Terri Schiavo

[ps501]

What a nightmare for anyone who's seen any form of news.  Almost with the US would go bomb someone else so at least there would be something decent for the news to report about.

For those who's media isn't picking this up.  Terri suffered brain damage 15 years ago.  They sued the doctor for 1M USD.  700K went to TErri for medical bills, 300K went to her husband for suffering.  Several courts (local, state, federal) have agreed with the medical opinion that she is effectively brain dead, and for the 3rd time her husband has had her feeding tube removed, so that she may finally die in peace.  (As he states her wishes were to not be kept "alive" in that means) So it would finally appear that this sad saga in US media is coming to an ending, going on 7 days w/o food or water for her, the Doctors estimate she may live ~ 1 week longer, while her parents try to go to the US supreme court for the 4 time (the first three times the supreme court refused to even hear the issue)

[Andrew]

I was waiting for this thread :)

They should kill her quickly and painlessly instead of simply pulling a feeding tube out and waiting for her to die of starvation.

This is ridiculous. She is braindead. She told her husband she wanted to die instead of being in a vegatative state, although simply because it was not in her legal will, the courts now decide whether she lives or not. Sad that the government is getting involved. Funny they can pass a Terri law to save her, yet the government can not pass laws that are beneficial to more than one person in less than a month.

The courts seem to be on the side of letting her die, while the government (even Bush) wants to keep her alive.

It's a complete mess.

Why is there so much news about it?

I remember a guy in Canada a couple months ago went public about how he was going to kill himself because he was going to suffer from some disease in the future. He went and killed himself peacefully. No need for the government to get involved.

Next the governement will decide who can die. Doctors will have to call their congressman to ask if they can pull the plug on a patient.

Well, at least it is a social issue and not about invading another country or terrorism. :-X

Will start a thread about another controversial topic sometime this weekend

[Dante]

I was waiting for this thread :)

Me too.

I think the woman should be allowed to die. It would be nice to convince her parents of that first, though. Bitter people can really kick up a fuss.

[Andrew]

The government is not getting what it wants from the courts. So now they have resorted to slander.

Gov. Jeb Bush and the state's social service agency had filed a petition asking to take over legal custody of Schiavo from her husband, presumably to reinsert a feeding tube.

Their petition cited new allegations of abuse and challenged the diagnoses that the 41-year-old woman is in a persistent vegetative state.

http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/2005/03/24/schiavo-supreme050324.html

Some of the images at www.fark.com are quite interesting (found in terri threads).

[Edric O]

I expected a topic on this issue to appear eventually, but I didn't go post it myself because the whole thing has already been blown out of all proportion. And the sheer hypocrisy of it all is just amazing. A poster on another forum I visit put it best:

For those who haven't heard, all regular life in America has been pre-empted while the nation considers the fate of a vegetative woman in Florida. Now the government wants to step in, screaming bloody murder and trying to stir up a public outcry to save the life of a woman whose cerebral cortex is so much jelly. When Somalian babies with distended bellies cry in their mothers arms because their breasts produce no milk, there is no outcry. When thirty thousand children perish every night because they can't afford food, there is no outcry. When this wicked worlds turns its back on the weakest and most innocent, our righteous moral leaders are silent.

Personally, I tend to side with Terri Schiavo's parents, because keeping her "alive" can't actually do any harm, can it? If she is brain dead, it doesn't matter either way; if she isn't brain dead, keeping her alive is the right thing to do. However, given the fact that her chances of recovery are virtually zero, I don't think this is an important decision at all.

[Dante]

Thought of that. But then again, that would cost money.

[Edric O]

Thought of that. But then again, that would cost money.

Unless it costs so much money that it prevents the hospital from saving other lives, it's worth the cost (and if Terri's parents are willing to pay the money - which they probably are - the cost isn't an issue).

[Dante]

I don't know whether they are or not. Still, no matter who pays it's money that could have gone elsewhere. Not that I particularly care. The only thing I'm worried about is the precedent that this could set. That, I suppose, is the primary reason I think she should be allowed to die.

[ordos45]

I don't know whether they are or not. Still, no matter who pays it's money that could have gone elsewhere. Not that I particularly care. The only thing I'm worried about is the precedent that this could set. That, I suppose, is the primary reason I think she should be allowed to die.

You mean Congress passing a law specifically for one person who has no say in it?  Oh yes that frightens me to no end.  Jeb Bush also tried to demand the courts give him custody of Terry so he could reinsert the feeding tube, but was denied.

