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[Superseded by version 2.0] Map and mission Editor v1.4: Full of improvements and new features!

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

There is no reason why old campaigns wouldnt work anymore. This whole discussion is only for modded campaigns startimg from now on, or rather said, from the release date on. Campaigns that arent modded wont even touch the new system, they will be loaded normally just like it is now. The point of updates is to introduce new stuff and obviously keep the old stuff working lol.

Good. Just saying.

24 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

Just because its hard to find a host doesnt mean the autoupdate feature is not useful. We are used to do stuff manually and unzip stuff for years, but keep in mind not everyone does this on a regular basis. There are users who arent very engaged into computers and technical stuff, who would love to just double click something and have it all there. No need to know where to download an update from or where to unzip it. Even I, personally, would love to just get any updates without having to open a forum, check a topic, click a download link, unzip the whole thing after browsing to the right location. My point is: if a reliable host can be found, I see this as a very useful feature that would benefit everyone.

Just as it is not a forced decision I don't mind.

Last time I executed the C&C.net it forced a new config file that blurry my game, letters had a smooth-thing that looked horrible, if I couldn't find a config version from 2016 that returned the game to the previous state I would probably just simply stopped playing the game.

24 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

Regarding the fact that you are afraid automated tools might break the game, well that is a risk that, on paper, always exists, whenever you are automating literally anything. However, the actual risk percentage is pretty small in our case, from my point. First, the backup files will be present, and then, there would be no file deletions and no folder structure changes or anything like that. Worst case i can see is if the tool crashes for whatever reason while restoring the normal files, which leaves modded files in there. If that ever happens, which should be very rare to almost never happen tbh, you can just simply restore backed up files. The benefits of this automation outrange the risks by far.

Just as long as is still can be done manually I don't mind. on the SORR forum I know that were people that never like to use any tool whatsoever and do all manually, so as long as the option it's there for both then it is fine.

Keep in mind one thing: we are actually 4 modders. You will release your campaign... (something you were already regretting, Fey had release 1 campaign that it's getting updates every single week, and stalker it's a new guy doing stuff, and then Klofkack with the editor. So as Klofkack said about the editor having a new stable version 1 per year/s, in modding for campaigns and missions it's going to be the same, 1 new campaign every 5-6 months (if we all keep doing them) ; unless you mean when you installing the game from scracht, but that's can even generate problems.

Edited by Cm_blast

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Oh, I see what you mean. You want an option to have the launcher not do anything, and install all the modded files yourself. Sure, that can definitely be implemented if, for whatever reason, someone wants to do it the hard way. xD

 

Man, I see that cncnet update from years ago left a pretty big scar on you lol. xD That was just one bad experience caused by something that is really hard to ensure for many pcs, such as the graphic dlls. This wont have such heavy changes, so the risks of shit breaking is small. You gotta get to trust automated software again someday xD

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4 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

You gotta get to trust automated software again someday xD

You'll have to forgive Cm, he's been trying to get the machines to work properly in a new map for like ten billion weeks now and it's ruined any trust he might have in technology. He's about to go on a Butlerian Jihad IRL. 😂

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13 minutes ago, Fey said:

You'll have to forgive Cm, he's been trying to get the machines to work properly in a new map for like ten billion weeks now and it's ruined any trust he might have in technology. He's about to go on a Butlerian Jihad IRL. 😂

Lmao, I can already imagine that xD

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Posted (edited)
51 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

Oh, I see what you mean. You want an option to have the launcher not do anything, and install all the modded files yourself. Sure, that can definitely be implemented if, for whatever reason, someone wants to do it the hard way. xD

You know that are purist people. I play in vanilla resolution, for example.

51 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

Man, I see that cncnet update from years ago left a pretty big scar on you lol. xD That was just one bad experience caused by something that is really hard to ensure for many pcs, such as the graphic dlls. This wont have such heavy changes, so the risks of shit breaking is small. You gotta get to trust automated software again someday xD

With the new computer game doesn't look as it used to be... but at this point unless I do a virtual machine and play the original then nothing I can do about it.

51 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

You gotta get to trust automated software again someday xD

That's something I never did, even back on windows XP I always had the computer to show my which ones and which ones not, nowadays you are pretty much force to do them for almost anything.

There are still something I don't get.
Let's assume you have a host so any campaign there would be downloaded in auto or whatever; but... which campaigns will be there? because even when gruntlord was active I told fey "hey, upload it there" and... never happened.

And assuming that Fey decides to upload it; and then he updates all once again. Which version your program will have? the outdated one that will overwritte into the one he is currently working on? the one he is currently working on it's the one that it's going to be auto-upload into the server... but he was just messing around and don't really like to share that, much less having accesible to everybody? or he needs to uplaod it itself? (because from my experience nobody shared anything on the d2kplus site, even when it was active; even the Index I made it was me going into all the authors to have their mods there, don't believe people are sending me privates to add his stuff there, so I won't expect people to go into your host to upload their stuff, and I don't feel right uploading other's people work withouth permission.

yeah, that many doubs.

