Will the Coalition last?

[Dunenewt]

Personally, I think its going to break up next year, as there's simply too much discontent.

[Dante]

It'll last the full term, in one form or another, and then the Lib Dems will implode, never to be seen again. Their disenchanted supporters will have turned to Labour in England and the SNP in Scotland, probably forming one or two new minor parties in the process.

[Dunenewt]

I doubt they'll turn to SNP in Scotland, as the Lib Dems are a Unionist party. I expect a fair bit of their support will drift towards the Green Party as well.

[Dante]

Support for the SNP doesn't necessarily mean support for devolution. A lot of the party's current supporters are on their side because on a local level their candidates tend to be good for them. Indeed, many are pro-SNP while being relatively ambivalent about independence.

We're more than a one-trick country, you know.

[ErasOmnius]

I think it will last till 2014 or 2015. Nick Clegg seems to be willing to compromise many, many values when it comes to retaining the Coalition with Cameron.

It is a very interesting phenomenon to observe.

[Edric O]

I think it will last till 2014 or 2015. Nick Clegg seems to be willing to compromise many, many values when it comes to retaining the Coalition with Cameron.

It is a very interesting phenomenon to observe.

[c=#00dd00]Correction: He seems to be willing to pretty much rubber stamp anything the Tories want. Maybe he is thinking that since he will certainly be the first and last Lib Dem leader in government this century - and perhaps the last Lib Dem leader ever - he might as well make sure he serves the full term.

In any case, it will be fun to watch the annihilation of the Lib Dems at the next general election.[/c]

[athanasios]

Does it matter? In any case, as it is the case with quite a number of other countries, it will be half-Hebrews ruling your country. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Cameron http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Miliband

[Dragoon Knight]

[colour=#005FFF]Do UK politics matter? Yes, athanasios, they do.

But thank you for your insightful input, as always. I had no idea that all half-Hebrews ruled in the same way.[/colour]

[ErasOmnius]

[colour=#005FFF]Do UK politics matter? Yes, athanasios, they do.

But thank you for your insightful input, as always. I had no idea that all half-Hebrews ruled in the same way.[/colour]

What this Thread is about, ath, is that an individual/Party that is associated and wants to govern from the Left (NL); has completely aligned itself with an individual/Party from the Right (Con); just because the governing party at the last Election (Lab), lost seats. In many other nations, NL and Labor would have formed a guiding government earlier this year.

What exists now is a very interesting anomoly.

[athanasios]

Well the purpose sanctifies the means. This is a common proverb here in Greece.

So what matters most is the purpose. If the purpose can be accomplished through different means the means will change. And again the means will change if the purpose cannot be accomplished.

[Dante]

"The ends justify the means?" Haven't heard that one in a while.

[Dante]

...the Lib Dems will implode, never to be seen again. Their disenchanted supporters will have turned to Labour in England and the SNP in Scotland, probably forming one or two new minor parties in the process.

Told you so.

[ErasOmnius]

Interesting that the voters did not want to change first-past-the-post. Fascinating that the Bloc Quebecois was trounced in Canada's federal election, being a secessionist party; but yet the Scottish Nationalist Party did well in the regional Scot Election.

I guess the question would be, how will the regional secessionist, Parti Quebecois, do in Quebec's regional elections? And of course, how will the Scottish Nationalist Party do in the next federal election?

[Andrew]

One reason the Bloc failed is because as soon as they seemed the slightest bit in trouble (from NDP surge) they brought out all their Separatist heavyweights. Separatists (they want Quebec to leave Canada) only have some older generations (no under 30 people). NDP said "hey bloc can't do shit because only run in one province, while us the NDP have a chance of winning government or opposition and thus can help Quebec more than Bloc".

If Bloc had completely dropped separating from Canada as a platform and focused on helping Quebec, they might have stood a chance.

I assume Dante is referring to

Vote 2011: UK rejects alternative vote

I looked at charts (right side of above link) but couldn't figure them out exactly. 4 different regions, with each region having a different party winning? What does that mean (who won?)? I mean in one spot is says Const, another says assembly, and last says Councillors. Were there more than 1 election at same time?

So SNP won majority in holyrood, had to look up where that is (somwhere near Edinburgh?).

[Dante]

Actually I meant this. Disenchanted with Labour and betrayed by the Liberal Democrats, Scotland turned to the SNP. It's their strongest election result ever, taking ground from both Labour and the Tories and slaughtering the Lib Dems. Was a lot of fun to watch.

