Do the Tlielaxu get stupider from book to book?

[Mahdi]

Spoilers for all 6 original books.

In Dune Messiah, our first real introduction to them, the tlielaxu are pretty darn smart. First of all, their organization manages to trick and manipulate the Bene gesserit, the spacing guild, and the Quizarate into helping them discover the key to recovering a Ghola's memories, and then almost manage to capture Put Paul under there control. It is only his supreme will-power that avoids this fate.

Then there is Scytale: One of the main players in the plot, and the liason bewteen all the other great schools, he is much smarter than Edric, and demonstrates this several times, and manupulates the Reverend Mother Mohaim, one of the most powerfull Bene Gesserit, and the Princess Irulan, a less powerfull Bene Gesserit. Then, had it not been for Pauls Oracular vision, he would have tricked him too, as is stated during his time as Lichna.

Then we skip to God-Emperor of Dune: Now they're just a bunch of morons who launch a frontal attack on Leto II even though it obviously won't work. Not only that, but these people who can create genious generals, pure evil beings, and unstoppable soldiers decide to attack using face dancers against Leto's elite bodygaurds!

Then, between GEOD and Heretics they become religious fanatics and create class divisions between "masters" and face dancers, even though, as evidenced in Messiah, and behind the scenes in heretics and chapterhouse, face dancers are far from inferior. There rampant stupidity from GEOD is increased with this new fanaticism, and they end up being nothing more than toys for the Bene Gesserit (whom they completly outclassed back in Messiah) and the Honard Matres, and in the end are wiped out!

How the Tlielaxu from Messiah degenerate into the Tlielaxu in the last three books is beyond me....

[Egeides]

No, it's the books that got stupid :-[

Frank's Tleilaxu always were realist, with debt and dimension, as profound as any real culture may be.

I didn't read Anderson's stuff, but I guess it's a never-ending source of profit to make Tleilaxu control the BG, and next book BG were controlling beneth, and next book someone else was controlling beneth...

And so on, one thing being invented each time to continue.

[NHJ BV]

You have a point, but I think the scenes with Waff negotiating with the Bene Gesserit showed something different. He was very smart there.

[Dunenewt]

No, it's the books that got stupid :-[

Frank's Tleilaxu always were realist, with debt and dimension, as profound as any real culture may be.

Mahdi is only talking about FH's books not the prequels

[Timenn]

Indeed.

The Tleilaxu got themselves eliminated in Chapterhouse, while there could be dozens of tricks to survive. Tleilaxu are masters in genetic engineering, so they could easily made themselves immune to the Honored Matres. And hide themselves around the universe, and strike the weakened surviver of the world.

Maybe it is something about the Tleilaxu being obsolence in the later books, except for their ghola's.

But the later books aren't so good as the early ones anyway...

[Dunenewt]

Maybe the Tleilaxu will return in Dune 7 ;)

[Timenn]

Bleh, I don't want to think of how KJA and Brian Herbert will devastate the Tleilaxu any more...

[Andrew]

In heretics or chapterhouse...(spoilers)

[hide]they manage to take control of a honored mnatres ship and infiltrate their command chain somewhat. The main problem they get is thier face dancers seem to be getting minds of their own and not following orders (or actually becoming the person they are pretending to be) If the Tleilaxu still had 100% control over their face dancers they could have survived better. But their was little they could do to stop the honored matres from destroying them, as they outnumbered them outrageously.[/hide]

[Dante]

Spoilers here already... nonetheless;

[hide] I believe that sooner or later Tleilaxu technology will leave Scytale's mind and be used by another. Possibly the Bene Gesserit. [/hide]