And... what about people that only like certain campaigns? I know Klofkack only enjoy a few of them, I don't know if he will like any launcher to show tons of campaigns that he don't ever want to have in the first place. Or campaigns I found boring and edit them just for myself, can I loose that because it get's auto-downloaded with the "correct" version?

Just to tell, but even for online-skirmish, some people talked some months ago or doing a pool to pick 20-25 online maps, the best of all (or popular) to be designed as the only ones to be downloaded with the auto feature, and if anybody wants to play another map, downloading and appling manually.

So, just saying. Because I was refering on the C&C.net config, but I don't know; if those maps old of you that I fixed locally one day gets overwritte because you uploaded your version (not fixed) maybe I don't bother to play them. So even with the online stuff in mind (that all people need the same maps), they prefer having preselected maps, because the others are not just as good or nobody really plays them.

I can do like some people are doing now, having multiple instances of Dune, one from playing campaign, one from playing online, one from dowloading stuff... (and then moving into the dune dedicated to play campaigns).

I apologize if I may sound angry at some point, not being native I only know a few words, so I may sound angry but it is not. I am just concerned on how all it's going be; it even could be the best thing ever done, but I don't know, right now I am seeing possible problems.

Edited by Cm_blast

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1 hour ago, Cm_blast said:

You know that are purist people. I play in vanilla resolution, for example.

With the new computer game doesn't look as it used to be... but at this point unless I do a virtual machine and play the original then nothing I can do about it.

That's something I never did, even back on windows XP I always had the computer to show my which ones and which ones not, nowadays you are pretty much force to do them for almost anything.

There are still something I don't get.
Let's assume you have a host so any campaign there would be downloaded in auto or whatever; but... which campaigns will be there? because even when gruntlord was active I told fey "hey, upload it there" and... never happened.

And assuming that Fey decides to upload it; and then he updates all once again. Which version your program will have? the outdated one that will overwritte into the one he is currently working on? the one he is currently working on it's the one that it's going to be auto-upload into the server... but he was just messing around and don't really like to share that, much less having accesible to everybody? or he needs to uplaod it itself? (because from my experience nobody shared anything on the d2kplus site, even when it was active; even the Index I made it was me going into all the authors to have their mods there, don't believe people are sending me privates to add his stuff there, so I won't expect people to go into your host to upload their stuff, and I don't feel right uploading other's people work withouth permission.

yeah, that many doubs.

And... what about people that only like certain campaigns? I know Klofkack only enjoy a few of them, I don't know if he will like any launcher to show tons of campaigns that he don't ever want to have in the first place. Or campaigns I found boring and edit them just for myself, can I loose that because it get's auto-downloaded with the "correct" version?

Just to tell, but even for online-skirmish, some people talked some months ago or doing a pool to pick 20-25 online maps, the best of all (or popular) to be designed as the only ones to be downloaded with the auto feature, and if anybody wants to play another map, downloading and appling manually.

So, just saying. Because I was refering on the C&C.net config, but I don't know; if those maps old of you that I fixed locally one day gets overwritte because you uploaded your version (not fixed) maybe I don't bother to play them. So even with the online stuff in mind (that all people need the same maps), they prefer having preselected maps, because the others are not just as good or nobody really plays them.

I can do like some people are doing now, having multiple instances of Dune, one from playing campaign, one from playing online, one from dowloading stuff... (and then moving into the dune dedicated to play campaigns).

I apologize if I may sound angry at some point, not being native I only know a few words, so I may sound angry but it is not. I am just concerned on how all it's going be; it even could be the best thing ever done, but I don't know, right now I am seeing possible problems.

I'm trying to understand your concern but I can't really. I mean, I don't get why are you afraid old campaigns might get broken or modified. I am not touching anyone's work, nor will the updates affect old stuff UNLESS the author specifically asks me to do it (and gruntlord or whoever will host it will upload the new files the author requested to the updater server). You will not be uploading your stuff yourself unless you are the person hosting the server. Then again, if the author tells me "hey I updated my stuff, please add it to the updater" then that means he wants the old version of his maps gone and replaced by the new version. So yea, they will be overwritten, but because the author asked for it and the only thing that will be overwritten is that specific campaign. 

To be honest, so far I have only thought about Mission launcher updates for the executable... I didn't really think in-depth about updating individual missions automatically. Maybe I did not explain it properly, sorry. However while talking to you, I got those thoughts about how updating missions would work, which I shared above.

Regarding campaign windows, I agree that we cannot have a ton of campaign windows for everyone. However, I find it not cool to restrict it to just the current campaigns, and keep something like Fey's smuggler campaign or your Butlerian Jihad in the same pile as all other random missions ever designed. They are campaigns that have a good story and that have been worked on a lot and are quite different compared to vanilla-inspired campaigns and missions. Like Fey has a very complex story and even character development, and you have the freakin' Butlerian Jihad in it. So I believe they would deserve a separate window. Getting your own window would allow you to design some lore info or maybe even images there. Remember how Fey used to write his intel about new units and new characters in the briefing? You would no longer need such workarounds, you could have a screen dedicated to that information in the launcher, before launching the mission. As I said, I am willing to do the UI as long as authors can provide me the art they want. It might not be game changing, but having such campaign-specific lore screen would be a huge immersion upgrade if you ask me. After all, as I keep saying, it is a campaign, so the story is important, and whichever way you can enhance that story is helpful.

