How will humans reach the planets?

[TMA_1]

What kind of engine and co mputer technologies will we need to get to the inferior and superior planets and their moons? also how could we make it possible and somehow faster to reach the closest stars to us?

[IxianMace]

Well it is quite clear to me that we (as a species) can not go continue to depend upon fossil fuels as our main source in energy in daily life. We are using it up much more quickly than it can regenerate, and sooner or later we'll run out of it. Not only that, but if we continued to use rockets to reach planets, it would take so long that the spacecraft would be limited to battery operated drones/probes, or if there was a crew they'd have to be put in some sort of hibernation to survive the extrememly long journey time to their destination. I have no idea how long it would take to reach the nearest star (which I think is Alpha Centauri), but if we used rockets I'm sure it would take something like a million years to reach it, at the speeds that rocket power can offer. Since stars are so far away, we'd probably have to turn to some sort of engine that can give us enough propulsion to get as close to the speed of light as possible, if not faster. Even at light speed, it would still take a few years to reach stars, depending on how far they are. At this point, I would say it would be far too early for space travel over distances between stars/planets to be practical for people. What we need is an energy source that is more efficient, that can be re-used, and that offers much more power than what we currently have for todays' technology.

Computer technology may perhaps come in the form of advanced navigation systems that will enable spaceships to automatically navigate through the cosmos by themselves, while their human occupants hibernate (this is if the journey is going to take a long time, a long time being in excess of a few years) and it should be able to wake them up when the journey is almost complete. These computers would have to be very reliable, because these are human lives we're talking about, and if there was one minor glitch in the calculations for the journey, or the computer somehow failed to wake up the occupants of the spacecraft (or if it just had one small failure in general), then the results could be disastrous. Personally, I wouldn't trust my life with a machine if I had another choice. :-

[Edric O]

Fusion engines, ion engines, solar sails... you name it! :)

In any case, we need something that can produce enough power to allow us to move faster, instead of always using Hohmann transfer orbits like we do now...

One thing that is of vital importance is to separate any trip into 2 stages:

1. Getting up to a spaceport facility in Low Earth Orbit. This can be done a number of ways, but the basic requirement is that we use a vehicle that does NOT need to carry its fuel on-board.

Examples: Space Elevators, Mass Drivers, Laser-acceleration devices ("beam riders"), etc.

2. Getting from the LEO spaceport to wherever we want to go. This is where the true spaceships come in. They can be true spaceships now, because they won't need to take off or land on Earth (such a maneouver requires far too much energy).

[TMA_1]

yeah I agree with that. I think that though if we come up with some sort of cold fusion so we could use just water or some other easy medium for propulsion or even use a primitive form of anti matter propulsion which would be very good because of the pure energy it expends, by containing it in an electro magnetic field and then pumping matter within the bubble in short bursts, though it is probably much more complicated than that lol I think it would shorten time to reach from one place to another bigtime. Also Plasma engines would be great because they would use electicity to run and again powered by some sort of fusion without the need of fission. If it could shorten time a lot, than maybe it could be possible to make multigenerational ships that are huge and could accomidate life through botanical means. blah blah. I think that could somehow work maybe. Not sure though but I think it is important to experament with space and technology having to do with it.

And to add since I saw edric's post. I agree totally that we need to start building ships in space. A LOt of money would be saved and it would be the true advent of "space" ships. It would work best and be cheaper that way.

[Edric O]

I was talking about travel within our own Solar System. Travelling to the stars is simply not possible given our current scientific knowledge. It may be possible in the future, but for now we have a whole Solar System to explore and colonize!

That is, of course, if we decide to actually get our lazy butts off Earth... right now it seems no one cares about space exploration any more. :-

[TMA_1]

not with multigenerational ships. Basically making a small planet that moves at decent speed.lol take a long long time but hey, it could work. again its not science but its good to think about. Yes it IS definately possible to go to the moons of Saturn and Jupiter. Also to Mars and the like. Its just the fact that we really dont place a lot of money onto space programs, and when we do it goes towards studying space through stations in orbit around earth or the space shuttle and what not. I personally think more exploring is needed with probes and human life. If you take humans out of the equasion, it just seems a bit more cold. Something about humans exploring, risking their lives for places and things nto s een by the naked eye... just seems important to me.

