how many Battle for Dune's units really from the novel???

[yevon]

hmm... I am very sorry if my English grammar is terrible.

 

We all know that Emperor: Battle For Dune is one great video game about Dune series. But everytimes I play this game, I always want to know that: " how many unit in this game really exist in novel?". Of course, BFD is the great game, but if almost of their unit and Structures actually is , it will be more " Westwood's game" than " Westwood's game which based on Frank Herbert's Dune novels".

 

Okay, Until now, we know that almost faction in game is from the novel: house Atreides, Harkonnen, Sardaukar, Freemen, Guild, Ix and Tleilaxu is really from the novel. Ordos is only one exception.

 

But if we talking about units, weapons and structures, I don't really know how many among them really be take from the novel. I only realize that:

 

- Harvester

- Freemen Fedaykin who can use Weirding Modules and can riding worm.

- Atreides's Sonic Tank based on Weirding Modules's idea, because Paul Atreides is the man who teaching this weapon to his Freemen.

 

 

Anyone know that how many more BFD's unit is from novel, too?

 

 

Actually, I don't know why Westwood don't add Face Dancer into game ( spy/assassin unit) and Bene Gesserit ( some unit look like Red Alert 2's Yuri, who can control everyone's mind).

[X3M]

The main base of the Atreides and the Harkonnen are both just 1 Palace for all I know.

 

The sonic tank is not part of it. There are no tanks in the Novel. Only Ornithopters, Carryalls and Harvesters. The rest are Rifle Infantry (actually they use las weapons)

 

Ordos are mentioned somewhere? Although, ask the pro about that.

[yevon]

The sonic tank is not part of it. There are no tanks in the Novel. Only Ornithopters, Carryalls and Harvesters. The rest are Rifle Infantry (actually they use las weapons)

 

 

 

Actually, I mean that sonic tank based on idea about Atreides's Weirding Modules. " If they product sonic beam gun for their soldier, may be they really have some tank which using Weirding Modules, too". Something like that. It is Westwood's idea, but it still based on one novel's technology.

 

Continuing, I think:

 

- The knife which Imperial Sardaukar unit use to melee, actually it is kindjal. In novel, they Sardaukar used it when they attacked Atreides on Arrakis.

- Windtrap structures really exist in novel

- Harkonnen Palace's Death Hand Missile may be is one type of Atomic weapon.

[MrFlibble]

I've moved this to the Duniverse forum which seems more appropriate.

To answer your question: almost no units in Emperor are based directly on infantry and vehicles described in Frank Herbert's books. The main problem is that the game uses a fairly standard Command & Conquer-like combat model, which includes firearms, armour piercing projectiles and explosives, and various infantry infantry types alongside armoured vehicles. Whereas the books depict primarily medieval/Renaissance/early Modern mêlée fighting with blade weapons, with occasional use of lasguns (compare late medieval use of firearms). Also, the books mention in passing that 'thopters are armed with some kind of missiles, and there are supposedly ground vehicles as well, however this is never specifically elaborated upon, and ground vehicles, with the exception of harvesters (which are more like mobile factories than anything as described by FH), are never used on Dune because of the worms.

That said, I'd suppose that probably only Sardaukar commanders in Emperor do not contradict the books because they use knives and lasguns. Everything else hardly counts because of the prominent use of firearms.

As for the "weirding modules", those do not exist in the Dune universe. They were specifically created as a part of the plot of David Lynch's film adaptation, and then adopted by Westwood for their games.

 

Ordos are mentioned somewhere? Although, ask the pro about that.

House Ordos is mentioned twice in the Dune Encycplopaedia, with very little info (IIRC their share of CHOAM holdings and number of votes in the Landsraad). Westwood guys thought it was cool for some reason, and incorporated this House into Dune II (however the Ordos herald in the games, the one with the snake and the book, actually belongs to a different House, Wallach, in the Encyclopaedia).

 

Bene Gesserit ( some unit look like Red Alert 2's Yuri, who can control everyone's mind).

Actually, there is a certain similarity between the two:

[Nyerguds]

Actually, I mean that sonic tank based on idea about Atreides's Weirding Modules. " If they product sonic beam gun for their soldier, may be they really have some tank which using Weirding Modules, too". Something like that. It is Westwood's idea, but it still based on one novel's technology.

Weirding modules are a fabrication of the Lynch movie. They're not in the books. The "weirding ways" are the Bene Gesserit training to achieve absolute control over one's own body.

[X3M]

So no sonic blasts in the books?

[Nyerguds]

Nope. No sonic weapons. Just super ninja fighter Fremen.

[X3M]

What about doctor Robotnik blasts?

I think you know what I mean, even though it sounds like a joke.

[TeamWolf]

Emperor was like Dune 2/2000 where it's an alt universe in Dune.

 

Only things that are really in the game from the novels are some las weaponry, shields, worms and Great Houses.

[vota dc]

Atreides infantry being faster than Harkonnen is in the book: the emperor fear them because they are very well trained (Sardaukar are better trained but they have a badass planet, Fremen have a even more badass planet, don't remember why Atreides from the lush Caladan are so strong....I suppose it is because great trainer since even Giedi Prime has a better natural enviroment  for this purpose) and that translate in game as faster and with more hp, too bad they don't have melee so the rifle does his job to lower the difference.