Once again, just to make sure it was clear, campaign windows will only happen if, first, the author requests it and then, if he can provide story and images that I should add to the campaign screen. So only a handful of campaigns would get this anyway. For example, if you dont want the Butlerian Jihad in a campaign screen, it won't happen, even if I consider it is worth it.

Of course, all the talk regarding the update feature could be in vain without a responsive host. So this might actually never happen, but I just think it would be helpful.

I hope this cleared up some of the confusion. If not, please let me know, I'll try to explain it better depending on what is still unclear.

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1 hour ago, FedaYkin said:

Regarding campaign windows

I have to emphasize that I love the campaign windows idea. :P Sometime down the line, I've gotta figure out some art for such a thing.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

I'm trying to understand your concern but I can't really. I mean, I don't get why are you afraid old campaigns might get broken or modified. I am not touching anyone's work, nor will the updates affect old stuff UNLESS the author specifically asks me to do it (and gruntlord or whoever will host it will upload the new files the author requested to the updater server). You will not be uploading your stuff yourself unless you are the person hosting the server. Then again, if the author tells me "hey I updated my stuff, please add it to the updater" then that means he wants the old version of his maps gone and replaced by the new version. So yea, they will be overwritten, but because the author asked for it and the only thing that will be overwritten is that specific campaign. 

Alright, so it is a only once to do, unless an update; Let's put a well know example, but assuming a few thing.
For example: your infamious unwinnable map, the one with the sietchs, but let's assume it is a totally new map I never played before.

Then I execute the mission launcher and download this pack. I play it, I realize the mistake, I enter your post to say the error, but you decide to dissapear... for 5 years. 

So I decide to fix it myself. I add the mission win condition or whatever fix the thing.

This altered totally winnable map it's there forever as long as I want, and those 5 years or you being gone doesn't matter what happens with new launchers, new editors or whatever. My fixed map won't get overwritten. did I get it right?

Then you appear the 6º year, fix the thing, reupload it and when I trigger the launcher, then yes, my files got overwritten with the new version your uploaded.

I guess the host-launcher-server-program will know when somebody already downloaded something or not so it won't try to download the same file again, even if that file and my file doesn't match (on size, date of moditifaction, etc...); it's something like that or am I just inventing everything? I admit I am clueless on this regard.

What about if I delete a mission? still count as a "nah, you already download it" or since it cannot find the exiting file will try to download it again into my computer?

2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

To be honest, so far I have only thought about Mission launcher updates for the executable... I didn't really think in-depth about updating individual missions automatically. Maybe I did not explain it properly, sorry. However while talking to you, I got those thoughts about how updating missions would work, which I shared above.

Updating the launcher it's not a problem to me; I always kept thinking on auto-updating mission files itself. Probably I got the wrong idea; I am always refering to the mission-file-stuff. The mission launcher itself it's not really a problem if it gets updated.

2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

Regarding campaign windows, I agree that we cannot have a ton of campaign windows for everyone. However, I find it not cool to restrict it to just the current campaigns, and keep something like Fey's smuggler campaign or your Butlerian Jihad in the same pile as all other random missions ever designed. They are campaigns that have a good story and that have been worked on a lot and are quite different compared to vanilla-inspired campaigns and missions. Like Fey has a very complex story and even character development, and you have the freakin' Butlerian Jihad in it. So I believe they would deserve a separate window. Getting your own window would allow you to design some lore info or maybe even images there. Remember how Fey used to write his intel about new units and new characters in the briefing? You would no longer need such workarounds, you could have a screen dedicated to that information in the launcher, before launching the mission. As I said, I am willing to do the UI as long as authors can provide me the art they want. It might not be game changing, but having such campaign-specific lore screen would be a huge immersion upgrade if you ask me. After all, as I keep saying, it is a campaign, so the story is important, and whichever way you can enhance that story is helpful.

At least I got this alright, I was aware you were about doing separated windows.

2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

Remember how Fey used to write his intel about new units and new characters in the briefing? You would no longer need such workarounds, you could have a screen dedicated to that information in the launcher, before launching the mission.

I didn't get this part.

So instead writting the tecnical part (new units and so on) into the briefing, now you have a screen that shows the units available (or whatever the author wrote there), and later, you pick the mission and there it is the briefing it self. Right?
1 more screen per mission or just 1 screen on the whole campaign? like having the whole tech there written there in a single screen.

2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

Once again, just to make sure it was clear, campaign windows will only happen if, first, the author requests it and then, if he can provide story and images that I should add to the campaign screen. So only a handful of campaigns would get this anyway. For example, if you dont want the Butlerian Jihad in a campaign screen, it won't happen, even if I consider it is worth it.

Of course, all the talk regarding the update feature could be in vain without a responsive host. So this might actually never happen, but I just think it would be helpful.

