Religious education

[Anathema]

I'm not sure wether any other countries do so as well, but in the Netherlands there are many schools based on religion (usually christian) wich receive equal funding from the government as public schools. These schools have the right to refuse students or forbid them to wear clothes that belong to a different religion (such as muslim girls wearing head coverage) and to discharge or refuse to employ teachers that don't conform to the religious background of the school, like gay or atheist teachers. These schools are basicly a violation of the constitution wich forbids discrimination based on religion or sexual orientation.

I'm against it for the reason above, plus it could lead to a breach between the christian and other parts of the population (wich it has done in the past)

Many christians would object to abolishing this religious bias from their schools however.

When this system was created the church wanted to make sure that their kids wouldn't be infested with rising modern ideologies like socialism and liberalism. Does anyone here think that parents should have the right to "protect" their kids from other convictions by placing them in religiously orientated schoold?

[Edric O]

I believe that the state should offer a wide variety of public education programs, so I strongly support public religious schools. However, I also believe that all sides must be represented in the public system. So it's perfectly fine to have public religious schools, but only as long as you have at least one for every major religion in that area, and as long as you also have public atheist schools.

[Dante]

As Hitler found out well, the way to get a population to love you is to brainwash them in schools. And of course which school the child attends is the decision of the parents. Parents shold have the right to attempt to mould their children in their image. If it doesn't work though, the kid is in control.

Whether it is 'right' or not is no concern of mine, so long as nobody tries to interfere with my mind.

[Caid Ivik]

The concept of education itself is religious, all first schools were in past studying religious or quasireligious things. Morale and ethics are the most important things you can learn, that's why we've remained our catholic schools. If parents want their children to be educated religiously, let they have it, if they want to try else, they have plenty of secular schools. Also with nonbelieving teachers and students it also isn't as you say, I have enough experience...

And restrictions in clothing? Well, most elite schools have uniforms, if school can afford it, let they do so.

[Anathema]

It's not really meant as a clothing restriction, but forbidding to express other religions in such a school. And I think there used to be a court case between a gay teacher and a catholic school over here once, though I'm not sure. But do you think that a catholic school in your country would hire a practicing muslim as a teacher?

[Caid Ivik]

We had one black teacher with some weird believes, I'm not sure what it was, it is some time ago. But it couldn't be a fanatic, such person wouldn't try catholic school. We had also some noncatholic christians and a Jew. In Slovakia schools don't watch over some private details much, there are nearly more schools than teachers, you know... And everyone tries to go into richer private schools. And if your quality isn't enough for them, you can't count on your "difference".

[Acriku]

If you're going to have religious education, protestants will fight against the catholics on the material, sect against sect, and discussions will get very heated. If we have a school for every religion (realistically impossible), and for nonreligion, then it might not be offensive, but it is against the U.S. constitution to do so. Publicly funded schools, that is - funded by our tax money, should not go to schools that are religious, or schools that are anti-religious. Schools should just be nonreligious. Funding a school for any religion via the government is making a law(s) establishing religion, and that is clearly prohibited. But, there can be classes that focus on comparing religions of the world, and secularism, as long as no religion or nonreligion is focused on more than the others, or clearly supportive or nonsupportive of any of the religions. Here's a quote from Madison, one of our most important founding fathers of the US, :

Who does not see that the same authority which can establish Christianity, in exclusion of all other Religions, may establish with the same ease any particular sect of Christians, in exclusion of all other Sects?

From http://odur.let.rug.nl/~usa/P/jm4/writings/memor.htm

[Egeides]

I have the ultimate solution...

Acriku, what would you think if we started an atheistic school where no religious behavior/teacher is accepted? ;D

I REALLY would be curious to see if the US administration would react to it the same way they do to religious schools...

[Acriku]

I'd be against it. As I said, schools should be neutral to religion. Also, it wouldn't be very American ;) Now if it was a private school, that's another matter... :D

[nemafakei]

Religious schools are all over the place here: mostly C of E schools. You must sing hymns and you must join in prayer. Well, you used to have to... I'm not sure if it's compulsory any more. I know that some of them let the muslims, sikhs and jews off, but certainly not the atheists. Especially the ones with christian parents.

