house symbols

TMA_1 · July 23, 2002

exactly. Thanks vanguard :)

DUNEfan1983 · July 28, 2002

Are the symbols sapose to represent something?.

Vanguard3000 · July 28, 2002

Assuming they are heraldic symbols (i.e. coats of arms), the symbols would (usually) represent vague concepts, such as valour, justice, bravery, etc.

Frodo · July 29, 2002

right, like atreides being the hawk because it is loyal.

Vanguard3000 · July 29, 2002

OKay, I'm a bit of a heraldry fan, so I've done a bit of research, and here are some explanations of the colours and symbols. Keep in mind that they may not perfectly describe the house or it's members, since it is a historical thing.

House Atreides:

Vert (Green): Hope; Loyalty in love

Sable (Black): Constancy; Grief

Gules (Red): Warrior; Martyr; Military Strength

Hawk/Falcon: Dedication

House Harkonnen:

Argent (White/Silver): Sincerity; Peace

Azure (Blue): Strength; Loyalty

Griffin: Valiant Soldier - to the death; Vigilance

Ram (for the game fans): Authority

House Corrino:

Gules (Red): Warrior; Martyr; Military Strength

Or (Gold): Generosity

Lion: Fierce Courage

I do requests, if anyone needs more info. :D

Timenn · July 31, 2002

You (almost) always see in each game the bad guys are red, only because it's American (communism = red).

But even in Dune it's mentioned that Harkonnen have blue

TMA_1 · July 31, 2002

Yeah its kinda silly to think that the harkonnen have always been evil. It talks about in the prequels that house harkonnen being almost decent at times. That even house atriedes has been almost as bad as house harkonnen.

Timenn · August 1, 2002

If you think about Abulurd and Dmitri Harkonnen you can think that it is Vladimir who made the Harkonnens 'evil'

Edric O · August 2, 2002

Besides, the kanly betweent the Atreides and Harks started when an Atreides betrayed a Harkonnen. How's that for a role reversal? The Harks were obviously not always evil.

Vanguard, can you post about House Ordos. We'll use the info from westwood games:

Green

White

Book (in Dune 2/2000, the Ordos logo had a book)

Ice

Snake

TMA_1 · August 2, 2002

well I know you asked for vanguard but I have the DE. in there the one you are talking about actually belongs to house wallach. the colors are a black shield with an orange vertical strip. the book is silver with a green snake coiled around it.

the real house ordos sign are cross bones with ivy around the left bone. the bones are white with the ivy being green. obviously I shouldnt have need to have said that.lol

Well am I right vanguard? I think thats how it goes.

Vanguard3000 · August 3, 2002

For the Games version (H. Wallach in the DE). The book was gold, so I'll include that.Vert (Green): Hope, joy, and loyalty in loveArgent (White): Peace and sincerityBook (closed): CounselOr (gold): Generosity and elevation of the mindSnake: WisdomNow for the DE version (the background is gold, by the way):Vert (Green): Hope, joy, and loyalty in loveArgent (White): Peace and sincerityOr (gold): Generosity and elevation of the mindBones: MortalityIvy: Strong and lasting friendshipAgain, keep in mind that, not only are the coats of arms referring to anscestors, but they are fictional, and were most likely chosen for their appearance rather than heraldic value (I.e. we percieve the snake as being clever, sneaky, evil, etc. As you can see, in heraldry, it represents wisdom).Also, the colours and symbols alone do not give a full decription. The placement is also very important. Lines, their placement, and styles are also important.

Frodo · August 3, 2002

very interesting information vangaurd. Can I ask you a question? In the Dune Encyclopedia, there is a timeline right? Well in that timeline doesn't it say something about House Maros. I was looking up a house to put in a new mod, and I looked at Museum Arakeen, and they had a timeline from the Dune Encyclopedia. I found it there. So is it really there?

Vanguard3000 · August 4, 2002

Yes, I looked it up, and it's in the DE timeline, as well as some info on H. Alexin. I'll update my list with that info.

Those houses aren't in the books, though.

Frodo · August 4, 2002

yes, so it is a real house. I posted this at the beginning of April as the storyline behind my new mod. It was pretty much the same as in the timeline, but...

In the year 2800 House Maros was given the planet Poritrin by the emperor Elrood V. In the year 4492 the emperor takes the planet and gives it to House Alexin. Alexin falls a year later for reasons nobody knows. Though the Maros were thought to be destroyed, the Bene Gesserit secretely supported House Maros, and helped them wipe out the Alexin. Over the next 12 thousand years Maros builds up an army with the Bene Gesserit. They launch a surprise attack on the Ordos homeworld, wiping them out entierly. Now the battle for Rakis is Atreides, Harkonnen, and Maros.

Edric O · August 4, 2002

What is it with you people removing the Ordos in mods? :'( Can't you remove the Atreides or the Harkonnen for once? Please? :(

Thanks Vanguard. You know, the heraldic interpretation of the Ordos symbol (Wallach in the DE) is my idea of the Perfect House. :)

Hope, joy, peace, sincerity, wisdom, loyalty... these are the values that I... wait, what am I saying? :-X I'm supposed to be an evil mastermind! ;D

Frodo · August 5, 2002

i am sorry edric. I decided that before I started to like Ordos. But just to tell you in my mod there will be a trace of ordos in the second version. I will tell you over IM edric. It involves something that I have found out.

neonext · August 5, 2002

for those of you who have played my Redux game and have played as the Empire, how did i do on the symbol? I spent less than 5 minutes on it, using a combination of the atreides symbol and the harkonnen symbol together to make the lion

jacobdouds · August 5, 2002

also, the atreides colour is red, from their red hawk, anyone else wanna back me up?

Vanguard3000 · August 5, 2002

also, the atreides colour is red, from their red hawk, anyone else wanna back me up?

We just discussed that.

DukeLeto · August 6, 2002

What is it with you people removing the Ordos in mods? :'( Can't you remove the Atreides or the Harkonnen for once? Please? :(

The Ordos where not in the Dune books by Frank or Brian Herbert, only the Encyclopedia. They were also a minor house, at least more so than Corrino. And WestWood butchered them. They are totally different in the games.

quoudam72 · August 6, 2002

I have always seen the Ordos as many who make one. And the symbol used to represent them (DE and Westwood version) fits House Ordos perfectly.

rheo · August 7, 2002

while looking through the other parts of the forum, i stumbled over this url and found that there are some nicely done house symbols: http://www.angelfire.com/film/lvr1962/duneccg.htm

nemafakei · August 10, 2002

What about the Gryphon (House Harkonnen proper)? I have info on how it is drawn, (segreant etc), but nothing on its symbolism.

Vanguard3000 · August 11, 2002

Griffin: Valour and death-defying bravery; vigilance

The term "sejant" simply means the animal is sitting, with it's head facing foreward (a profile), rather than it's head facing the "audience".

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