I hope this cleared up some of the confusion. If not, please let me know, I'll try to explain it better depending on what is still unclear.

Just a point to make it totally clear, because from the beggining I feel I was talking about something that was not the intention you had from the beggining.

You are talking about.
a) A mission launcher that auto-download whatever set of missions uploaded, being the total of the 70 campaigns ever made on this forum; although later only 4 of them have separated windowns, but the whole world-creation it's there too.
b) A mission launcher that auto-download with the only set of missions that any author want to upload. So it will present 4 campaigns. Yours, Feys Smuggler, Stalker mega-awesome-campaign and my Butlerian one. If you want the rest, search on another part.

In any option, it will happen only once, like "the first time to execute it", and only if the files themselves got reuploaded, it will happen again.
Did I get this right?

Edited by Cm_blast

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38 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

Alright, so it is a only once to do, unless an update; Let's put a well know example, but assuming a few thing.
For example: your infamious unwinnable map, the one with the sietchs, but let's assume it is a totally new map I never played before.

Then I execute the mission launcher and download this pack. I play it, I realize the mistake, I enter your post to say the error, but you decide to dissapear... for 5 years. 

So I decide to fix it myself. I add the mission win condition or whatever fix the thing.

This altered totally winnable map it's there forever as long as I want, and those 5 years or you being gone doesn't matter what happens with new launchers, new editors or whatever. My fixed map won't get overwritten. did I get it right?

Then you appear the 6º year, fix the thing, reupload it and when I trigger the launcher, then yes, my files got overwritten with the new version your uploaded.

I guess the host-launcher-server-program will know when somebody already downloaded something or not so it won't try to download the same file again, even if that file and my file doesn't match (on size, date of moditifaction, etc...); it's something like that or am I just inventing everything? I admit I am clueless on this regard.

What about if I delete a mission? still count as a "nah, you already download it" or since it cannot find the exiting file will try to download it again into my computer?

Updating the launcher it's not a problem to me; I always kept thinking on auto-updating mission files itself. Probably I got the wrong idea; I am always refering to the mission-file-stuff. The mission launcher itself it's not really a problem if it gets updated.

At least I got this alright, I was aware you were about doing separated windows.

I didn't get this part.

So instead writting the tecnical part (new units and so on) into the briefing, now you have a screen that shows the units available (or whatever the author wrote there), and later, you pick the mission and there it is the briefing it self. Right?
1 more screen per mission or just 1 screen on the whole campaign? like having the whole tech there written there in a single screen.

Just a point to make it totally clear, because from the beggining I feel I was talking about something that was not the intention you had from the beggining.

You are talking about.
a) A mission launcher that auto-download whatever set of missions uploaded, being the total of the 70 campaigns ever made on this forum; although later only 4 of them have separated windowns, but the whole world-creation it's there too.
b) A mission launcher that auto-download with the only set of missions that any author want to upload. So it will present 4 campaigns. Yours, Feys Smuggler, Stalker mega-awesome-campaign and my Butlerian one. If you want the rest, search on another part.

In any option, it will happen only once, like "the first time to execute it", and only if the files themselves got reuploaded, it will happen again.
Did I get this right?

You have raised some pretty valid points. As I said, I did not really think a lot about updating missions, and I now understand your concern. Let's say that what will 100% happen is that the campaigns which have new windows might probably require to have their mission files downloaded automatically. I guess I could do something like "only download missions once, when going to a new version" and having maybe an option that you can turn on if you ever want to get them downloaded again without going to a new version.  This would apply to a deleted mission as well. Shortly, the launcher would only check the server for missions and download them if you want it to in the options or when it detects that there is a new version available.

The easiest way for me would be to not care about updating missions at all, and only handle executable updates, which was my initial plan. However that means even if I update the exe with, let's say, somebody's new campaign window, users wont have any missiom when opening that campaign window unless they go on the forum or whereever the guy released the data, download and unzip it manually. This is an issue in my opinion, and I dont really have an idea about how to fix this without automatically downloading at least the missions and data for the campaigns that have a window. If you have some suggestions about this please do share them. I personally would prefer not to touch individual missions or campaigns without a personalized window, because it requires much less effort on my side and apparently is also the desired way for you, but we must find a solution for campaign-window kind of campaigns. Having a fancy window that has no missions when you open it is bad.

 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

You have raised some pretty valid points. As I said, I did not really think a lot about updating missions, and I now understand your concern. Let's say that what will 100% happen is that the campaigns which have new windows might probably require to have their mission files downloaded automatically. I guess I could do something like "only download missions once, when going to a new version" and having maybe an option that you can turn on if you ever want to get them downloaded again without going to a new version.  This would apply to a deleted mission as well. Shortly, the launcher would only check the server for missions and download them if you want it to in the options or when it detects that there is a new version available.

Alright, thanks for listening me, and sorry for all the trouble.

The delete comes in part because I would prefer not having certain campaings (for example, my version in english, that would make the mission selector much bigger for no reason) so It is pointless that I have it twice, and playing a perfect spanish version it's much better that playing a downgraded "engrish" versión.