[IxianMace]

Yes, but taking into consideration human life itself, and the effects of space travel on people over long periods of time, don't you think that people would get lonely, or start going crazy at the thought of spending several years or more with just the same other people (perhaps 5-8 more in their crew) inside a small spacecraft just for the purposes of exploring? It would take a very special and dedicated group of people to overcome the 'phobia', if you like, to actually be able to send humans out into deep space over long periods of time, and keep them sustained and healthy at the same time, both physically and emotionally. I'm not sure what the effects of spending long durations of time in space with the same group of people will have on a person, from a pyschological perspective, but I do know that they will need to maintain regular exercise to prevent their muscles from atrophying. It may just get plain boring waiting to arrive at the destination, unless they're all asleep and will be woken up when the time is right, somehow.

[Caid Ivik]

Curve the space. When Muhammad can't go on mountain, the mountain must go to him. It's so hard? ;D

[Edric O]

We could do that, Caid, but it requires more energy than the output of the entire Universe. So we have a small problem... :)

[Dunenewt]

BTW (Kinda off topic) Did you know that the 4th planet from the star closest to us (Alpha Centuari B) i s supposedly the homeworld of House Ecaz

[sneezer3]

I heard some preety good ideas on how we might be able to get an engine to working.

We could make i think its called an ion engine. and start out moveing really slow then get to moveing faster and faster untill finely your moveing preety fast! and there is another problem! no breakes! Everbody buckle up and don't let your eyeballs fall out / ;D :O :O

Another idea is to get some kind of laser guided stytem and shoot them further and further away. untill there at there target. But yet again there is the problem of not geting back. and energy. the amout of energy it would take to do this i hear it about 3 times all of the energy on the earth all togather.

And another idea. is to get some kind of bomb and blow it up ad the back then it would hopefully get to moveing faster and faster.

[Anathema]

Traveling to planets in our system is possible, and colonising them too. Interstellar travel isn't possible (unless you are willing to wait millenia :) ) because you need more and more energy to increase speed, and it is impossible to reach let alone exceed light speed.

[TMA_1]

no no what I meant about multigenerational ships is that they could be mammothly huge. thousands of peopel could go onto the ship and procreate and grow. Huge acres of plantlife could sustain the people with oxygen as long as things are kept safe from bacteria or fungi. It would take a hell of a long time but if you create something that c ompletely mimics a planet to travel across the stars, than it would be possible I bet. Now traveling in the solar system is very possible and in my opinion, very beneficial.

[IxianMace]

If you're talking about a fully self-sustaining internal environment that is regulated inside one massive space ship, then that would take LOTS of management and require very careful regulation indeed. The propulsion system on the spaceship would have to be quite impressive as well. Since the space ship would be so big, and contain so much inside it, that would mean it has a great mass right? That would produce problems as far as space junk is external objects is concerned. It would be attracted easily to large masses like Jupiter, or it may attract small asteroids that will collide with it and damage it. Therefore, some sort of safety measure must be considered to account for all possible problems. A ship of this kind is certainly impossible, since it would require immense raw materials and probably even global co-operation in the planning and resources that will go into it. At this stage, Earth is still divided into separate countries. I might be asking a bit much here, but until we can work together as a species, I doubt we'll get much done. But let's not get off topic here. This ship, being massive as it is, would presumably not travel very fast eh? So you'd be transporting a massive amount of content from one place to another over a time span of perhaps several millenia. :O That's if the ship actually makes the voyage as well, parts do wear out, and if resources need to be self-sustaining, then the ship would have to be somehow maintained using the old materials that are worn out and recycled, a technology that I don't think we have at present, since it would have to be 100% efficient.