[Acriku]

Examples like your country, Nema, make me all the more grateful for the U.S. constitution.

[Gobalopper]

As long as the schools meet certain teaching requirements in Math, English, etc and the government supports any school that meets those standards I don't see anything wrong with it. As long as the government is even handed with all schools then it shouldn't matter.

[ordos45]

The local Catholic Schools only add a single religion course on top of the regular classes. Most of the students are kids who were suspended time after time from public school, only a few dozen students there are Catholic.

[Acriku]

As long as the schools meet certain teaching requirements in Math, English, etc and the government supports any school that meets those standards I don't see anything wrong with it. As long as the government is even handed with all schools then it shouldn't matter.

Perhaps it is wrong because it is being funded by the government, using taxpayer's money, and it would violate several teaching requirements, the subject you brought up yourself: the teacher not being allowed to support any religion or nonreligion, nor belittle any religion or nonreligion; denying people in (all public schools must allow any student in, no matter religion, creed, race, ethnicity, etc); the school itself endorsing a religion over other religions and nonreligions; the school entangling itself with religion itself. I could list many more. You see, with the U.S. constitution, there is something wrong with it - many things wrong with it. As soon as government funding (tax money) is sent to such schools, it becomes a public school and is automatically adhered to the constitution and other laid-down requirements.

[Caid Ivik]

I pay taxes to state. And state supports even jehovists, altough I hate all that annoying campaign they do as well as their twisted heresy. I give my money to state and only thing I can want is a specifical government which will work with them. If atheists would registrate a church with sufficient support, even these would receive some of my money in taxes, no matter how I am against it. You give those money to state, not borrow.

[Acriku]

Caid, you're state does not abide by my constitution, so that's irrelevant. I know I have no say in where my tax dollars go, but the constitution (mine, not yours) prohibits such things that I mentioned.

[Dante]

Examples like your country, Nema, make me all the more grateful for the U.S. constitution.

You mean the once that everyone who can afford to ignores on principle?

We have our own documents. The Magna Carta for one; I think there's a British constitution as well... but our legal system's nearly as choked as your own, so it's not like anyone pays them any more attention.

[Anathema]

The UK doesn't really have a constitution the way most countries have it. In Netherlands and in the USA we "codificated" the elemental rights, a word derived from the Roman "codex", meaning "book". This is not the case in Brittain.

[Dante]

No, we like our archaic paperwork. :)

[TMA_1]

Christianity is a horrible religion, yet jesus christ is a wonderful savior. I am not a christian in the established sense, but am a christian in the true definition of the word. I am a partisan of christ. I dont think any religious schools should be funded. Christianity is not just to be practiced at schools, or on sunday, or any time somebody doesnt really wish of it. It is a personal and mental thing that should be cherished always. Christian schools dont foster this kind of feeling, as a matter of fact every christian school I have seen produces some of the most arrogant, hypocritical, and morally bankrupt kids in the world. Why? because they are so repressed, and are taken to places so out of touch with christ, that it would be better to send a child into a house of child abuse.

[Fremen5]

I think it should be funded by the parents who send theyr'e kids to those schools, and not by the government

[Acriku]

That would indeed make it a private school, which is what many people do.

[thomas]

my schools private, my schools catholic, I;m like the only non-catholic at my school though, the reason I go there? because its one of the best high schools in CA, almost all the top HS in CA are pivate and cotholic, hte exceptions would be the HS in ridiculously rich and wealthy areas.

[Acriku]

I hope you're not implying that private schools are better than public schools...

[Caid Ivik]

Christianity is a horrible religion, yet jesus christ is a wonderful savior. I am not a christian in the established sense, but am a christian in the true definition of the word. I am a partisan of christ. I dont think any religious schools should be funded. Christianity is not just to be practiced at schools, or on sunday, or any time somebody doesnt really wish of it. It is a personal and mental thing that should be cherished always. Christian schools dont foster this kind of feeling, as a matter of fact every christian school I have seen produces some of the most arrogant, hypocritical, and morally bankrupt kids in the world. Why? because they are so repressed, and are taken to places so out of touch with christ, that it would be better to send a child into a house of child abuse.

You have lost rationality. Christianity is the fruit of Jesus. If you abolish the way he teached, how can you think about him as a salvator?