Noah's children

[Acriku]

Hey, if the story of Noah is true, we are all descendants of Noah or his immediate family! Woo! Sucks for the little people they had to drown, but I'm sure it's worth it! Afterall, our world is now rid of evil...err is sort of rid of evil...um, ok all I see is evil, so something went wrong. Oh I know, useless killings of millions of people so we can start the evil all over! Alright! Three cheers for Noah and God!

[Anathema]

Is there any point in this thread? ::)

Other then that: YAAAAAAAAAAAY! :P

[Acriku]

Sparking a debate on the actual use of the flood, among other things :)

[Anathema]

Well maybe God just wanted to clean things up a bit- literally.

[Acriku]

But why cause all those people to die a horrible death when the evil never left? Noah was not pure, he drank and became drunk, danced around naked, committed incest to repopulate the huge earth, etc. Hell why did he even do anything with adam and eve if their descendants were going to die anyways and start with Noah the pure and virtuous old (500) man?

[sneezer3]

Sparking a debate on the actual use of the flood, among other things :)

Well. the thing i hate about debates is whatever people belive there one minded and don't wanna belive anything else EVEN IF THERE WRONG.

Some intresting stuff on that subject

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0272/0272_01.asp

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/5002/5002_01.asp

The point of the flood was. the people where wicked just like they are to day. And god destoryed the earth.

Just like we will 7 years after the rapture and the rapture<I think. maybe its 8> is gonna happen really soon. all <Or has far has i can tell> of the sighns are here. "There shall be Wars And rumors of Wars" Theres alot more but i'm not sure of all of them and they would take a long time to name.

[VigilVirus]

I think it was a mistake to let Noah and his family sirvive - everybody should have drowned and then Earth would indeed be free of evil.

But, hehe, then I wouldn't be writing this ;)

[sneezer3]

But why cause all those people to die a horrible death when the evil never left? Noah was not pure, he drank and became drunk, danced around naked, committed incest to repopulate the huge earth, etc. Hell why did he even do anything with adam and eve if their descendants were going to die anyways and start with Noah the pure and virtuous old (500) man?

Well. adem and eve. He knew there descendants where going to die but he wanted to give man a chance. Right or wrong Man Picked sin.

I think noah got drunk and all that AFTER the flood an importent detail left out.

I don't really know. I guess he wanted to give man another chance.

****

I don't know how much you know about the bible. but if your a christian then chances are you know you'l have to answer for anything & everthing you say or type you'l have to answer for to god almighty and you alone will have to answer whatever wrong thats why you never hear me saying anything ::) In any case don't mean to go off topic.

[Acriku]

Hmm, so the Earth never had any rain, only a lot of dew and mist? *Chuckle* It also says in that comic that God would never destroy the world with rain. Ha! God tricked Noah, because he said with rain, so God is free to destroy the world in any other way he wants. And so did the laws of physics not stand before Noah's time?

1. Light refraction was nonexistant since that was the first rainbow after the flood

2. The baby lived to be over 900 years old, now that's what I call a long life! Perhaps he found the fountain of youth or God let them all live until the ark was made?

3. If there were no light refractions, how did anyone see without them?

The Flood Story is really funny, you guys must be laughing your arse off when you hear of this in church right? Here's another thing:

Since he had to have 2 of every animal, that included insects right? Or did God create them after the Flood, too? If so...

Insects fact sheet

As an idea of how many insects Noah would have had to take on the ark, here is a list of insect orders with the number of species in each (source - Natural History Museum):

* COLLEMBOLA: 6000 eg. springtails

* THYSANURA: 370 e.g.. silverfish

* EPHEMEROPTERA: 2100 eg. mayflies

* ODONATA: 5500 eg. dragonflies

* PLECOPTERA: 2000 eg. stoneflies

* BLATTODEA: 3700 eg. cockroaches

* ISOPTERA: 2300 eg. termites

* MANTODEA: 1800 eg. mantids

* DERMAPTERA: 1800 eg. earwigs

* ORTHOPTERA: 20500 eg. grasshoppers

* PHASMATODEA: 2500 eg. stick insects

* PSCOPTERA: 3200 eg. bark lice

* PHTHIRAPTERA: 3000 eg. biting lice

* HEMIPTERA: 82000 eg. aphids

* THYSANOPTERA: 5000 eg. thrips

* MEGALOPTERA: 250 eg. alderflies

* RAPHIDIOPTERA: 175 eg. snakeflies

* NEUROPTERA: 5000 eg. ant-lions

* COLEOPTERA: 400000 eg. beetles

* MECOPTERA: 400 eg. scorpion flies

* SIPHONAPTERA: 2400 eg. fleas

* DIPTERA: 120000 eg. fruit-flies

* TRICHOPTERA: 10000 eg. caddisflies

* LEPIDOPTERA: 150000 eg. butterflies

* HYMENOPTERA: 130000 eg. ants, bees

giving a grand total of approx. 965420 different species of insect, about a million (and these are just the species known to western science. There could be another several million unknown species). Given a male and female, make that at least two million insects aboard the ark, ranging in size from a millimetre, up to six inches in size, many having extremely specialised requirements for life, (not to mention quite an appetite for eating other insects...).