[X3M]

In one of the games we have ice (dune 2000)

I am not sure, but also in EBfD?

 

Is there really a polar cap on Dune in the novel? Or is this the biggest !#%& ?

[MrFlibble]

Yes, the first book mentions polar caps as a part of the unusual ecosystem on Arrakis. Mining ice for water met with some difficulties though IIRC.

However, in Emperor at least ice is just used to signify the Ordos capital - as if they could "terraform" the area to match their homeworld. The Harkonnen capital on Arrakis is also made to look more like Giedi Prime.

I'm not sure about the ice in Dune 2000 though. I think icy terrain was either on some pre-release screenshots or in certain maps added by the v1.06 patch. Dune 2000 could actually be more true to the books in some respects - to the extent at which any Westwood Dune game could be true to the original novels that is.

[X3M]

You could say that ice is a very important resource on Dune. Moreover, the wetsuits, are they needed in the icy regions?

It also makes no sense of having snow and ice on dune, and then immidiately a transent into dessert or rocks. You would expect some vegetation right in between. Right?

What is the reason why there is no vegetation? With influence for over 1000 years by other planets you would expect at least some plants. At least there is a dessert mouse.

[Davidu]

There is vegetation and animals on Dune, just not so abundant as on Earth. In the books there is a whole list of plants and animals that inhabit the planet, it's just that most of the planet is covered in sand and dust. Also the dryness makes any attempt at agriculture futile because the water will evaporeate very fast and not feed the crops.

 

So basically any area with rocks should have some desert plants with it. I guess that both Cryo and Westwood wanted to make the world as alien as possible and enhance the "mineral" feeling to it.

[MrFlibble]

You could say that ice is a very important resource on Dune. Moreover, the wetsuits, are they needed in the icy regions?

I don't recall anything about the use of stillsuits on the polar region. It is scarcely mentioned, and the Fremen apparently did not live there.

I briefly checked the first book now, it mentions a "water-shipper whose summer mansion was near his polar-cap factory", suggesting that polar ice was indeed mined for water. But an earlier passage in the chapter which introduces the Harkonnens also mentions that the polar caps are very small.

It also makes no sense of having snow and ice on dune, and then immidiately a transent into dessert or rocks. You would expect some vegetation right in between. Right?

What is the reason why there is no vegetation? With influence for over 1000 years by other planets you would expect at least some plants.

The unusual ecology of Arrakis was created by the life cycle of the sandworm.

[Davidu]

Maybe the polar caps are small compared to the size of the planet as polar cap / planet size % compared to other planets. Mining the polar caps wouldn't deplete them so fast as a lot of water is imported via Guild and also produced locally (remember the dew gatherers). Also the fremen have their windtraps.

[X3M]

This is what they made out of it.

 

http://dune.wikia.com/wiki/Arrakis/DE

 

But pardon me, I think we are starting to go off topic here. And I am to blame.

I wanted to mention the "Ice" units from Ordos and how they are very adapt to their world.

If there are polar caps, is there a part of the story telling on those polar caps? What did they do there and use there?

[Davidu]

Well it is normal for a planet to have colder areas around the poles, therefore ice caps form, as it is the case on Dune. As the planet was desertified the ice caps shrunk but did not dissapear. Water is still present but not abundant.

 

The polar caps are used for ice mining and just about that I guess... It would be interesting to have some missions there, but I guess that was never implemented.

 

In the books only briefly they are mentioned, as geological info and as political and economical significance (water dealers and ice miners were quite powerful). Other than that, no...

[Nyerguds]

Yes, the first book mentions polar caps as a part of the unusual ecosystem on Arrakis. Mining ice for water met with some difficulties though IIRC.

However, in Emperor at least ice is just used to signify the Ordos capital - as if they could "terraform" the area to match their homeworld. The Harkonnen capital on Arrakis is also made to look more like Giedi Prime.

You're misremembering that, MrFlibble. Those specific missions were actually invasions of these homeworlds. It wasn't on Dune.

[MrFlibble]

I beg to differ:

Emperor: Battle For Dune - Atreides Campaign - Assault on the Ordos Capital

The Ordos capital on Dune is built on ice. Cool huh? The next mission then takes place on their icy homeworld, Draconis IV.

[X3M]

What is in the game, is it in the book?

Did they do terraforming on Dune in the book?

[Nyerguds]

I beg to differ:

Emperor: Battle For Dune - Atreides Campaign - Assault on the Ordos Capital

The Ordos capital on Dune is built on ice. Cool huh? The next mission then takes place on their icy homeworld, Draconis IV.

Still, don't think the same applies to the Harkonnen...

 

What is in the game, is it in the book?

Did they do terraforming on Dune in the book?

Terraforming? It's just the planet's ice caps. There are beta shots of Dune 2000 that feature them too.

[MrFlibble]

Still, don't think the same applies to the Harkonnen...

Let's Play Emperor Battle For Dune (Atreides Chapter 2 part 4)

Harkonnens have metallic stuff, also there are toxic waste pools on the map etc.

What I did forget is the Atreides capital. Apparently they have white marble with occasional patches of greenery:

Let's Play Emperor Battle for Dune (Ordos Chapter 2 part 4)

[Nyerguds]

Huh. Interesting. I never knew that.

Still, the Ordos one was obviously just the ice caps. They just settled on familiar terrain. :P