the christian double standards

[TMA_1]

This kinda confused me, when I was in highschool awhile back a teacher who was teaching world religions was going into christianity.

before I start I must explain that he was a student teacher, and made many many mistakes, glaring ones. For example he said zeroastrianism is a dead religion... I could show others...

anyways he explained to us during the talks of christianity's early history really did not have much hardships. He said even that there really was hardly any killings of christians, even though there are many documented cases of multipule emperors who did kill christians as athiests of the roman religion, as well as other condemnations like being revolutionaries.

He also talked much about the horrible atrocities of the christian church when it became a powerhouse. He explained many tortures that have been found in history, which are all true, but the problem I have with it is he never once explained the horrible atrocities of islam when we studied islam, and never explained the horrible things that certain sects of buddhism (which suprisingly did happen, like killing and whatnot).

It was like a double standard, and when he talked about christianity not being tortured in the early history of it, it was like saying there was no hallocaust of the jews during and before ww2...

Dont get me wrong, there werent nearly as many christians killed as there were jews during that period of torture, but there were thousands of christians killed. It just seems outragious to me.

It is also annoying that he pointed out the flaws of the christian history, which does exist. christians have done some absolutely horrible things, but he never mentioned the horrible things of other religions, I am absolutely serious. it just bothers me that there is such a double standard, and it isnt only me but other people recognize it.

He would also whne talking about other religions try to show them in an obviously positive light, showing how beautiful and wonderful they were. and said they werent at all violent. Now there is reason for this, as many people brand religions like islam as violent, which it isnt. Still though it is a horrible double standard.

I just noticed this because it happens a lot. I am not trying to start arguments, jus want to see if anybody else has noticed this. I hope I am not the only one.

[Caid Ivik]

You can't make such judgement over christians when you take only one person. I have a big french history book, which makes christians a bloodlust scum and heroes from muslim or buddhist warriors. Should I than say all French have double standards? Nonsense, just everyone who talks about history has his favorite side. When I read about first crusade my first thought is "how perfectly they kicked those turkish asses", altough of course, it was our aggression.

[TMA_1]

hmm, I wasent implying that all people make double standards about this issue, or even a certain group, just sayinbg that there are double standards. I thought I was pretty clear with that.

know what you mean though caid.

[Caid Ivik]

That we call art of rhetorics. When I talk with EdricO, I try to show as much advantages of liberal market as possible. I wouldn't bother to mention things lack of control causes slavery.

[Egeides]

I agree with Caid but I'd add that it is true that some people have a bias. When I say a bias, I mean that we can point out that certain elements are out when they shouldn't be. The problem with defining what is a bias and where there are some isn't easy, espescially since I don't believe in being perfectly true since I am not perfect. You still can detect a bias when two different subject are treated differently, but getting a scheme on how to treat a subjet would be needed first to be concise.

Personally, I remember one of my religion teacher saying me that Hinduism was "worship of cows and humans with elephant heads" and continuing on these kinds of exterior elements instead of disucussing the religion itself. He did pretty much the same for other religions. But for Christianity, he didn't do that at all... While I cannot make a complete demonstration that there is a bias, my first sense of this makes me think so...

[Emperor Harkonnen]

I have had the exact same thoughts TMA. I also think that history teachers only complain about what we did wrong and how many we murdered, but never mentioning what other cultures did. This is what I experience in almost all subjects.

and once I wrote about the crusades and mentioned horribly things Islam did in Enligsh subject, the teacher critisized this and gave me lower grade because of that. I wrote my exact opinions, which I will stop doing in school, cus I only get a low grade then.

so this history teacher of yours was probably hated christianity in some way and wanted other religions to seem better.

[ordos45]

Back in 10th grade we covered major religions as part of the curriculum, it was built into the textbook on the basis that we needed to know what each culture believed in order to properly learn.

I was lucky enough to have a balanced teacher.  If there was an atrocity amongst a religion's followers he'd point it out.  Christian atrocities during chapters with Christianity, Muslim atrocities during chapters with Islam, etc.

[Filo]

One thing amazes me, I didn't know that western countries have religious programs at school. Lay school, I mean.

In France, we haven't ; except for christian schools, buddhist schools, muslim school, etc.

It's seems to me that it can be difficult to teach all the religions impartially when you are involved in a particular one, or when you hate it. Proselytism (pro or con) can be easily a subtile danger.

Has everybody here religious programs at school? Which countries?

[Acriku]

TMA, perhaps that's just the universe balancing out by having teachers be increasing vocal about Christianity's atrocities, instead of the daily appeals to Christianity here in the Bible belt. If so, then it has a lot of catching up to do  :O

[ordos45]

Has everybody here religious programs at school? Which countries?

No real religious programs in our public school, but sometimes it will be discussed in history classes as mentioned above.  Most of my teachers do anything they can to avoid discussing religion though.

[TMA_1]

yeah ordos is right, it is a secular look at the history of religion, and because of that you have to show the good and the bad, that is just how history should be taught.

The problem is when teachers show more bad than good, or both bad and good on one religion, and then speak little of the evils another religion committed. I should say followers of a religion committed.

