The Binladenian Jihad

[Edric O]

I just thought of this name for the war that started. :(

I hope Bin Laden doesn't hate thinking machines, 'cause I'm not sure if the US can win this. :( Remember it's Afghanistan we're talking about. Impossible to conquer.

[quoudam72]

I wish I had thought of that Edric that's a good one even if no one outside of the Dune circles will get the joke. Still clever insight on the humor.

[Klobbersaurus414]

I feel the US can defeat any army in existance. However, we are not fighting another army. We are fighting geurilla extremists. The Taliban will fall, but the war against terrorism will never be completely won.

[thomas]

at my school the drama kids do a haunted house and we are going to have bin laden in an electric chair ;) ;) :D

[alphabeta4000]

usa will probably kill bin laden but will suffer heavy losses and then get attacked by some one else

[exatreide]

Well  we have already decimated the talibans AA weapons some of ther fuel dumps ,airports,tanks ect. if we find bin laden i dont think we will hunt him down. we will just use some bunker buster bombs on him. but Iran,Iraq, and Jorden are suspected of having more terrorists. if this turns out to be a long ground war ,we will lose some of are mid-east suport. Pakistan,Sadi Arabia,Uzbeckistan  ect.. will get tired of us and either join the terrorits or become nutral. This verry well could become a Veitnam of the 21 centery.

[Digital Guerrilla]

Now that China has agreed to help the USA will that effect the ground war? I mean just what is China's role supposed to be? China already has a problem with terrorist themselves. Are they going to give some type of intelligence on the activity of the terrorists cell in parts of Asia? And Tawian and China are still disputing Tawianian independence well atleast Chins is. If key areas of central Asia are not met with resolve as well as the Middle East this will go on with even more bloodshed.

[Timsvs]

how many countries are involved now?

[exatreide]

to many

[nemafakei]

The US is just taking out its anger on Afghanistan. The Taliban has been helped (by monetary means) by Bin Laden, and so they feel indebted to him. Afghanistan did not send planes into the towers. Al-Kaida supporters did. This is not the job of blunt force. As the Harkonnens couldn't win against the fremen with their brute aggression, the US cannot beat the terrorists.

[exatreide]

we must win this war. to lose would be like losing to nazi germany. This no veitnam . we just cant pull are men from the beach and say 'the wars over we lose oh well'. these people atacked america. this has not bene done since the war of 1812.whats next? The perimends? the golden gate bridge? the great wall of china? we cant let them do this. dont you people understand? we are not fighting aginst teareny we are fighting for are very fredom. Not just americas freedom but the worlds freedom. we must show these terrorits that we will not go quietly into the night. we must draw the line here.

[thomas]

ahmen ex ahemen now lets send these b@st@rds to he!! !

[Gobalopper]

Ex makes a good point. You have to do something, the US can't just sit there and not do anything after they were attacked it would make them look like an open target for more such attacks.

At least with this method they are sending a clear message that if you attack us you pay the price.

[Digital Guerrilla]

Ex does make a good point about the terrorists. Also if the USA is going after terrorists get them all. It has to be done before anything can come out of the Middle East that is productive.

[Mahdi]

Just a note to Ex's comments about 1812:  The N. American portion of this war was in fac a result of American agression, as they wanted to become an imperical power and thought the best way to do it would be to capture Canada and Florida.

Also, the American population has been attacked, not only at Pearl Harbour, but the Japanese also captured and held a chunk of Alaska for about 18 months.

[nemafakei]

All taken, but if it wants to fight terrorists, is it going to bomb northern Ireland and the Basque country? I think not.

[Mahdi]

Hey Nema, I posted a fictional press conference I found a couple weeks ago that you might find interesting.  It's title is news bulletian or something along those lines.

[exatreide]

Yes if we have to we will.  this is no war on the middle east but a war on terrorisem. is the IRA a terrorist orginaztion? i think so. so they can either begen peace talks or face the rath of the world.

[Mahdi]

So Ex, that mean you are going to support a carpet bombing of Boston?  

[nemafakei]

In fact there are very few (i.e 0) countrues without any terrorists in them. What happens when all the western countries get blown up? I think that someone (Bush or Blair) would start to draw the line once all the third world is taken out, and of course further prove their hypocrisy.

Interesting use of the first person there, Ex. Do I take it you will be joining in with the genocide in all countries which contain terrorist groups?

[exatreide]

no i wont. Just  becouse i suport milatry action aginst terrorists, dose not mean i suport the carpet bombing of inicint civilians.