2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

The easiest way for me would be to not care about updating missions at all, and only handle executable updates, which was my initial plan. However that means even if I update the exe with, let's say, somebody's new campaign window, users wont have any missiom when opening that campaign window unless they go on the forum or whereever the guy released the data, download and unzip it manually. This is an issue in my opinion, and I dont really have an idea about how to fix this without automatically downloading at least the missions and data for the campaigns that have a window. If you have some suggestions about this please do share them. I personally would prefer not to touch individual missions or campaigns without a personalized window, because it requires much less effort on my side and apparently is also the desired way for you, but we must find a solution for campaign-window kind of campaigns. Having a fancy window that has no missions when you open it is bad.

For specific windown-mission you can have a couple of checks. "No file detected, do you want to download them?" to maybe avoid downloaded too many campaigns at once (even if it is only a few of them); in my case I would use the regular mission launcher to play my butlerian yihad even if that launcher ends containing a windown with the 27 missions, but the rest can click and have ready those group of missions downloaded and ready to play, while myself I don't bother with extra files thickening my list.

And in case somebody already have them (downloaded the files, or even tricked the launcher and I place files that are not even that campaing, just share the name) then won't ask for downloads unless manually asked.
And maybe this is really hard, but adding some kind of "marker"... I'll try to explain this way:

-I enter the mission launcher
-I enter the Butlerian windown - I let the launcher to download them /OR/ I already have them
-I play the missions, or not, and then exit/close the program.
-Author decide to update his campaign and pass you the new files that you add into the mix.
-The next day, I open the mission launcher.
-I see on the Butlerian a "NEW" flashy word on top of it. Clicking may trigger a "a new version was uploaded on date this and that" (or anything more generic); selecting "yes" or "no" to download these new missions that will overwritte the ones I have.

So... the launcher will know that I entered X specific campaign on one date and marking that this campaign was already downloaded (or negate the download) after the date the original file was uploaded and, if a new udpate was release, marking it if somebody wants to give a try to it, or not if he just think the last version was perfect.

So, something like this:
WOA uploaded on today, day 7.
I open the editor, click on WOA; "no files detected, do you want to download" - Yes.
I play them on days 8 to 20, because it takes that many to finish it.
WOA update on day 27.
I enter the next day, on 28 and see a "WOA - NEW" meaning that whatever update was done on those files, they are different from the ones I downloaded 20 days ago. So it is my call to letting the program to download them again if I want.


Maybe this cannot be done or it is too hard.
Honestly, I am starting to feel bad, beewteen Klofkack and now you I feel that I am almost demanding for too much.

2 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

I personally would prefer not to touch individual missions or campaigns without a personalized window, because it requires much less effort on my side and apparently is also the desired way for you

Mostly do it because the less effort for you, we are only a few active, more can come, or we can leave, and having you working for weeks/months and once it is ready 2 of us are gone or "retired" you will feel like working for nothing.

Edited by Cm_blast

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Posted (edited)

@Klofkac
199 - Side 0 Freighter
391 - Side 1 Freighter
558 - Side 2 Freighter
848 - Side 3 Freighter
859 - Side 4 Freighter
867 - Side 5 Freighter
889 - Side 6 Freighter
897 - Side 7 Freighter

Any chance you could add the Freighters to the editor? I'd like to place some on the map without manually punching in the special values. Also, the Freighter behavior can be used to add a new unit to most factions! See below:

1269980362_actuallyaFreighterlol.png.ac580bdafdef17a37806cd0b7d2ec505.png

Can't believe it took me this long to figure I should try this. :P

Edit: Oh, and also, is there a way to change faction names in the editor? Some of the indexes are swapped around in my mod to give Combat Tanks to different factions, so if there's some way to adjust these, that'd be great!

248546124_factionnames.thumb.png.72c3a7a3a922ce43446d5810518aac0f.png

Edit 2: Also, is there something that you might stumble across in the hex editor related to in-game unit responses? I dunno how any of that works, or what you might find, but I'm trying to figure out how to change unit reporting sounds since TibEd doesn't seem able to completely change them. At least, not easily. I brought it up in this thread:
https://forum.dune2k.com/topic/28668-regarding-unit-dialogue-modding/

But no responses yet. Given your latest innovations, I imagine you're probably the best person to ask. :P

It seems possible to change these things. For some reason, the new Flame Tank uses Sardaukar lines even though it replaced the stealth Fremen, so I did something that screwed up those lines. But, I have no idea what, as even turning the unit completely back to normal keeps the Sardaukar voice lines where there should be Fremen.
If we could figure out how exactly this happened, we could add quite a few different sounds for the various units. Up to twelve different sets of dialogue, replacing only the original sounds intended for use on units!

As a side note, if I manage to recreate what I did with the Flame Tank reporting sounds, we could get only up to six working sets of unit sounds. Enough for some changes, but not nearly as many options.