[TMA_1]

I would never use impossible. Though I do agree with you its highly improbable that it would work well.

[IxianMace]

When I said 'impossible' I was thinking of the present status of the level of co-operation between people on Earth at the moment, and what sort of human co-operation it would take to build a ship of that calibre. I mean, at this rate, we won't get much done. I find it frustrating how people can not work together to achieve something that will benefit them all. Even if their lives depended on working together with other people they would probably still try to save themselves. IMO it's human nature, and it must be changed if we are to reach the stars. Otherwise, we'll be locked in eternal conflict on Earth until we destroy ourselves. :P

Of course, who knows what the future holds? (Paul Atreides maybe? LOL! ;D) Technology advances, and hopefully society will evolve into a more intelligent interactive society that can work more efficiently as a species. There is no point having the latest technology if you can't utilize it to its full benefit.

[Digital Guerrilla]

With the space elevator what about the idea of nanotubes. NASA was at one point working on this type of project.

[sneezer3]

not with multigenerational ships. Basically making a small planet that moves at decent speed.lol take a long long time but hey, it could work. again its not science but its good to think about. Yes it IS definately possible to go to the moons of Saturn and Jupiter. Also to Mars and the like. Its just the fact that we really dont place a lot of money onto space programs, and when we do it goes towards studying space through stations in orbit around earth or the space shuttle and what not. I personally think more exploring is needed with probes and human life. If you take humans out of the equasion, it just seems a bit more cold. Something about humans exploring, risking their lives for places and things nto s een by the naked eye... just seems important to me.

That will never happen. besides if man ever got into outter space there would be beer cans floating around everwhere. along with space junks etc.

And btw. the people before noahs flood probbly went into outter space. and they where wicked and look what happend to them.

[Edric O]

Space enginner Robert Zubrin raised a very interesting problem in his book "Entering Space": Humanity always needs to grow. Throughout our history, we have always explored and colonized new lands. We always went further and further... until now.

By not going into space, we are restricting one of the things that make us human: our curiosity. Like ancient Egypt or medieval Japan, we close ourselves to the outside world:

"We are the world. We have discovered everything that was worthwhile discovering, did everything that was worth doing. We have no need for anything from outside"

That is how they thought. And that is how WE think now as well. Civilizations that follow this philosophy inevitably fall into chaos and are utterly destroyed.

Now you might argue that our situation is different, because there are no other people outside Earth, so we have no "others" to get in contact with. That is correct, but irrelevant. Humans always need to EXPLORE. We need to "go where no one has gone before" just to keep our sanity!

[Edric O]

And btw. the people before noahs flood probbly went into outter space. and they where wicked and look what happend to them.

That doesn't make sense. If they were space-faring, the flood wouldn't have killed them off! Besides, nothing about going into space is ever mentioned in the Bible.

But let's NOT turn this into yet another religion thread. We have plenty of those, ok?

[Anathema]

So we go to another planet, terraform it and then destroy it too like we're destroying the Earth? That's the general idea?

Besides, there's plenty on Earth to discover. Namely, oceanic depths.

[Edric O]

Seeing as how that "other planet" was barren and lifeless to begin with, I see no problem in doing anything we want with it. It's just a ball of rocks and dust before we get there!

As for the Oceanic depths... what, do you want us to pollute those too? I say leave the Earth alone!

Space is big enough for anything we want to do. :)

[Anathema]

Space is big enough? Try saying that in 1,000 years when all planets are colonised and everybody's whining because of the lack of space :-

[Edric O]

That's just the Solar System you're talking about. There are billions more like it!

The time it would take us to colonize and fill the entire Universe is less than the time until the end of the Universe. So we'll never have the time to fill it all up. :)

[VigilVirus]

Space is big enough? Try saying that in 1,000 years when all planets are colonised and everybody's whining because of the lack of space :-

Ummm... what are you talking about? According to popular belief, the Universe is infinitely large.