[Mahdi]

You don't support the deaths of innocent civilians, but you support the current bombings of Afghanistan?

You do know that they've taken out one hospital and killed an unknown number of civilians in the bombings, right?

And that due to there bombings, 3 million innocent Afghans are going to die of starvation?

[exatreide]

Hey! How many times must i tell you that i dont condone the act of killing civilians. Its not due to the bombing that those people will starve its due to the Taliban. They beat the un aid workers and colect the food from the civialns, while saying we poison the food. also the Taliban has no prof that we bombed a hospital. just becouse they show a pile of ruble dose not mean we made it, there are piles of ruble evrewhare. Ok what do you think we should do?  Leave the terrorists alone while they grow in power? What are you going to do wene they get weapons of mass destruction? let them use it on the citys of the world? We must sop them here. we cant alow them to grow in power.

[Mahdi]

"Its not due to the bombing that those people will starve its due to the Taliban. They beat the un aid workers and colect the food from the civialns, while saying we poison the food."

Ex, you've got to stop listening to only the stuff they teach you in school and learn in a two-minute clip of a press conference on the news.  Start looking at stuff yourself.

1)  The reason 3 million Afghans are going to starve to death is becasue the bombings are preventing humanitarian aid from entering Afghanistan (730 tons of food a day I do believe), not because some Taliban goon beat a couple workers up.  And, if I remember correctly, the only humanitarian workers who have been botherd by the Taliban are the ones who were arrested for trying to convert people to christianity, not becasue they were giving people food.

2)  Yeah, they've threatened to poison the supplies the states are dropping and blame it on the US.  You know what?  The drops wree nothng more than propoganda in the first place.  They were sending 37,000 DAILY rations of peanut butter and jelly to Afghanistan.  Lets do a little math:

37000 does not equal 3-4 million

Then they are just DAILY rations.  Which means the next day they will be starving again.

The drops are jsut as much propoganda as the leaflets they dropped, which is pretty funny cause most Afghans are illiterate, and hows to say they can understand the symbols they put ont he leaflets?  

"also the Taliban has no prof that we bombed a hospital. just becouse they show a pile of ruble dose not mean we made it, there are piles of ruble evrewhare."

!) The pentagon admitted they hit a hospital.

2)  There are alway's going to be civilian casualties.  ALWAYS.  No technology exists that can take out only military personel.  You can't trust Taliban numbers on civillian deaths, but you can't trust American either.  Not only would it be bad propoganda wise to say they just killed a couple hundered civilians, but they do not know if they've killed any civilians or not.  They don't send people to count the bodies and check if they are wearing a uniform or not.

"Leave the terrorists alone while they grow in power?"

Ex, if the terrorists had power we'd be in a hell of a lot better situation than we are now.  Because then they'd be able to engage in typical set-piece battles and we could wipe them off the face of the earth.  

Terrorism is the tool of the weak.  War is the tool of the strong.

Besides, you could kill every single member of terrorist organizations in the world, and they'd just grow up all over again.

"What are you going to do wene they get weapons of mass destruction? "

How do you know they don't have them already?

Even if they don't, they will someday.  If its not Bin Laden, it'll be some other terrorist organization.

Most likley, if they do get them and use them, I'll be having two-headed, three-legged goat children.  Or maybe I'll die a gruesome death as biological agents shut down my imune system...

btw, you do know that chemical and biological weapons are considered weapons of mass destruction don't you?  A needle with some small pox, and they've got one.

"We must sop them here. we cant alow them to grow in power."

Can't stop them, can only stop members of them.  Like I said before, terrorism is only a method of warfare, not a specific group of people.  As long as people feel they are oppressed, there will be terrorists.  

"Ok what do you think we should do?"

I'm Canadian, its not me who's under attack;)

But I'd say use special forces and take out all known terrorist organizations and camps in the world, but do it in covert, easily deniable, never officially recognized missions.  Of course, I was saying taht long before the WTC attacks.

[Gobalopper]

If the Taleban are anything like Iraq they put innocent civilians around targets they know are going to be attacked and then say, "look at how bad the US is, killing innocent people." The Taleban are going to try to make the US seem like the bullies so that other countries of the world will come to their side and try to convince the US and whoever else to stop.

The thing is the US can't just sit back and do nothing, and I don't think they want to involve troops after what happened in Vietnam especially considering the problems the Soviets had in Afghanistan. It is basically a very thin line as you have the entire Middle East already deeply divided over the whole Israel - Palestine issue and not very far away is China who probably wouldn't appreciate half the US army right next door. :)