Creationists object to the idea of "species" aboard the Ark, preferring to use "kind" instead. Thus, instead of having nearly a million beetles running around it (beetles not being known for sitting patiently in their pens), Noah simply had a male and female of one "kind" of beetle from which all the others known today have "diversified" (or "evolved", but let's not mention that word). Now, let's say the Flood happened 4,000 years ago, and there are 400,000 known species of beetle. A quick sum tells us that, on average, 100 new species of beetle have evolved (or been Created) every year from those two original parents. That's two new species of beetle a week! In order to explain the current diversity of life, creationists need to conjure up a form of evolution that proceeds at a rate which would make any biologist fall off her stool in astonishment!

[Acriku]

But why cause all those people to die a horrible death when the evil never left? Noah was not pure, he drank and became drunk, danced around naked, committed incest to repopulate the huge earth, etc. Hell why did he even do anything with adam and eve if their descendants were going to die anyways and start with Noah the pure and virtuous old (500) man?

Well. adem and eve. He knew there descendants where going to die but he wanted to give man a chance. Right or wrong Man Picked sin.

I think noah got drunk and all that AFTER the flood an importent detail left out.

I don't really know. I guess he wanted to give man another chance.

****

I don't know how much you know about the bible. but if your a christian then chances are you know you'l have to answer for anything & everthing you say or type you'l have to answer for to god almighty and you alone will have to answer whatever wrong thats why you never hear me saying anything ::) In any case don't mean to go off topic.

Hmm, so God isn't truly omniscient, since he gave them choices and didn't know which they would pick. And I meant after the Flood, for why would he repopulate the earth before the flood? And why does that matter that it is after the flood, surely Noah did not turn towards the Dark Side (so to speak) right after the flood? Without God's knowing?

[sneezer3]

I think it was a mistake to let Noah and his family sirvive - everybody should have drowned and then Earth would indeed be free of evil.

But, hehe, then I wouldn't be writing this ;)

God don't make mistakes. If he din't and we where made in his imege well. ::)

The bible says "But Noah found grace in the eyes of the lord" and like i said. it was AFTER the flood noah sined and all that.

Now how does that remind me of todays christians.

[VigilVirus]

Dude, he would also have to take some bacteria and viruses into the Arc. Only one of each of course because of binary fission.

[VigilVirus]

Any of you read Paradise Lost? In that book it explains everything about why there's evil in the world from the point of view that God knows everything, but tries not to interfere, Free will so to speak.

[Acriku]

Indeed Vigil, and how did Noah keep the MANY animals from being infected by such viruses/diseases? A lot are fatal, so a couple species could have been wiped out during the voyage!

Tries not to interfere eh? So Noah and the baby boy lived that long on their own? So it suddenly rained for a long time, the earth being changed to fit that much water, and all the kingdoms of organisms wound up at the ark on their own? Not directing this towards you vigil, but if you have an answer I'd be glad to hear it.

[VigilVirus]

Shhh... some of us know that's what happened to dinosaurs, but we're trying to cover it up. Shhhh....

Heh, well, I guess God got angry and decided to kill everyone. But I mean he did not interfere when he knew that all his creations will turn evil (Fallen angels and humans), but he did nothing about it.

[Anathema]

The bible says animals (or at least that's what I always hear). Bacteria are not animals.

Even if he took with him all the animals, allmost all plant life would have died! This would mean there would be no vegetation for any of those animals to eat after the flood, and what's more, no new oxygen!

[sneezer3]

Hmm, so the Earth never had any rain, only a lot of dew and mist? *Chuckle* It also says in that comic that God would never destroy the world with rain. Ha! God tricked Noah, because he said with rain, so God is free to destroy the world in any other way he wants. And so did the laws of physics not stand before Noah's time?

1. Light refraction was nonexistant since that was the first rainbow after the flood

2. The baby lived to be over 900 years old, now that's what I call a long life! Perhaps he found the fountain of youth or God let them all live until the ark was made?

3. If there were no light refractions, how did anyone see without them?

The Flood Story is really funny, you guys must be laughing your arse off when you hear of this in church right? Here's another thing:

Since he had to have 2 of every animal, that included insects right? Or did God create them after the Flood, too? If so...

1 According to the bible i think so.

2 There where a lot more Oxegen. And i'm not sure but i think something was diffrant about the sunlight. The oxegen puesser would be way higher. And you could run faster to.

