Dafuq? Harkonnen Takes Ordos Homeworld!(and nukes the campaign)

[atrd3m0n]

So i was being nostalgic and playing some campaign. After some time I had most of the Arrakis map conquered besides a few spots.

Somehow Harkonnen creeped up their territory adjacent to the Ordos Homeworld and at a computer's turn, it decided to go for it, and succeeced in the move. Then.. it totally screwed my campaign as it came up with this screen Select homeworld to attack and i couldnt click or select anything or quit out of it. Worst part, it actually saved it like that and there is no way to normally quit the game besides ending it in taskmanager.

I'll also attach the savefile of the game

I have never ever heard of this happening to someone so i thought it was pretty unique, lol...

http://u.cubeupload.com/Min3max20/14aHarkonnenConquersOrd.png

http://u.cubeupload.com/Min3max20/981HarkonnenConquersOrd.png

http://u.cubeupload.com/Min3max20/HarkonnenConquersOrd.png

ATREIDES Chapter 3.zip

[NodFan]

THIS IS INSANE!!!

I PLAYED EMPEROR FOR AT LEAST A DECADE (10 years) AND I NEVER KNEW THE COMPUTER COULD ATTACK HOME TERRITORIES.

[Feda]

Holy shit, this thing is definitely unique.. Lol. And Harks even beated ordos and took the territory, nice :D

[NodFan]

Since you can select anything in "Select Homeworld to attack" then this shows that Emperor battle for dune was unfinished, who knows what would have really happened if an enemy house took over the other enemy houses capital.

Heck I was trying to figure out if the Enemy house could attack your capital and if so does it either replay the first mission or do you start with a huge base?.

[darkd3th]

Its true you have to be careful. It happened to me back in the day lol

[Mr_Hangman]

Ha, I didn't know that could happen either. I have tried to get my own homeworld attack, after a few losses the game gave me a game over. I wonder what the exact condition for it was though:

-Was it because I lost too many total battles?

-Perhaps it's based on victories minus losses?

-Lost too many consecutive battles?

-Maybe once a particular territory is lost, you get a game over?

If it's the second or third option, then maybe you could get the homeworld attacked if things went just right...

[atrd3m0n]

I think you can get your homeworld attacked if you just keep giving up territory to the enemy when they make a move for it (resign) i did that sometimes to have a nice battle on grounds i usually never get to fight on cause i start with them already under my control

just fight one enemy and let the other one 'steal' your territories without defending them. i haven't actually tried it though, usually i'll just bash my way through but leave some spots to max out the campaign

and man i forgot what a bitch the last mission was with harkonnen on hard :D

[Mr_Hangman]

Ok, I think I've worked out the precise game over conditions, and consequently, how you might get your howeworld attacked. First off, the tutorial mission cannot be lost, because you will always get new reinforcements if you lose all your units. However, losing any of the other scripted missions is an immediate game over.

Between the tutorial mission and the heighliner mission, and between the heighliner mission and the homeworld defense mission, each house gets one turn, so you'll attack once and defend once. Losing these four battles will in no way contribute to a game over. So if you want to get attacked at the homeworld, you ideally will retreat on your attacks, then save in the debriefing, then you can reload until the territory you want taken is attacked. You should retry until one of your opponents has pushed inward two territories.

After the homeworld defending mission is phase three of the campaign. Normally this continues until you capture one of the enemy homeworlds. You get a game over for losing a total of five battles in this phase. They do not have to be consequtive, and they can be either attack or defense missions, and it doesn't matter if you won or lost in the first two phases of the campaign. You might maximize the chance of your homeworld being attacked by resigning whenever one opponent attacks deeper into your territory, but on attack battles you should attack the other enemy and win, so as not to add to your loss total. Always save in the debriefings after an attack mission.

I don't know what the odds are of opponents attacking one territory or another, or what the odds are of which opponent attacks you (for example is it random, or do they tend to retaliate?). In theory they only have to capture three regions before the can attack the home territory, and you can take at most six losses without getting a game over. I'm going to give it a try.

Edit: Well now I've noticed an annoying trend, it seems the computer's attack orders are already determined by the time you complete your attack mission. Whether you save during the battle or afterward, it always does the same thing. So if it's determined when you select a territory to attack, I next need to find if their choice is randomly selected then, or if it's deterministic. If it's the latter, it may be a problem getting them to attack the desired territory.