Edited by Fey

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Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, Fey said:

Any chance you could add the Freighters to the editor? I'd like to place some on the map without manually punching in the special values. Also, the Freighter behavior can be used to add a new unit to most factions! See below:

I did not include the Freighter in the unit list in editor, because it would be actually useless in vanilla Dune2000. If you utilize this unit type in modified version of Dune 2000, then I made the editor configuration easily editable for this purpose. So this is actually something you can do on your own by editing the file "config/structures.ini": just add there a new entry, call it whatever you like, and the tiledata index should be unit type index used in TILEDATA.BIN editor (for CHOAM FRIGATE it's 23, you can check yourself). Pos_x and pos_y are the coordinates to the "graphics/structures.bmp", so you can modify the graphics file and add your own unit graphics there as well. The size_adjust parameter is there for the case the unit grapgics exceeds the standard tile square size (32*32), for example Harvester graphics spreads 4 pixels in each direction.

So the editor is quite well customizable for whatever game modifications you like to do, you can rename the units or modify the graphics so that editor will draw all units and buildings according to your modifications. I want to distribute the vanilla version, however you can publish modified editor configuration and graphics file for other modders who would like to create missions based on your modified game, in same manner you would distribute tileset .ini file.

21 hours ago, Fey said:

Edit: Oh, and also, is there a way to change faction names in the editor? Some of the indexes are swapped around in my mod to give Combat Tanks to different factions, so if there's some way to adjust these, that'd be great!

Again, this is editable too, look into "config/map_players.ini" file. Here you can change the minimap color as well. As far as I remember, this file has only effect on the dropdown list on Structures tab, it has no effect on the UI in Mission Settings and Event and Conditions windows. I can implement that also the player names in Mission Settings and Event and Conditions windows are fetched from this configuration file.

21 hours ago, Fey said:

Edit 2: Also, is there something that you might stumble across in the hex editor related to in-game unit responses? I dunno how any of that works, or what you might find, but I'm trying to figure out how to change unit reporting sounds since TibEd doesn't seem able to completely change them. At least, not easily. I brought it up in this thread:
https://forum.dune2k.com/topic/28668-regarding-unit-dialogue-modding/

I'm not going to look into this at this time, I am quite busy with the editor stuff already.

Edited by Klofkac

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1 hour ago, Klofkac said:

So this is actually something you can do on your own

Ah, I totally missed that part of the ini 😅 Thanks for pointing that out, Klof!

1 hour ago, Klofkac said:

it would be actually useless in vanilla Dune2000

Not necessarily! The player can't shoot it down and it doesn't act like a Carryall and it just flies in circles, true, but hey! What if a "leave" event was put in when a ground objective was destroyed?

All just speculation, of course. I mean, Cm found a way to use Ornithopters placed on the map recently, in his Christmas campaign. Which was awesome and hilarious, by the way, totally recommended.

1 hour ago, Klofkac said:

I can implement that also the player names in Mission Settings and Event and Conditions windows are fetched from this configuration file.

Please do, and thank you! Your effort to keep the editor flexible for the sake of mods is noticed and greatly appreciated. :)

1 hour ago, Klofkac said:

I'm not going to look into this at this time, I am quite busy with the editor stuff already.

Quite understandable.

Uhh... I'm not sure how much good it'll do without experience looking through this sort of thing, but you wouldn't happen to have a link to the hex editor, would you?

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8 hours ago, Fey said:

Not necessarily! The player can't shoot it down and it doesn't act like a Carryall and it just flies in circles, true, but hey! What if a "leave" event was put in when a ground objective was destroyed?

All just speculation, of course. I mean, Cm found a way to use Ornithopters placed on the map recently, in his Christmas campaign. Which was awesome and hilarious, by the way, totally recommended.

Once in the past I read, that placing a frigate will crash the game after some time after the frigate makes a few circles around. That is the main reason I did not include it in the unit list. But, maybe you could try with some good and reasonable utilization for the Frigate placed on map, if there is any use despite the crash.

Actually there are three unit types I did not include in the unit list: Choam Frigate, Death Hand Missile, and Sandworm. All of the three are not usable in my opinion and does not make sense to place them on map. But still, I included these in TILEDATA.BIN, so that modders can utilize them (in case they mod them somehow) without need to modify TILEDATA.BIN.

10 hours ago, Fey said:

Uhh... I'm not sure how much good it'll do without experience looking through this sort of thing, but you wouldn't happen to have a link to the hex editor, would you?

I believe there are some free hex editors available, just google for some. I am personally using PSPad, it's not a hex editor directly, but primarily a text editor with hex editing feature. Not the best one, but can be used for some basic stuff. Maybe you can find some good one.

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Ah, thank you for the clarification. I'll be sure to look into all of this. :P

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Hey @Klofkac , I used the most recent version last few days, gotta say thank you for the improvements, it's really amazing. The warning messages for over-the-limit blooms and empty reinforcements are very cool.

Love the smooth spice rendering, really cool addition.

I've yet to try all new features, such as the tileset related improvements, but should soon get to some of them in my campaign development.