[Acriku]

So, bacteria showed up with the rainbow? Makes sense ::)

Don't forget that Noah would have had to have made specific climates/environments for some animals for them to survive, e.g. the koala with the fresh eucalyptic leaves, which Noah couldn't have brought on board or brought dry leaves since they need to be fresh with water for the koalas to get their water. The idea of putting all of the animals in an ark has so many complex things involved with it that it boggles the mind how he did it.

[VigilVirus]

That explains it. He only took the animals, because insects, fish, bacteria etc. can sirvive any flood.

[sneezer3]

So, bacteria showed up with the rainbow? Makes sense ::)

Don't forget that Noah would have had to have made specific climates/environments for some animals for them to survive, e.g. the koala with the fresh eucalyptic leaves, which Noah couldn't have brought on board or brought dry leaves since they need to be fresh with water for the koalas to get their water. The idea of putting all of the animals in an ark has so many complex things involved with it that it boggles the mind how he did it.

bacteria could have gotten on bord the ark i think.

Has for the rainbow. It could have just showed up since god wanted it to. In any case its here now and from what i hear it shows god promise not to flood the earth again. that may be in a bible verse i don't know for sure.

[TMA_1]

no no no. You people have never read the hebrew old testament or the talmud and other texts like Josephus and the like.

God "seperated" the waters from the oceans to the heavens in the restoration of earth. The water vapor in the high atmosphere was extremely extremely thick in the original times before the flood. There were also huge holds of water under the surface of the earth. Angels, another race that god created, began to have intercourse with human beings and were trying to mix the human race with their own genetics. This would cause problems because the people had to be pure human in order for christ to die for the sins of the world and many other reasons. God s ent the flood because of their evils of procreating with another alien race that we call angels, or Messangers is what iti s translated to. To purify the human race from interbreeding, he cause major tectonic activity that shot up volcanic dust up into the high atmosphere which happenes whenever large volcanos errupt. But by many vulcanos errupting and plates shifting on the earht. The water vapor canopy which was thick at that time became ionised and fell to the earth. Also when the plates shifted, huge subterrainian oceans filled the surface of the earth. You had huge underground oceans open up and millions upon millions of gallons of water from the vapor canopy flood down. it wasnt like the hard rain you see on a very rainy day. Sheets upon sheets of masses of water fell while huge reservorse of water underneath the surface of the earth flooded up. It covered the whole earth a couple thousand feet. after over a year, the water began to flood back into the earth, bu t because of the excess water that wasnt originally on the surface of the planet, it made the land mass more than 70 % water. It effected the earth so much that an Ice age took place. the earth was still troubled with tectonic activity and thats what we see now.

[Acriku]

But what about the fish that can only survive in certain great pressures, the pressures would have risen for such an amount of water to be poured, or going with the theory that the earth was much flatter back then(with lower mountains, and less water = less pressure, no way the fish could have survived then) and after the flood God raised the mountains back up and also the ocean floors were lowered, creating pressures these fish could sustain in, but where did they come from? Did they appear with the rainbow and diseases/viruses/etc?

Also, some diseases like AIDS need carriers to survive, they can't simply float with the water, they would need carriers, such as the survivors of the flood.

[sneezer3]

But what about the fish that can only survive in certain great pressures, the pressures would have risen for such an amount of water to be poured, or going with the theory that the earth was much flatter back then(with lower mountains, and less water = less pressure, no way the fish could have survived then) and after the flood God raised the mountains back up and also the ocean floors were lowered, creating pressures these fish could sustain in, but where did they come from? Did they appear with the rainbow and diseases/viruses/etc?

Also, some diseases like AIDS need carriers to survive, they can't simply float with the water, they would need carriers, such as the survivors of the flood.

They could have lived inside caves or stayed near the top of the water.

look if you don't belive the bible. i can't help you. What i don't know for a fact i belive by faith. most of the time <Depends on what subject> in the end it turns out to be right.

i din't read all of your post TMA. but no i haven't but i know most of the story & bible from genesis

[The_Sadukar]

Sparking a debate on the actual use of the flood, among other things :)

Well. the thing i hate about debates is whatever people belive there one minded and don't wanna belive anything else EVEN IF THERE WRONG.

Some intresting stuff on that subject

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0272/0272_01.asp

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/5002/5002_01.asp

The point of the flood was. the people where wicked just like they are to day. And god destoryed the earth.

Just like we will 7 years after the rapture and the rapture<I think. maybe its 8> is gonna happen really soon. all <Or has far has i can tell> of the sighns are here. "There shall be Wars And rumors of Wars" Theres alot more but i'm not sure of all of them and they would take a long time to name.

Sneezer, if you wan6t to see the sings you can always see them, there have always been wars and rumors of war.

[Acriku]

What could have lived inside caves or on top of the water? Diseases? Um, I just said some need carriers, like AIDS.