You can't say you didn't see this coming...

[GhostHunter]

Enough with the slurs. And Vilgent, you're making an ass of yourself. If you can't handle Edric without flaming from the ass, then put him on your ignore list and stop posting in this topic. Nobody wants to hear "Burn in hell mother fucker jump off a cliff I'll have a party"

Ace, if some guy posted about how sad and disoritentated your country was, how stupid the people are and insulting them 1/3 of all his posts when he posts a lot then you to would snap.

[GhostHunter]

Hmm...someone needs to lay off of the good stuff...

lol

anyway I mean't its obvious that Saddam has Nukes and so does North Korea

True but Koreas is the one a country can trust more with nukes then Iraq...

[VigilVirus]

LOL, hehe it is really funny reading all of your comments here. Especially yours, Edric. "Countries are an obsolete concept". What an idiotic statement. Everyone knows that countries separate us, but if there were none, what would we have??? We would have individuals with no order or organization.

DO YOU THINK THAT HUMANITY CAN UNITE TOGETHER INTO ONE BIG HAPPY FAMILY?!

The idea is preposterous at our level of development. We are too different to unite. We have different faiths, we are prejudiced, we are of different races and etc. We can't overcome that in a matter of days, years or even decades. It would take much longer. And when that happens, only then, will countries become obsolete.

Now back to the flaming of US. You guys just make me laugh. What would happen if US didn't exist? If representative democracy didn't exist - for US was basically the country that established it (Greece was direct democracy).

We would all remain in the times of despotic monarchs and tyrannical dictators, who would force their extremist views upon their citizens - or shall I say slaves?

Do not blame US for the problems of your countries, for it is not.

[Edric O]

I never said we should abolish countries, Dark Assasin. I know as well as you do that many centuries need to pass before we can even attempt to unite the world into a single state.

WHAT I SAID WAS THAT WE SHOULD ABOLISH PATRIOTISM AND NATIONALISM.

They are useless vestiges of our past, and the time to get rid of them is now.

[Timenn]

Everybody calm down! It's a hard discussion, but you don't need to overreact.

I'm sure you can act normally

And Atreides Legend, I warned you before for swearing. So stop it!

[Dunenewt]

WHAT I SAID WAS THAT WE SHOULD ABOLISH PATRIOTISM AND NATIONALISM.

You've got to be joking!

Just because you live in a country you can't be proud of!

[VigilVirus]

Patriotism and Nationalism are the bonds that hold the country in tact.

[Edric O]

*bangs head against wall*

This is NOT about my country, your country, or any specific country! It is about countries in general!!

Tell me, how many people DIED because of your country? How many people gave their lives, either for or against it? Those are all victims of your patriotism!

Wars kill people. Countries cause wars. Therefore, we have nothing to be proud of in any of our countries. Each and every country on this planet is responsible for countless deaths.

[GhostHunter]

Great so why dont we all be and act like Edric..And the world will be MUCH better....

[Edric O]

No, just act logically for a change.

[Anathema]

I am saying countries are an obsolete concept born in our barbaric past, and that they are nothing more than overgrown tribes. I'm saying countries cause more misery and violence than anything else on Earth.

What is logically wrong with that argument?

I agree with that, except for the word "obsolete". At this moment there is no feasonable alternative except global anarchy.

My opinion is that the world should be divided into small groups- none should be large enough to pose a threat against the whole world. Let's say no more then 20 million people. A global federation, like the UN with more capabilities and rights, should solve disputes and actively uphold its authority. Under no circumstances should this federal organisation micromanage each nation and tell them what to do, except where human rights are concerned.

I think nationalism is mostly a bad thing. What does a Texan cowboy have in common with a city guy in New York? Barely anything. They're just proud that their country is bigger and stronger then anything else. And most people in the USA are very proud of the heroes of their nation, like George Washington and Abraham Lincoln. But a lot of them don't even know who Joan d'Arc was, let alone admire her for her selfles action. And take a look at Germany. The nationalist feelings of its people united it, and it ended up being the primary reason for both World Wars. And face it, what good does nationalism do?

And Dark, quit with the caps.

[VigilVirus]

Your logic is fallible, Edric. There were wars long before countries existed. There were wars between the herds and tribes of men since the beginning of human existence.

Countries do not create wars - humans do. Without countries - wars would be between individuals.

[Anathema]

Lol. The hostility between herds and tribes of the past were caused by pride and arrogance, the precursors of nationalism. And a war between individuals isn't even a war, but a row.

[Edric O]

Exactly. There is no meaningful difference between modern nationalism and tribal pride.

Earthnuker, I completely agree with you on this.

[VigilVirus]

K, but how can a country exist if there's no nationalism? How can it be one, united self? Only united by a common goal and purpose of its citizens can it truly exists.

Some of the "countries" where patriotism and nationalism is dead, like for example, Russia and the former Soviet republics, can't be truly considered united anymore. I mean, their citizens do not care for the well being of the whole, all their care about is their own pathetic selfs. For that reason - they don't pay taxes and don't work and the economy crumbles, nothing is created anymore. Countries with no nationalism and patriotism can be thought of as HIV victims - they are slowly dying.

[Edric O]

Nationalism might get people to work together, but for all the wrong reasons.

You shouldn't love your country, you should love the PEOPLE in it, and the PEOPLE in your local community. That's what can keep us truly united.

Nationalism is only a kind of "us" versus "them" mentality.

[Anathema]

Earthnuker, I completely agree with you on this.

*Looks outside window to see if the pigs have started flying through the sky*

[Acriku]

As long as there are leaders keeping the tension in check, there can be patriotism. Everybody should be proud of their country, if that is barbaric then why don't we slap barcodes to the countries and onto the back of our necks?

[VigilVirus]

Principle of life: People don't usually give a crap about other people unless they want something from them. There are rare exclusions of family and good friends.

Union against a coomon enemy was the reason countries were created in the first place.

[Edric O]

Everybody should be proud of their country

Why?

Give me one good reason.

Union against a coomon enemy was the reason countries were created in the first place.

Exactly. And that's why I despise them. We have outgrown that mentality.

[VigilVirus]

Union against a coomon enemy was the reason countries were created in the first place.

Exactly. And that's why I despise them. We have outgrown that mentality.

You overestimate humanity and yourself, my friend. We have not.

[Anathema]

We could, and we should, rid ourself of the concept of nationalism. We have no need for it. All we need is to be open for change.

[Acriku]

There is a big difference between patriotism and nationalism. I was talking about patriotism. Nationalism is bad and should be eradicated because as long as there is nationalism, there will be minimal international goals and accomplishments. But I am all for patriotism.

[nemafakei]

"Give me one good reason."

People need something to look up to. A lot would go wrong if we got rid of humanity's emotional crutches - people would start to go insane, and believe there is nothing for them to work for. So long as we stop overzealous nationalism, pride in the home country and/or community is a crutch that helps to motivate people.

[Digital Guerrilla]

Motivate people once people find out that you just gave them something to believe in they will turn against you and rightly so who wants to put time and energy in something false!?