.. kinda crude, but a good point.I thought about this before too, but I always assumed there must be some kind of pockets for stuff to go in... I never really considered the idea of "smearing"!But I guess Fremen don't eat much... especially in the deep desert so there isn't going to actually be a great deal of watse, so it probably isnt as big an issue as it seems. It wouldn't put them off in battle, cos they probably prepare for battle and go out in "fresh" stillsuits and as likely as not don't just relieve themselves whilst fighting, so they just don't have that as a problem. I agree with the idea that they monitor what they eat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Ripskar Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Or the go Scots style... :O :P ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quoudam72 Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 There is no real explaination because Herbert wrote somethings and never really explained them on purpose I think this is one of those things. We have an idea about the urine waste which would be easy because it is liquid. The problem there lies with the fecal matter which in some cases is in soild form. Kynes says there are pockets in the thigh region of the stillsuit to process this bodily waste. How is soild bodly waste able to get to these regins in the first place? There's something else with how the stillsuits work. The stillsuit is skintight and watertight material almost like scuba diving suit in a way to make a slight comparasion. How is any cooling from evaporation taking place, the stillsuits absorb sweat rather than allow evaporation of the sweat? If the sweat is absorbed it can not give the same effect as evaporation. Fremen be dying of heat prostration correct? Wouldn't the stillsuit need a powersource to distill pure water from salt water. I ask this because of my argument of the absorbing of the water verus the evaporation of the water from the body? I see a hole in all fo this someone correct me if I am wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunenewt Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Is it possilbe to make a working stillsuit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Quondam: "Walking and breathing provide the pumping action". The separation itself could be done with some new material or somthing.Newt: In a word, no. Desalinization and water purification of course is nothing new to us, but they require larger facilities, and would not fit into a skin-tight suit. Well, not comfortable, anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahdi Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Fed, I can reply to some of the stuff you mentioned, but, yes, you have to keep in mind that this is sci-fi and requires some suspension of belief.The stisuit has two layers, not one. Only the outer layer is water proof, the inner layer isn't. The sweat evaporates ont he skin, then condenses betweent he two layers.As for heat, Fremen remained indoors during the day, wehre they did not wear stilsuits, and travelled only by night. It gets very, very cold in a desert at night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quoudam72 Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Vanguard3000 I understand about the 'pumping action of the stillsuit with walking and breathing' there is not question about that. If there is pumping action from such actions then would the soild waste be removed from the anal cavity by the suction action of the stillsuit functions? Do you think this function of the stillsuit is almost like an mild enema? If this function does behave in this manner then I think that the stillsuit wearer has control over the function meaning that if they have a bowel movement the process can be used if they are not having a bowel movement then it is not used. Mahdi you know that I know about the two layers of the stillsuit and that the Fremen stayed indoors during the day but that is not really what I was trying to point out. :)Fed, this is sci-fi and requires some suspension of belief.I have no problem actually with that it is that this particuliar part about the stillsuit (soild waste removal) I can not suspend my belief because there is not even the slightest way to make it work. It is only a story, true. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 Quondam: No, I don't think it would be any kind of suction action. I think that would be harmful to the wearer. And it would just feel wierd.I think we're all guilty of romanticizing the Fremen. Perhaps in order to take a dump, they had to squat and open some wierd valve. Who knows. In any event, keep in mind that, if you've read all the books, you know as much as we do. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 what happens if u shoot a fremen in the ass,will the shit in the stillsuit spill out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital Guerrilla Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 No weren't you paying any attention? He would bleed the soild waste is not kept in any rear pouches near the buttocks. The pouches that contain the soild waste are in the thigh region. Shots fired in the legs may yeild the effect of "shooting the shit out of him" that you desire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 Ok then what happens if the shit spills all over or hits another fremen unconscious?LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital Guerrilla Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 I guess it is safe to say that the unconscious Fremen has been "shitted". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 omg,i forgot to ask......all the way from the beginning......hey arokh,what was that movie u had watched?Note sandwraith:In yr sig,one of the guns of the gunman is not working Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 Quondam, it may help to remind you of the possible use of valves like those in arteries in your imagination of the extraction of the waste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quoudam72 Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 Quondam, it may help to remind you of the possible use of valves like those in arteries in your imagination of the extraction of the waste.Nema your differential view of perception is greatly valued. I just wish that you would not use to so sparsey. Even with the use of valves would the stillsuit not have to have some sort of septic tank like functions? The soild organic sewage would have to be purified by some sort of anaerobic bacteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 Oh, I see.Well, I would agree with you that the same sort of bacteria would be used as we use in our own sewage processing plants today (they tend to produce water as waste - rather useful). Presumably, some desert life will have similar bacteria residing in their digestive system (for the purpose of extracting water from faeces); these could be used by the Fremen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quoudam72 Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 F. Herbert may have not written it out in the novels but he gave enough information on the sources. The Fremen might have shunned technology but they did not shun technological advantages. The stillsuit was a technological advantage against any enemy fighting the Fremen in the Arrakis desert. Here I will give you a little insight about why I say a stillsuit is a technological advantage for the Fremen (and not the most obvious reason). Fremen could not be tracked like you would track a regular enemy. The biggest reason that you could not track Fremen is because they would leave not a trace. If you are tracking your enemy they leave traces of their whereabouts. Fremen could urinate and defacate without it giving away which direction they were traveling or if they were even in the area. This is offtopic but not by too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted March 3, 2003 Share Posted March 3, 2003 what happens if the shit spills out during their melee battle and they subconsciously rub it and whack the shit on their opposition? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted March 3, 2003 Share Posted March 3, 2003 Can you not ask pointless, immature questions, please? I know this whole thread is pretty... erm... strange, but you're just being rude for the sake of being rude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahdi Posted March 3, 2003 Share Posted March 3, 2003 The fremen are no more anti-tech than the rest of the imperium, they jsut have extremely limit resources. When it comes to water, though, they are incredibly sophisticated, developing things such as the water-sclae, which is incredibly accurate, and the material it is made of is more advanced than any in the common empire when it comes to non-stick properties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowzeewee Posted March 3, 2003 Share Posted March 3, 2003 how come fremen is so interested in water,killing their opponents for their water.......why?Is it becaude the water is the urine/shit compressed-excessed water of the opponents?Sorry for being rude :-[ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard3000 Posted March 3, 2003 Share Posted March 3, 2003 DR: Have you read the book? The Fremen live on a planet so dry that a single drop of water is precious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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