Pax Americana

[Edric O]

This is a topic to discuss politics and warfare, free of the usual moral judgements. Please refrain from calling anything good or bad.

Now, let us look at the current political situation of the world. Seeing how easily Iraq was dispatched, there can be no doubt now that any military opposition to the United States is doomed to be crushed and annihilated. The USA has de facto control over the entire world. The last time anything of this sort happened, it was the Roman Empire in the position of having complete control over the entire (known) world. It was the period known as the Pax Romana. Now, we are witnessing the beginning of the Pax Americana. That is not to say that we are heading for a period of absolute peace. Just like the Pax Romana before it, this will be a period of short, scattered conflicts in which the universal empire of the time uses its military superiority to crush weak and disorganized enemies.

Clearly, open war on the US is nothing short of suicide. As such, the only form of conflict which stands any chance of success against the US is terrorism. Terrorism is the poor man's war. And, all moral issues left aside, it is a very effective psychological weapon. In the modern world, there are no such things as non-combatants. This has been a state of fact ever since World War 1, perhaps even earlier. Killing the other side's civilians was (and still is) an integral part of warfare. Terrorism will be with us for as long as the Pax Americana lasts.

So, what are your own views on present-day politics and warfare? Remember - leave all moral issues aside.

[Acriku]

Being morally inept so-to-speak, terrorism is surprisingly effective. But, the retaliations for the said terrorism would be much worse. One man blows up a cafe in the New York street, the nation destroys the backbone of the terrorist organization. Also, means of interrogation can be used when the man is captured (the operator of the terrorist act), and wreak even more havoc on the organization. So, if the terrorist recognizes the consequences for his actions (read above), he may not even do it. But, then again he would try to do anything to hurt the big bad wolf. Of course, terrorism may take another level, if the leaders realize a more effective approach. Cyberterrorism, for example. A power country built off of electricity, take away the electricity or manipulate the electricity, and what is the power country now?

[The_Sadukar]

you konw what yesterday I thought that this must be the begnnig of Pax Americana (the american peace), I'm just wondering how long there is left before the barbarians shows up.

[Acriku]

As long as we have the open border policy, they will always show up.

[Warlord Ripskar]

Last time it happened was the Roman Empire?

I take it you missed the lesson on the Spanish Empire and British Empire?

[Anathema]

He meant that the Roman empire was the only big player around. I think...

Seeing as how China and Russia can both fry the United States with the push of the button, they won't dare to perform any militairy action against them. SDI is still without any significant progress, and likely won't be completed anyway. I think that the next century will be in the light of another cold war between China and the United States, and that the US will use the same tactics of containment, the middle east being the playing field. Terrorism will IMO always exist but never have a big part in all this.

[Edric O]

Warlord, neither the Spanish nor the British ever had this kind of absolute control. They were always challenged by some other imperial power. And they had powerful enemies to fight against. The USA has none.

[nemafakei]

The 'Pax' started about a decade ago.

And what happened to the Roman Empire will happen again.

[Edric O]

Yes, the USA is already very similar (politically speaking) to the Roman Republic... Note that I said "Republic". The Empire comes a little later.

P.S. By the way, I'm leaving on a trip to Predeal (a nice mountain tourist resort) for 3 days. I won't be back until Monday, so don't expect to see me around any more until then!

[Gobalopper]

Three big differences, the US is a democracy and in 4 years the government could completely change. Just look at the differences between Bush and Clinton.

Second global trade. Now that everyone is connected through trade and countries rely on eachother I don't think any of the big powers, US, China, UK, Russia, etc would attack each other. Smaller countries might pose problems but there aren't many of those.

Third, MAD.

[Edric O]

Note that the Roman Republic was a democracy as well.

[Gobalopper]

The same type of democracy we have today though?

[Digital Guerrilla]

No I would have to agree not the same form of democracy.

[Egeides]

Gob: The type of democracy we have today is of roman blood: a mass of people on wellware doing nothing, the more you go up the social ladder the richer in an exponential curve, the top 500 having more than 80% of the poorests, control of politics by those with money and influence...

The name given to a system says only little. All modern countries are calling themselves democracy, and eny state able to do so publicly is seeking for this title. But as there were different types of republics, there are different types of democracies.

[Gobalopper]

It doesn't matter the form of democracy, what I'm saying is that within 4 years you can have a new gov't with a completely different focus on world affairs. Look at Clinton's actions compared with Bush. Clinton fired a few missiles, Bush liberated a country. Clinton reduced the military, Bush is strengthening it.

[Digital Guerrilla]

Emperors regined presidents only serve but that makes a difference as Gob pointed out about the American democracy that changes the nature of politics from each president's term to the next unless that president serves 2 terms.

[Caid Ivik]

EdricO, I have read about thousand of articles named "Pax Americana". With same point - good republic feeling threatened slightly becoming an evil Empire. But the times have changed. Terrorism cannot destroy USA, just wound it and pain from it is very bad thing. Rome stayed against threats of uncivilised military powers led by lust for pure food. And there was no counter-force like Russia, China or other nuclear might. And the most important: euroamerican civilisation has proven that they are too deeply influented by laws of democracy.

[Egeides]

A democracy that has some elements able to hide some of its potential ruler behind fame and PR (=$) may be able to push some leaders to power before some others. The one who comes only with populist ideas will have a very hard time. We can see that parties have a close correlation with money they receive. If it wasn't paying back, why would companies spend millions in lobbying? Thus some politicians have more chances.

[Caid Ivik]

If today's system is economically good for them, why would they try to change it? Corporations can overtake the government - but that would take most of their concentration from market to ruling.

[Acriku]

Because some people think their views are right, and will morph the country into their way.

[Davidu]

Don't worry... After the US there will be another power to take it's place... As after the Roman Empire, in some houndreds years the Empire of Karl the Great appeared.

I just wish we won't nuke ourselves out until then.

[Caid Ivik]

Karl the Great became an emperor in Rome ::)

[Warlord Ripskar]

The British Empire was unchallenged from Waterloo to 1914.

The Spanish weren't challenged till the Armada.

[Egeides]

The question is what will challenged USA next? Don't forget, it can also juste be another empire...

The asian countries (China, India, Japan...) will have more difficulties getting energy (oil here) so will see their economies slow down. Europe is pretty nice for its size, but it doesn't have as much population, local ressources, etc. It also has a huge immigration from the arabic and african world.

Can Asia + Europe really overcome and be a second "power"? Maybe it'll have to go like the roman empire and wait to get crumbled?... Would it get crumbled enough to become inefficient? I mean... even if the state would fall, its independent corporations (what forms the empire) would still be there...

[emprworm]

"The USA has de facto control over the entire world."

THank goodness it wasn't Hussein that had this control.

Of all the nations on earth....one will always be the most powerful. Right now, the US has the most power. I am so thankful to GOD that it wasn't Hussein that had that power. If I had to choose a nation to give all the power of the US to, I would choose the US. They do not use their power to conquer. If HUssein had the US's power, or Romania had the US's power, the entire asian continent would be under a dicatorial empire. World soon to follow.