I have a small question, maybe a future feature suggestion: would it require a lot of effort to allow a drag on map defence area creation for a side? There could be a button somewhere on the tabs to allow you the creation of a defence area for the AI of a specific faction. Creating a new area like this would increment the value of DefenceAreas that was currently set for that AI player and would look for the first Group in the .misai which is full of zeroes, meaning there is no defence area defined for that slot. Just a suggestion.

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Can't say this enough, but @Klofkac is killing it with these updates and quality of life improvements. I just felt like leaving you another message of gratitude, because all of this is so amazing to see happening in 2020, keeping D2k alive the way you are with modern solutions to the editor, and probably other work that I don't know about, considering the stuff I've seen so far. Thank you so much for your continued efforts, we all greatly appreciate it!

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Although it doesn't look like, it is related with the editor.

I tried a game that, because the scale I have applied on windows 10, half the game appeared "outside" the monitor, so I researched that there is an option to try, this one in the imagen (don't mind the spanish).

image.png.2cb71084eb121de80f1bbf986a6535de.png

It is on "right click - properties - compatibilities -changing configuration PPP something".
Marking that, like in that imagen, the game launched at the correct resolution.

After that success, I tried the same with the editor, and indeed, the editor shows at the whole screen withouh the scale applied being able to see the whole choose of terrains; So I could have 2 executable with the two options just to avoid the scaling problem when I am doing some terrain design while still using the scale if my stuff it's about scripting (bigger text, easier to read, etc...); but I encounter one problem...

image.png.99170aefd01cea461c6b49616f1f5461.png

For some reason... this specific .exe make this option to be gray, which mens I cannot turn off.

But it seems this has nothing to do with the .exe itself but the registry? maybe? If I copy, move or rename the .exe, the problem it's gone (so, a path in windows reg it's written, i guess).

Although this is not a big-problem (I renamed the file into "D2kEditorr.exe", with 2 "r", and that fixed the thing), I would like to know if anybody knows about this stuff, for the future. It is literally the first time I use it and it gets so weird that I cannot deactivated, as you can se the imagen at the top from the other game can be deactivated just fine if I want.

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Posted (edited)

Dunno if somebody said this I was using the new version (canditate 2 one) to update the Warcraft 2 tileset; and that worked fine from I could see.

But then I found that I guess there are still some work to do since when I double click inside there:
image.png.0e3c9fec73c6a3e92287bc9f0d318193.png

Will fill the whole map; probably you know already, but just in case you don't.
So I guess it is missing some rules from the .ini included into the editor.

If the area it's rocks, void, dunes or bridges the spice gets contained, but spice doesn't contain spice.

Others seems to work fine (rock containing rock, dunes for dunes and so on).

Ps: I like how you altered the Dark portal to include some kind of entrance, I went to simply the 4x4 full-buildin as it was originally (I think), but I like the idea of the entrance, so now units can spawn from the inside.

Edited by Cm_blast

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I found another error with the editor. 

You open the editor in whatever tileset. Press space bar; and keep pressing it. It will stop after the second time. You know, space bar changes from "all graphic on the tileset" to "roff clift only" preset of the tileset, but sometimes it stop and pressing the space bar no longer works (if for you works, change mark/unmark the press helper, because sometimes it works, but after marking or unmarking that option it stops working).

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Another update! RC3 is out!

Download: D2kEditorv1.4rc3.zip

Thank you all for your bug reports and feature suggestions. After taking some break after releasing the previous version, I finally resumed my work on D2kEditor and I was happy to implement another set of improvements and new useful stuff you asked me for. Sorry for a bit of delay and no responses - I was taking into account all your comments and I hope I did not forget about anything. It's quite difficult to keep track of all comments and suggestions that are scattered around many different threads.

I suspended my work on the Mission Launcher. The main reason is, that a new mission launcher is currently under development by @Feda and I did not want to make something duplicate, which would work in different way and be incompatible. I still want to get in sync with Feda's mission launcher and make a support for it, and add even more support for loading modded files in the editor.

Finally, after all, I decided to imlement @D2k Sardaukar's request about random background map for painting sand and rock (see https://forum.dune2k.com/topic/27824-map-and-mission-editor-finally-a-small-update-after-all-version-13-released/?do=findComment&comment=396039). Finally I got an idea how to reasonably implement this into the program.

On 5/17/2020 at 11:38 AM, AZ-Stalker said:

Can't say this enough, but @Klofkac is killing it with these updates and quality of life improvements. I just felt like leaving you another message of gratitude, because all of this is so amazing to see happening in 2020, keeping D2k alive the way you are with modern solutions to the editor, and probably other work that I don't know about, considering the stuff I've seen so far. Thank you so much for your continued efforts, we all greatly appreciate it!

Thank you very much for these words. Seeing a new and active member in our small community is actually a motivation for me, who knows whether anyone else like you will yet appear. I hope you still get a new breath and continue making good quality missions, like the one you started up with. Having better tools and work getting done easier can be a good motivation for you, too.

