starwars.com

[bob_fox]

I recently popped over to the official Star Wars website, and I saw one or two interesting things there.

Apparently, the 'new villain' for Episode III will be some kind of half-man half-robot hybrid by the name of General Grievous.

Also, there's a forum there on what Episode III should be called. The best suggestion I saw was 'Dark Force Rising' (from a book in Timothy Zahn's Star Wars trilogy). A funny one I saw on http://www.theforce.net was 'Return of the Fake Backrounds.' ;D

What do you guys think would be a good title (if indeed anybody here cares about Star Wars anymore)?

[Andrew]

Star War: Official Rip-off of Dune

Sounds great. :)

[TMA_1]

the name sucks, might as well call him major pain.lol

[Mahdi]

the name sucks, might as well call him major pain.lol

They can't.  There already was a movie and character called Major Payne.  They'd be sued.

[Scott]

How bout: Star Wars - The Search for Originality

General Grevious? Apparently Lucas has resorted to pillaging the dictionary for character names. Sidious, Tyrannous, Maul, Jar Jar? When will it end?

[bob_fox]

Yeah, it is a stupid name.

Anyway, Darth Vader and Emperor Palpatine are by far the best Star Wars villains. Darth Maul doesn't even come close. I liked Count Dooku a lot, though (Dracula is back!).

Star War: Official Rip-off of Dune

Sounds great. :)

??? I don't quite understand you - Star Wars is very different from Dune. Or do you mean specifically the 'new' Star Wars movies (i.e. The Phantom Menace, Attack of the Clones)? Although, I still don't really get it because the stories are rather different. ???

[Andrew]

Nah, just bringing up how Dune and Star Wars have so much in common in the first film.

http://www.dune2k.com/?page=community-articles&show=swanddune

[Scott]

http://www.jitterbug.com/origins/dune.html

Same as above, covers some of the origins of StarWars aswell as Dune.

[bob_fox]

I'm sorry, but I still don't see enough similarities for Frank Herbert to get upset.

For one thing, Tatooine is used as a 'springboard' for the plot of Star Wars, whereas in Dune the whole story revolves around the ecology of Arrakis.

Yes, you can list a large amount of similarities, but when I read Dune and saw the movie (after I had watched Star Wars), not one of those similarities popped into my head, and I think it's the same with most people.

But I do agree that Star Wars owes a debt to Dune. Dune was the first successful 'broad scope' sci-fi adventure. Perhaps if Dune hadn't come out, the idea of Star Wars would never have come to Lucas. Goerge could've ended his credits with 'thanks to Frank Herbert for the inspiration,' or something like that.

[Jack Leaf]

"Thanks for writing an excellent book so I could do a rip-off"

[bob_fox]

I wouldn't quite say rip-off. Did you see the list of similarities listed? Some of them have merit, like the comparison of the Voice with the Force, but many are just stupid. I think I saw one attempting to draw a line between the Tuscans and the Fremen, which is laughable.

I don't know if you guys ever saw Twelve Monkeys, but they got the idea for the movie from a French film where a man sees himself get shot (this involves time travel). The whole of Twelve Monkeys springs from this one idea. Still, the movie is not considered a 'rip-off' because it flows in its own direction. Now, there is more of a difference between Star Wars and Dune than there is between the French film just mentioned (which is really just a collection of photos) and Twelve Monkeys.

Oh, I just thought I'd mention that the classic trilogy of Star Wars is coming out on DVD in September.

[nemafakei]

"Tuscans"

The name was probably from the tribe that inhabited Etruria.

As to this 'Grievance'... it does sound rather tacky. I mean, sometimes things like that do just about work (Anyone read any of the Thomas Covenant books?), but there has to be a point to doing that.

[Dunenewt]

I have read the first of the books: Lord Foul's Bane

[SpiceGuid]

I don't know if you guys ever saw Twelve Monkeys, but they got the idea for the movie from a French film where a man sees himself get shot (this involves time travel). The whole of Twelve Monkeys springs from this one idea. Still, the movie is not considered a 'rip-off' because it flows in its own direction. Now, there is more of a difference between Star Wars and Dune than there is between the French film just mentioned (which is really just a collection of photos) and Twelve Monkeys.

The French film is "La Jet

[bob_fox]

Yes, that is the French film! I couldn't remember how to spell it.

A movie is a rip-off whether it acknowledges that or not. But, of course, Twelve Monkeys is not a rip-off and neither is Star Wars.

Yes, Dune is much deeper. But movies often make more money, and the Dune movie did not match up to Star Wars. Besides, as you said, Star Wars appeals more to the masses.

But listing a bunch of similarities like 'both of Luke's parents died, just as Paul's father died' (which is hardly similar) is not going to convince me that Lucas made a rip-off.

And I think there has been a lot of complaining going around now because feel Episodes I and II just do not eqaul the other three episodes, and I completely agree with them. Star Wars is becoming yet another mindless action sci-fi.

[Scott]

Originally the first few drafts of StarWars were a direct lift and almost scene for scene "homage" to Akira Kurosawa's "The Hidden Fortress". Lucas eventually developed the script to include ideas and elements borrowed from many other different sources. It's not just Dune thats be "borrowed" from.

Jodorowsky once said that when StarWars was released, it largely resembled the style of the Dune that he was slated to create.

Although its not original, it should be recognized as a great film because it sadly is. All of these borrowed elements come together beautifully, although they're not entirely Lucas's. It doesn't help that the overall sales generated by the StarWars franchise numbers in the billions. For us viewers that are aware that parts of Dune were absorbed into StarWars, it cheapens the film and our opinions on it and its creator.

[bob_fox]

Anyway, there were many Star Wars movies after Episode IV that borrowed nothing from Dune.

Everybody borrows from someone else. But even so, I think it's strange that so many people here think Star Wars has 'stolen' from Dune. I know people who've read/seen both Dune and Star Wars and see no connection. You tell them stuff like 'Luke knows about Leia before he even meets her and Paul dreams about Chani before he meets her' and they'll laugh. It just doesn't cheapen it for me at all (what does is all the fake backrounds in Star Wars I and II).

But let's stop this comparison - it's going nowhere (I know, I get the last word! ;)). We don't want to start a 'you're wrong,' 'no, you're wrong' thing.

I don't think they'll get rid of ol' Hayden C. He stinks! 'He's holding me back'!

[Andrew]

Spaceballs copied off of StarWars.

;D

[bob_fox]

Yes, very funny. Mel Brooks rules!

I think Robin Hood: Men in Tights was better, though. I also like High Anxiety, which is a rather older movie of his.