New Cold War: 2004-????

[Andrew]

http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/2004/11/17/russia-missiles-041117.html

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/11/17/russia.putin/index.html

MOSCOW - New nuclear weapons systems being developed in Russia could include a missile designed to defeat the U.S. missile defence shield.

Wow, they are developing weapons to defeat the US missles. Should be fun to watch.

This sucks, why couldn't we be developing something better for mankind than a better nuclear weapon.

Or am I too quick to judge that this will not be good for anyone. (along with Bush's defense shield aka star wars)

[Davidu]

Well, since Russia didn't agree with US's missle defence, they had to do something. Something else. That's all I suppose.

[Anathema]

It was to be expected after the US flushed the ABM treaty through the toilet.

[Dude_Doc]

Last time I read, Russia and the USA had 5000 nukes each. They are both supposed to scrap about 3000 each before 2012. But since both countries are capitalistic democracies, I don't see any reason why they should put up another arms-race.

[Emperor Harkonnen]

finally russia is trying to regain their past glory. We need more than one superpower

I hope the Soviet Union will rise again

[Anathema]

Well I'm sure that *most* people would not like to see the Soviet Union rise again. And I don't think this would trigger an arms race, Washington didn't respond with surprise or shock (I wonder if they even care)

Besides, missiles will remain effective despite "star wars". The US put an axe through the program because it wasn't technologlicly viable. Why Bush chose to start funding it again is beyond me.

[Dude_Doc]

That's because he is an alien.

The only "treath" I see is the treath of terrorism, and maybe the formation of another superpower, for example, Iran. Or, if Palestine get their own nuclear arsenal...  8)

[AWACS]

United States 

Strategic nuclear missiles

7,300

Tactical nuclear missiles

3,200-4,700

Total nuclear weapons

10,500-12,000

Russia

Strategic nuclear missiles

6,000

Tactical nuclear missiles

7,000-15,000

Total nuclear weapons

13,000-20,000  [EDIT] a lot of these are in reserve

as of august 2002

[Davidu]

I seriously doubt that Iran will rise as a superpower anytime soon.

[Caid Ivik]

Strategically, main opponent of Russia will be soon more China and muslim world than USA. Strong tactical nuclear arsenal is best choice against chinese hordes. Not saying that China wouldn't be able even to track any average russian craft flying with the most primitive bomb over them.

[Davidu]

The Chinese are quite silent over there. Are they brewing something?

[Dude_Doc]

I seriously doubt that Iran will rise as a superpower anytime soon.

Well, we will see if they will have nukes within a couple of years. They are still opposing the United States in almost every way, so I don't see any reason why they wouldn't develop nuclear capabilities.

Strategically, main opponent of Russia will be soon more China and muslim world than USA. Strong tactical nuclear arsenal is best choice against chinese hordes. Not saying that China wouldn't be able even to track any average russian craft flying with the most primitive bomb over them.

China has nuclear weapons too, you know. Besides, just like the United States, the Chinese have also adopted the market economy so I doubt there will be any treaths at all. The closest thing is the conflict around Taiwan.

[Emperor Harkonnen]

well if China attacks Russia, Nato should help them. nevertheless at the current situation I doubt that China would have beaten Russia.

[HasimirFenring]

well if China attacks Russia, Nato should help them. nevertheless at the current situation I doubt that China would have beaten Russia.

Neither side would win that conflict...  Nuclear winter brings universal defeat.

[Davidu]

The chinese would outnumber the russians to defeat. That's clear.

[Emperor Harkonnen]

I said at the moment. if you look at the army sizes of china and russia you will see that russia has a larger standing army and a much larger navy. Chinas army is around 500.000 troops. dunno about Russia, but I know it is among the largest in the world.

Many people think that russias army just magically dissapeared after the fall of the soviet union.

[Davidu]

It quite did fora while. After the fall of USSR they were loft with the parade army only. And now they have huge number of mercenaries.

[exatreide]

as gulf war 1 should show you.....the size of the army has nothing to do with the victor.

[Dude_Doc]

if you look at the army sizes of china and russia you will see that russia has a larger standing army and a much larger navy... Chinas army is around 500.000 troops.

Really?

Its 2.5 million strong force makes it the largest army, in terms of sheer number of troops, in the world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peoples_Liberation_Army

[Anathema]

That they have 2.5 million troops on paper doesn't say anything about their potential. Probably they just sit around all day picking from their noses, and in a confrontation they'd get obliberated or at least halted by the few troops Russia could muster.

Besides I don't think it will ever come to that, China's economy is growing rapidly but doesn't have enough natural recources to power its economy in the long run. Russia though has extensive oil fields and raw materials, so it's not unimaginable that they'll become best friends in the future.

[Dude_Doc]

That they have 2.5 million troops on paper doesn't say anything about their potential. Probably they just sit around all day picking from their noses, and in a confrontation they'd get obliberated or at least halted by the few troops Russia could muster.

Firstly, China has a smaller area to move it's troops on. Russia's army is probably more consentrated on Chechnya and the western part of Russia. China is also protected by the Gobi desert, a useless wasteland Russian forces will have to pass over.

Besides I don't think it will ever come to that, China's economy is growing rapidly but doesn't have enough natural recources to power its economy in the long run. Russia though has extensive oil fields and raw materials, so it's not unimaginable that they'll become best friends in the future.

Perhaps not, but you have to know that Russia's resources are located in the cold parts of the country, like Siberia for example. It would take tremendous amounts of money to just get there, to set up all conditions for the people who will work in those mines and all, not to mention the freezing temperature. Yes, there are resources there, but there are no resources to get them.

Though, eventually it will come in the future. And by then China will have gotten more power and stronger economy.

[Caid Ivik]

Economy in northern Asia is more russocentrist. Centroasian turkish states like Kazachstan or Turcomany are dependant on Russian infrastructure, Mongoly is a "freeport" for investments mostly from Russia and Europe, while China orientates itself more for India and asian Southeast, what are mostly poorer countries. In short, Russia has still a potential, while China is already losing it.

[Davidu]

I actualy heard that North Korea has the most powerful and numerous army in the world: about 5 million.

And yeah, Russia is developing a market economy, but it's still way behind. China has potential, some resources, population and the WILL to do something. Did you know they launched a man in space (or so I heard). They even want to build their own space station.

[Andrew]

And get to Mars before USA.

[Davidu]

And what if the manage to do that?  :O

They'll start colonising and mining for resorces... and they might become unstopable. Vital space for population as well.