[Dante]

I mean that if, for whatever reason, she is kept alive, then it will set a precedent for all future cases of the like. If she dies now, then that will be the legacy of the case. If she is kept alive, it will become more difficult for other people to be allowed to die.

[ordos45]

Valid point, either way though, The Party will make sure to argue for 'life' because of the media attention.  No one actually thinks this is all about Terri do they?  She's a rallying cry for the RNC, a way to influence the people onto their side.

Here's a quote from Tom DeLay, Majority Speaker of the House of Representatives (lower body of our legislature):

This is exactly the kind of issue that's going on in America, that attacks against the conservative moment, against me and against many others. The point is, the other side has figured out how to win and to defeat the conservative movement, and that is to go after people personally, charge them with frivolous charges, link up with all these do-gooder organizations funded by George Soros, and then get the national media on their side. That whole syndicate that they have going on right now is for one purpose and one purpose only, and that is to destroy the conservative movement.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1040968,00.html

[Edric O]

By the way, guess who's flip-flopping now?

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/sfl-abush22mar22,0,2255020.story

WASHINGTON

[ps501]

Personally, I tend to side with Terri Schiavo's parents, because keeping her "alive" can't actually do any harm, can it? If she is brain dead, it doesn't matter either way; if she isn't brain dead, keeping her alive is the right thing to do. However, given the fact that her chances of recovery are virtually zero, I don't think this is an important decision at all.

Well I guess the only thing is that I seriously hope she is brain dead.  Imagine being left alive in a prison for 15 years, when that prison is your body, and you can't say/do anything.  That is my defination of a living hell.

At least in any event, since they have received 4 more "no"'s this should be over in the next few days.  (finally)

[TMA_1]

What pisses me off most is that when it got into congress and a political spin was added to it, the democrats and republicans again have divided themselves, and over a case like this. I mean honestly, is this an issue that can be so cleanly seperated? I think not. One of my friends who is a strong christian feels that she should probably be allowed to die and quickly for the sake of less torture.

I personally think she should live, but I think you guys see what I mean. Of course this had to be a topic that politicians could use to their own ends. beh makes me sick.

[Anathema]

It's a pretty fishy case. I read somewhere that Terri had bruises when they brought her in, and that some sources said that her husband was violent at times. Makes you wonder...

For what it's worth, I think that people like Terri should be declared legally dead. Husbands or wives become widows and can remarry without problems. The patient though if he/she still has even a remote chance of recovering (if there's not a brain left then it's no longer a person of course) still stays on life support. Frankly I don't understand why Terri's husband is so hell bent on pulling the plug if he think she's no more then a vegetable.

Of course it's a different issue alltogether if there's reason to believe that the patient is suffering while in coma.

[Mahdi]

There's a difference between "pulling the plug" and removing a feeding tube.

[ordos45]

Politicians, always have to get in the spotlight, even if its that of a braindead woman.  One nastier comment on another forum I visit was "Republicans only care about the braindead and the unborn". 

I'd have to agree with Mahdi, at least give her painkillers while she starves.  Even if 'braindead' the body can feel pain...

[Mahdi]

Politicians, always have to get in the spotlight, even if its that of a braindead woman.

[ordos45]

But short of, illegal in Florida, lethal dosage right?  As you mentioned, its only legal in Oregon, and even then its a tangled months long legal process.

[Mahdi]

But short of, illegal in Florida, lethal dosage right?

[ordos45]

Ak ok.

[GUNWOUNDS]

the reason the parents are fighting so hard is because

[danielsh]

She is able to look around and smile and look at you.

[Dragoon Knight]

I've found a site that's based on the "keep her alive" front.  From what I've read there, it does seem as though the husband just wants to get it over and done with.  I know it's a biased source, but some of the stuff you read there is quite compelling.

I know that some of it is going to be half-truths and such... but you can't fake everything.  Based on what I've read there (and I'd never heard about this case before now) I'd say let her live, and give her therapy that she's been illegally denied for several years.  Like Gunwounds says, she's NOT in a Persistent Vegatitive State at all.  She laughs, cries, smiles, makes attempts to speak...  :-

SITE: http://www.terrisfight.net/

[ps501]

Here is an interesting point to ponder, and perhaps it deserves its own thread, but does a person have the right to choose to die?  If you believe the husbands story, she said she didn't want to be kept alive like this....

But seriously, should a person have the right to choose death?  Should Dr. Jack Kevorkian be free?  Should (if it is her wish) Terry be allowed to starve to death if that was her choice?