nemafakei Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 We're baack to repeating ourselves, now...The terrorists cannot easily attack anyone except the civilians. Hitting the IDF won't have much effect. The only way to do anything is to attack civilians.Besides, "in order to frighten Israeli citizens" - what do you think the occupation of palestine did to the innocent civilians there (apart from kill them etc.)"We don't decimate palestinian towns""10%... in Jenin"(near top of page)Decimated means one in ten destroyed.And how and why would the refugee camp be booby-trapped?Don't say 'to make it look like a massacre' I do not believe that palestinians would bomb each others buildings to score publicity points with... who?"If though a building holding terrorists inside Tel-Aviv would have been full of bombs"How would these bombs have been detonated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acriku Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 The US government has to take into account the media's opinion because that is what people believe. And to be as powerful as She is, She would have to be portrayed in a certain way. But if they truly really definitely cared that much about the media, they would just order the media to say what they want them to say, which they don't (atleast not to most ;)). And our national security is always at a risk of being breached, and the government must act upon that, and do whatever they can do take the threat out. Sorry, but that is what real life is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiroko Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 10% of the refugee camp in Jenin was destroyed it a much smaller area then you think it is.Obviously this boobytraps weren't meant to destroy buidlings but to kill IDF soldiers. Very legit in my opinion to plant bombs, but it is these bombs that destroyed a large part of civilain buildings. When meeting a bomb in the middle of a fight, the prefered method is simply shooting it.It's sad you don't distinguish between terror and military actions. Terror means putting civilian terror as your main goal. None of the IDF operations ever did such a thing.And by the way, the palestinians profited a lot from Israel conquering the territories which meant palestinians could work in Israel and profit from it.The situtation in the territories detiriorated since the riots since now palestinians are not allowed to work in Israel (Not for spite, but because it helps terrorists and because some workers were collecting intelligence).Not to mention that tourism in the territories prospered and the palestinian casino that was very popular (Since gambling is illegal in Israel).anyway, gone for 14 days, so I won't be responding for some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Usul Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 The US government has to take into account the media's opinion because that is what people believe. And to be as powerful as She is, She would have to be portrayed in a certain way. But if they truly really definitely cared that much about the media, they would just order the media to say what they want them to say, which they don't (atleast not to most ;)). And our national security is always at a risk of being breached, and the government must act upon that, and do whatever they can do take the threat out. Sorry, but that is what real life is.The government (in any western country not just the USA) does control the media. Even if it doesn't actually say what to/not to put in the media knows what they want so puts that. Ever heard of Noam Chomsky, that's his philosophy and also why you have probably never heard of him. Read the sig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acriku Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Have you ever heard of free speech? The US media (local, not CNN or MSNews etc) practices it and says basically whatever they want. One down here in Orlando called Channel 9 News has said things against the government before, so you think the government wants them to say that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Usul Posted April 28, 2002 Share Posted April 28, 2002 Ok so there are exceptions but that is what the mass media is like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted April 28, 2002 Share Posted April 28, 2002 "Very legit in my opinion to plant bombs"Hmph."Terror means putting civilian terror as your main goal"So your point is what, exactly? The way I see it, Sharon  is no less a terrorist (even if individual IDF people aren't) than Hamas."palestinians are not allowed to work in Israel "Hm... not a brilliant idea. A basque or a N Ireland man could work in anywhere in Europe... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vidiware Posted April 29, 2002 Share Posted April 29, 2002 Terror is bad, Israel is bad, Palestina is bad... Every one is bad... Cant we all be friends? Thats a good idea! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordos45 Posted April 29, 2002 Author Share Posted April 29, 2002 "What will you call the USA's war on Afganistan?" Â A cofnlict, just like Vietnam was called. Â And not all Americans support Bush, or bombings.Why are we there? Â Simple, revenge. Â Its simply to show you push the most powerful country on Earth (arguably) that we push back harder. Â Pathetic isn't it?If government controlled the media here we wouldn't be able to get pictures of death in other countries, we wouldn't know North Korea is as bad as Hitler's regime was, and we would not be able to call our leaders pieces of bull****. Â We do, trust me I hear it all the time ont he news on TV and radio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gobalopper Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 http://www.washtimes.com/world/20020501-5587072.htmInteresting article/news on what happened in Jenin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcel71 Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 Darn Goba,This message gives me flash back from the Bosnian War were 2.000.000 (stated  ::)) Bosnians were killed, and no Serbian causalties  :-/If there's a propaganda machine... America is the owner..And be honest. Does America support Israel or the Palastinians? This means that the public opinion about Israel should be possitive. That can't be done when Israel killed lots of innocent people!! So another lie by the propaganda machine  :'( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_1957000/1957862.stmThis analyses the situation in Jenin also...An extract:"Water and electricity was cut off to the town. That is a fact, it cannot be denied, and that is a crime "Now that's hardly accidental damage to civilians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordos45 Posted May 2, 2002 Author Share Posted May 2, 2002 "And be honest. Does America support Israel or the Palastinians?"Well that can get confusing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gobalopper Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 As a government I think the US supports Israel but then again that probably has a lot to do with a lot of powerful people lobbying for support of Israel. What the US really wants is a stable Middle East for oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acriku Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 Of course Gob, no oil = economic disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tag Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 >>>no oil = economic disaster<<<While I agree with Gob that the United State's primary interest in the middle east is its oil reserves, I think the reasoning behind that interest is a little less severe than is suggested.The fact is is that fossil fuels are a cheap energy source and to a country that accounts for 1/3 of the world's requirements, cheap energy is a very good thing. Â It's for that reason that the US is so interested in maintaining stability in the Middle East. Â The Spice, after all, must flow.Were the cost of fossil fuels to rise, however, while there may be a brief episode resembling that of the early 70s, the technology exists that the US would be able to adapt and thrive under the new conditions. Â To name a few minor, incomplete examples, there would be greater development in coal and nuclear electricity production, fuel efficient cars would enter the mainstream, greater research would be put into fusion power and orbital solar sattelites, and Volkswagon would introduce the *new* Rabbit. Â The Organisation of Petrolium Exporting Countries realises this fact and in order to keep its biggest customer, maintains a low cost on fuel.Now, for those of you curious as to how the United States forms its policy, here's a major factor: cost effectiveness. Â As an example of one of the purest capitalist economies in the world, America will more often than not sway to whatever option is least expensive. Â Various special interest groups may hold great influence for certain periods in time but the desire to spend less and gain more is shared by all capitalists regardless of race, gender, religion or any other categorisation.--Bashar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vidiware Posted May 12, 2002 Share Posted May 12, 2002 Why dont all be friends and be happy together? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted May 12, 2002 Share Posted May 12, 2002 Ugh.... I've just had a really bad d Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardauker-Kirov Posted May 12, 2002 Share Posted May 12, 2002 Alot of post's are bit useless lately. Besides, can't someone lock this thread. Its already discussed months ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemafakei Posted May 13, 2002 Share Posted May 13, 2002 It's a little slow, because Shiroko is only here once a fortnight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiroko Posted May 26, 2002 Share Posted May 26, 2002 I'm here now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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