The countries of the UK all have administrative bodies with varying degrees of power. The Irish Assembly is in Stormont, The Welsh Assembly in Cardiff, and the Scottish Parliament in Holyrood, Edinburgh. Westminster, in London, overlooks all of these and administrates England. It wasn't a General Election ('federal' elections? No, eracist, nobody calls them that), it was a combination of elections for local government as well as the AV referndum. Near as I can tell, it's analogous to the midterm elections of other nations. Long story short, the governing of the UK hasn't changed, but the governing of England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland has. So there wasn't a 'winner' so much as everyone making losses and gains. Except the SNP made huge gains and the Lib Dems, as Edric once said, kissed their electorate goodbye.

It would be premature to draw conclusions now, but an idea does suggest itself. Scotland was traditionally Labour country. Before it was even a political party, the Labour movement was strong here. If it weren't for Scotland, the UK would hardly have seen a Labour government since the Second World War. But Labour has grown stale and tired, and hasn't seen an election result this dire since 1931. The Lib Dems, gaining ground from Labour in previous years by offering themselves as a fresher alternative, are now widely regarded as swindling turncoats and were handed their worst election result in their party's history (which admittedly only goes back to the 1980's). And after what they did to us in the 80's, the Tories are still loathed up here. This rejection of all three major parties could, if one so chose, be interpreted to suggest that Scotland is growing rather tired of Westminster's shenanigans.

Also, the comparison with the Bloc isn't fascinating, it's inane.

[ErasOmnius]

We are talking about Voting Systems and Politics at the community college. I am seeing what I believe is a pattern of people wanting 'new ideas' or 'change'. Well, from those of us on the outside, the major event in the UK was the repudiation of the AV system. It seems that Mr Clegg's embracing of being in a coalition with Mr Cameron, may have turned people off to voting Yes on 'his' referendum. Do you feel that the AV system was explained to you thoroughly by the media and the government?

So, the Conservative Party of the UK has traditionally supported tariffs and protectionist policies to remain popular, before the 1970s. Of course, protectionism, and the Conservatives pushing off and feeding off of the blame of The Great Depression, led to their once-in-a-century win 1931 over Liberals and Labour. Since the 1980s, they have embraced 'free trade', in an attempt to rectify what they saw as union domination of shops. This 'fair trade' led to the destruction of Scotland's manufacturing base, and now the region always vote 'left-oriented'. So nowadays, though the Conservatives may have the least popular viewpoint overall; by the rest of the Parties splitting the 'left'-leaning' vote, they remain in Power in many Commonwealth nations.

Also, what you are saying is that the Labour Party seems to be perceived as 'stale and tired' and 'left'-oriented; and the Scottish National Party has vigorous ideas, is 'left-oriented', and is somewhat pro-independence. And the reason is that people chose SNP over Labour, was because of Labour's been-there/done-that perception. Correlated to what Andrew said, if the Bloc Quebecois had been less pro-independence, and more vigorous ideas, they would not have lost over seats in Canada's election. They lost Quebec seats to people who simply put their names on a ballot, the NDP; because of a lack of 'fresh ideas' on the part of the BQ. Very interesting to see it happening on both sides of the Atlantic.

[Oh yeah]

Correlated to what Andrew said, if the Bloc Quebecois had been less pro-independence, and more vigorous ideas, they would not have lost over seats in Canada's election. They lost Quebec seats to people who simply put their names on a ballot, the NDP; because of a lack of 'fresh ideas' on the part of the BQ. Very interesting to see it happening on both sides of the Atlantic.

First of all, The Bloc Québecois are not here to make the independance. It's not their goal. Their only goal is to give a true voice for Québec ! Of course, many in the Bloc, Gilles Duceppe in first, are pro-independance. But the question of the Quebec independance is only a provincial Question. It's the goal of the Parti Québecois.

Québecois voted for a federalist party, similar on many point to the Bloc Québecois (many NPD chosen voted for independance in 95' referendum by the way), but with the risk of betrayal.

The only fresh idea that NPD represent, is a last chance to make an united Canada with Quebecois' wishes. Will english Canada accept this ? hum !

How NPD will take the power and keep the Quebec trust safe ? hum ! It's exciting to see it the 5 following years. And theses days, you can see Layton approving the 50%+1 majority for a possible independance referendum !

hum ! Good gods, they could have balls !

What evil plan conservative are preparing... hum ! Increasing the number of seats outside of Quebec, deleting per-vote subsidies... 2 reasons to seperate !

That's ONE major reason to vote NPD ! Quebecois doesn't like conservatives manners ! They voted NPD to SAVE CANADA from a democracy parody, with a little hope of an orange PM.

i think that Emprworm could be happy... thirst Canada, then re-take USA, then.... THE WORLD ahahahaha

Eh ?