However, I think a simple edit to a game file would allow you to lose many more times. Within CAMPAIGN0001.RFH, there's a text file called PhaseRules.txt. On line 36, it says "Lose 5". Changing that to, say, "Lose 25" ought to allow me to resign all the territories. It'll be interesting to see how the game responds to all the territories being captured, especially the home territory.

[NodFan]

Dont special missions happen like a trigger btw.

Lets say if I was playing as House Atreides and If I lost my Capital to House Harkonnen and then the Harkonnen last mission loads (cuz they took a capital) and I get to have Ordos, Tileaxu, Guild, and Fremen on my side.

It would be cool (even stupid at the same time) to play as the losing side as the losers all team up against the winner.

[Mr_Hangman]

The trigger for the heighliner and homeworld defense missions are just one campaign turn being completed, whatever happens in those turns doesn't matter. The final missions are triggered by capturing the enemy capital. Whether getting your own capital captured would also trigger such a mission... I doubt it, but it's possible. I have no way of looking at the actual game code, just some data that are conveniently stored in text files, from which I was able to figure out what I know so far.

[Rykuss]

Happened to me many years ago. I sat there dumbfounded for quite a while.

[NodFan]

Ok, I think I've worked out the precise game over conditions, and consequently, how you might get your howeworld attacked. First off, the tutorial mission cannot be lost, because you will always get new reinforcements if you lose all your units. However, losing any of the other scripted missions is an immediate game over.

Between the tutorial mission and the heighliner mission, and between the heighliner mission and the homeworld defense mission, each house gets one turn, so you'll attack once and defend once. Losing these four battles will in no way contribute to a game over. So if you want to get attacked at the homeworld, you ideally will retreat on your attacks, then save in the debriefing, then you can reload until the territory you want taken is attacked. You should retry until one of your opponents has pushed inward two territories.

After the homeworld defending mission is phase three of the campaign. Normally this continues until you capture one of the enemy homeworlds. You get a game over for losing a total of five battles in this phase. They do not have to be consequtive, and they can be either attack or defense missions, and it doesn't matter if you won or lost in the first two phases of the campaign. You might maximize the chance of your homeworld being attacked by resigning whenever one opponent attacks deeper into your territory, but on attack battles you should attack the other enemy and win, so as not to add to your loss total. Always save in the debriefings after an attack mission.

I don't know what the odds are of opponents attacking one territory or another, or what the odds are of which opponent attacks you (for example is it random, or do they tend to retaliate?). In theory they only have to capture three regions before the can attack the home territory, and you can take at most six losses without getting a game over. I'm going to give it a try.

Edit: Well now I've noticed an annoying trend, it seems the computer's attack orders are already determined by the time you complete your attack mission. Whether you save during the battle or afterward, it always does the same thing. So if it's determined when you select a territory to attack, I next need to find if their choice is randomly selected then, or if it's deterministic. If it's the latter, it may be a problem getting them to attack the desired territory.

However, I think a simple edit to a game file would allow you to lose many more times. Within CAMPAIGN0001.RFH, there's a text file called PhaseRules.txt. On line 36, it says "Lose 5". Changing that to, say, "Lose 25" ought to allow me to resign all the territories. It'll be interesting to see how the game responds to all the territories being captured, especially the home territory.

so any luck?

was your capital attacked?

[THE AQIB]

tha hel.... neva knew they cud... thts interesting....

[DoMiNaNt_HuNtEr]

I know this thread is very old but this is amazing, especially Mr hangman's research.

[X3M]

Wasted potential, honestly.
Could have been one of the first RTS games with alternate endings.
And not like how Kane lets the player choose a target for the Ion Cannon.

[DoMiNaNt_HuNtEr]

Found a link of some messages. Some guy read all of Mr. Hangman's research and followed up on it, continued the research. His English isn't that great but you can understand what he's saying. His name is Yowane s fan, his first post below in the comments:

https://sharehub.pro/forum/main/discussion/91344-modding__experimenting_in_the_game_emperor_battle_for_dune/

Edited June 18, 2023 by DoMiNaNt_HuNtEr