[Caid Ivik]

I would say few people, which had many attributes while their religion was one of them (and possibly had no influence on their acts), commited it. We can see in history books terms like "christian colonists destroyed Inca empire". Were in Bible is then written, that lust for gold is a christian attribute? I'm the last one who should question Pizzaro's piety, but THIS has nothing with religion...

[filecore]

Has everybody here religious programs at school? Which countries?

Gosh, you amaze me in return.  I had always assumed that most other Western countries have religious classes in supposedly non-religious or lay schools as a matter of course.  I myself had Religious Education classes where we learned about all religions - it wasn't from a historical perspective, but rather (for example) what the beliefs of Buddhism were, the gods, the power heirarchies, what the monks did, why they did it, who could be a member of the religion, etc.  For christianity and islam and all the other religions too, a lot of them.  It was taught in a completely secular manner and avoided historical bias - pure information and learning, no judgement.  I think the same is true in England too, and like I said, I had assumed that most of Europe was the same.

[Scott]

A bias towards christians? Thats a new one.

It seems like their finally getting a raw deal for a change.

[Acriku]

A bias towards christians? Thats a new one.

It seems like their finally getting a raw deal for a change.

That's what I said  ;)

[Wolf]

New one? Not at all. Remember the mass executions the Romans had. To answer Filo's question, we don't try to convert students to different areas of religious belief, we mainly examine the historical records of all major world religions, since they have had such an impact in history. In my schooling, this was one semester of the Global History course.

I think Western countries tend to be too hard on themselves because of the nature of the Western liberal ideal of society. We seek to be better than what we were, and this is a good goal, however, sometimes we sacrifice too much. Since we have this drive to be better humanitarians than our ancestors, we often make out our ancestors as being as barbaric as possible, to give us more incentive to be better, but at the same time, to make us feel good how not-barbaric we are in comparison to them. This "double-standard" is present in all of Western society. Each Western country has their Howard Zinns and TMA's-high-school-teachers. They aspire to be "better" so much that they even tell the past through a distorted lens in order to make others believe (rightly or wrongly, that is for you to decide) that 1) it is more important that we try to be better, and 2) we are pretty good, so far.

[Acriku]

New one? Not at all. Remember the mass executions the Romans had.

Remember the Crusades? Anyway this is irrelevant. We're not talking about genocides, we're talking about double standards towards Christians. And it is a new thing, because for centuries it's been the other way around. Especially during last century, where the double standards entered politics and then institions like schools and even the Congress.

[Wolf]

Nope. He said "bias", not double-standard. I think mass crucifixation of Christians would classify as "bias". No need to hop on me for that one, you made your point, I made mine.

[Emperor Harkonnen]

I am having religion subject in school next year. I strongly dislike it, but I guess the teacher will mention bad stuff christians did, and nothing of what muslims did.

I wish I didn't have to have that subject...when I start discussing it with the teacher I will probably get low grades :( :-X

[emprworm]

This kinda confused me, when I was in highschool awhile back a teacher who was teaching world religions was going into christianity.

before I start I must explain that he was a student teacher, and made many many mistakes, glaring ones. For example he said zeroastrianism is a dead religion... I could show others...

anyways he explained to us during the talks of christianity's early history really did not have much hardships. He said even that there really was hardly any killings of christians, even though there are many documented cases of multipule emperors who did kill christians as athiests of the roman religion, as well as other condemnations like being revolutionaries.

He also talked much about the horrible atrocities of the christian church when it became a powerhouse. He explained many tortures that have been found in history, which are all true, but the problem I have with it is he never once explained the horrible atrocities of islam when we studied islam, and never explained the horrible things that certain sects of buddhism (which suprisingly did happen, like killing and whatnot).

It was like a double standard, and when he talked about christianity not being tortured in the early history of it, it was like saying there was no hallocaust of the jews during and before ww2...

Dont get me wrong, there werent nearly as many christians killed as there were jews during that period of torture, but there were thousands of christians killed. It just seems outragious to me.

It is also annoying that he pointed out the flaws of the christian history, which does exist. christians have done some absolutely horrible things, but he never mentioned the horrible things of other religions, I am absolutely serious. it just bothers me that there is such a double standard, and it isnt only me but other people recognize it.

He would also whne talking about other religions try to show them in an obviously positive light, showing how beautiful and wonderful they were. and said they werent at all violent. Now there is reason for this, as many people brand religions like islam as violent, which it isnt. Still though it is a horrible double standard.

I just noticed this because it happens a lot. I am not trying to start arguments, jus want to see if anybody else has noticed this. I hope I am not the only one.

well said, TMA.  you know more about early Christianity than your teacher.  not many young people really have much knowledge about history...especially religious history.

[filecore]

I guess the teacher will mention bad stuff christians did, and nothing of what muslims did.

Ironically, christians are one of the few groups left to whome it is acceptable to give abuse.  After all, if you criticise Judaism, you're "anti-semitic" and a "nazi".  If you criticise Muslims, you're being reactionary because of Bin Laden.  And so on.

Oh the curse of political correctness.

[Emperor Harkonnen]

so technically muslims are nazis right?