And here comes the most interesting part: The list of changes and new things in this version:

Added: Mark Wall & Concrete owner side feature. Available as 4th toggle button "Own" below minimap (or Ctrl+W).
       "Show unknown specials" option was moved under Settings menu.
Added: Map error check for Refineries per player limit (10 max)
Added: Total column to map statistics (now it's easier to get total amount of structures in a map)
Fixed: Map statistics grid scrolling with mouse wheel
Added: Player names loaded from "config\players.ini" file are used in all places in editor and no longer hardcoded
Added: Minimap colors for buildings and units are loaded from game's COLOURS.BIN file. Original COLOURS.BIN file
       is shipped with editor.
Changed: Allegiance buttons on Mission settings window are changing in this order: Enemy -> Ally -> Neutral
Added: Defence areas can be selected directly from map. A button will appear when you select a defence area in AI editor.
Added: Use random paint map feature. Predefined 128*128 background map of clean sand and rock is used for painting.
       The advantage is better distribution of random sand/rock tiles and more natural look. Can be turned on in Settings.
Fixed: Spacebar was not always working for switching from block preset window to tileset window
Fixed: Filling of area surrounded by spice with spice
Added: Remap tiles feature
Added: A simple mission launcher
Added: "D2k Mapping Manual" document

As before, I would like to ask you to go through the list one by one, and verify whether everything mentioned got fixed and it's working as expected. Thank you.

@Feda I will still need to get in touch with you, regarding addition of new fields related to new mission launcher. I need to understand exactly how it's going to work.

  • Upvote 1

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3 hours ago, Klofkac said:

Added: Player names loaded from "config\players.ini" file are used in all places in editor and no longer hardcoded

What's it is this? to alter name of the factions on the editor or something like that?

3 hours ago, Klofkac said:

Changed: Allegiance buttons on Mission settings window are changing in this order: Enemy -> Ally -> Neutral

Any reason for this? I am not complaining but curious. It's just that on the events and conditions the order by default it's
0 - ally
1 - enemy
2 - Neutral
On the mission settings the editor it goes the same order, from "ally", you click and changes to "enemy", you click again and changes into "neutral".

I mean, I don't really care the order, it is no going to slow me or anything like, just pointing it the coincidence on those two and maybe that was the reason that everybody had the alliances in this order?. But again, I don't mind either way.

3 hours ago, Klofkac said:

Added: Defence areas can be selected directly from map. A button will appear when you select a defence area in AI editor.

Wow, it works so easily. Drawing in literally 3 seconds!

3 hours ago, Klofkac said:

Fixed: Spacebar was not always working for switching from block preset window to tileset window
Fixed: Filling of area surrounded by spice with spice

Yeah, those two works, at least the small clicking around I did.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

What's it is this? to alter name of the factions on the editor or something like that?

Yes, it's for changing the player names in editor. It has no impact on game at all, it's there just for convenience for the person who makes a mod for Dune 2000 and reuses specific side for his "own" new side. For example when you make Redzani campaign, you rename one side (i.e. Mercenaries) to Redzani, and in all places in editor, you see "Redzani".

4 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

Any reason for this? I am not complaining but curious.

It has no impact on game, internally the numbers are still same. I just changed the order in the UI for convenience. Imagine the most common case - when you create a new mission, you start off with all allegiance as "Enemy" (except self-reference). Then in most cases, you make two or more sides allies. Previously you needed to click every button twice, to switch to "Neutral" and then to "Ally". Now you switch to Ally with one click. All I wanted was to save your mouse clicks. I consider Neutral used much less often than Ally.

Edited by Klofkac

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Klofkac said:

Yes, it's for changing the player names in editor. It has no impact on game at all, it's there just for convenience for the person who makes a mod for Dune 2000 and reuses specific side for his "own" new side. For example when you make Redzani campaign, you rename one side (i.e. Mercenaries) to Redzani, and in all places in editor, you see "Redzani".

This is nice.

6 hours ago, Klofkac said:

It has no impact on game, internally the numbers are still same. I just changed the order in the UI for convenience. Imagine the most common case - when you create a new mission, you start off with all allegiance as "Enemy" (except self-reference). Then in most cases, you make two or more sides allies. Previously you needed to click every button twice, to switch to "Neutral" and then to "Ally". Now you switch to Ally with one click. All I wanted was to save your mouse clicks. I consider Neutral used much less often than Ally.

it's reasonable

Anyway, thanks for the editor; I only toyed a bit with it, but I have in plan one campaign with the player being small faction joining other small factions to fight the traditional big-ones (I may use the player's name part to help me), so I will use this new version from the start; I already saw that you can use the arrow keys to move bewteen units and stuff like that, so thanks for returning that feature.

Edited by Cm_blast

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@Klofkac Thank you very much for the updates! 

 

Sure, I can describe how the new mission launcher works. Let me know how you'd like to communicate. In my opinion, the easiest way would be to talk on discord, as we've set up a special discord dedicated to Dune 2000 singleplayer mapping & modding. You can join by clicking this https://discord.gg/Adwfxxe. This way, you could also stay in touch with us easier, as me cm and fey are there and talk daily.

Alternatively, if you don't want to join the discord server, we could talk via PM here on FED2K I guess, although that would be much slower and more difficult.

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