Dutch politics

[Babylon]

This topic goes one where we got off-topic in this thread: http://www.dune2k.com/forum/?board=2;action=display;threadid=11350. Seeing how much Dutch(wo)men come here I think this will become very interesting.

1) Groen Links did not kill Pim Fortuin, nor did it give the order to do so

2) Volkert van der G. doesn't even vote for Groen Links (communist party if I am correct)

3) As Gryphon said in the other thread: If the LPF is run by idiots now, they where must be selected (mostly) by an idiot (right, Pim Fortuin)

4) I don't agree with Volkert that Fortuin must have been killed

5) I do feel more secure in my own country, knowing some power-hungry, people-manipulating asshole isn't running it (yes, still talking about Pim Fortuin)

6) Yes, I vote SP. You guessed correctly

7) No, I don't agree with right-winged idea's, because IMHO it's better to be social then egoistic

With this I ask you: are you insane to vote for LPF?

[exatreide]

we have a politics board.....

[Anathema]

That wasn't Gryphon, that was me ;)

And Groenlinks does not consist of communists (entirely), btw.

[gryphon]

yep, but I was the insane guy who voted for LPF. . .twice.

[Babylon]

That wasn't Gryphon, that was me ;)

yep, but I was the insane guy who voted for LPF. . .twice.

I am sorry for this mistake. (twice :P)

and Groenlinks does not consist of communists (entirely), btw.

I know, I was talking about the NCP.

[Timenn]

Hehe, that topic came up because people started wondering why Earth and I had 'GroenLinks' in our signatures. That was because of the elections.

But those elections turned out into a disaster.

Now the people who earn less have to pay the most, because the government needs to spare money ::)

And the airport Schiphol can expand even more, because people don't listen to the sound experts. Etc. etc.

This government is simple asocial.

[Babylon]

Another great plan of the current government: Increase taxes on sigarettes by

[Guest Eric E.]

1) Groen Links did not kill Pim Fortuin, nor did it give the order to do so

It came from that ''Left'' direction.

As Gryphon said in the other thread: If the LPF is run by idiots now, they where must be selected (mostly) by an idiot (right, Pim Fortuin)

They were not all selected by pim fortuyn

4) I don't agree with Volkert that Fortuin must have been killed

Every socialist would say that.

5) I do feel more secure in my own country, knowing some power-hungry, people-manipulating asshole isn't running it (yes, still talking about Pim Fortuin)

I guess you don't get terrorised by ''Marokanen and antilianen'' everyday do you?

6) Yes, I vote SP. You guessed correctly

Thats even worse than PvDA

No, I don't agree with right-winged idea's, because IMHO it's better to be social then egoistic

Being egoistic makes you and the economy richer, as for yourself you are more undepended on other people.

With this I ask you: are you insane to vote for LPF?

I voted for LPF once, That was after PIM was killed, just to show him some respect. I think many people voted because of that.

Well even CDA is copying Pim's idea's so I guess he made the netherlands finally wakeup.

If you could only see the stupitity of PvDA and SP.. people like that raised the criminal actions in this country by 5 times (at least).

You're an idiot Eric. If the LPF members are jackasses then who was the idiot who selected them? And you're talking bullshit about those "Groenlinks assholes" having killed Fortuyn, just like all those other LPF fundamentalist assholes with big mouths but no political skill whatsoever.

Are you 10 years old? I can't help it a couple of the ''NeW'' LPF members screw up.

Volkert van der G. komt uit die Linker hoek, En de media heeft Pim een slechte naam bezorgd. Mensen zoals jij trappen daar blindelings in.

[Anathema]

It came from that ''Left'' direction.

And Anton Mussert came from the right direction, what is your point?

They were not all selected by pim fortuyn

Not all of todays members maybe, but even Fortuyn himself said once that nobody on his list (except himself) was worthy of any ministrial position.

Every socialist would say that.

I'm not a socialist, and what is your point?

I guess you don't get terrorised by ''Marokanen and antilianen'' everyday do you?

And you do?

Being egoistic makes you and the economy richer, as for yourself you are more undepended on other people.

Ridiculous. The US, the apex of selfish societies, has more economical problems then the Netherlands or most other EU countries. And even if it were better, what good is it to anybody except the richest 5 %?

Well even CDA is copying Pim's idea's so I guess he made the netherlands finally wakeup.

This is true, but it doesn't mean that Fortuyns ideas were viable in the slightest.

If you could only see the stupitity of PvDA and SP.. people like that raised the criminal actions in this country by 5 times (at least).

Show me some graphs about that estimate of yours, because it smells to me like it came straight from your ass.

And SP was never a government party you dumb shit, and guess who the minister of justice was during the Paars cabinets? Korthals, VVD.

Are you 10 years old? I can't help it a couple of the ''NeW'' LPF members screw up.

No, I'm not 10 years old. But I stronly suspect you are.

Pim Fortuyn could have prevented his party screwing up everything if he came up with some decent candidates from the beginning.

Volkert van der G. komt uit die Linker hoek, En de media heeft Pim een slechte naam bezorgd. Mensen zoals jij trappen daar blindelings in.

Unlike you I don't believe everything politicians or the media says. Pim Fortuyn made a lot of ridiculous promises and came up with abysmal solutions to todays problems (like closing our borders to imigrants, violating half a dozen treaties with other countries). I don't close my eyes for things like these, apparently you do.

[Babylon]

It came from that ''Left'' direction.

Volkert wasn't right-winged if you mean that. If you mean that it was some left-winged conspericy: there is absolutly know prove of that. You know why? Because there is no left-winged conspericy. Those who do sea that should see a docter.

Every socialist would say that.

I guess not all will, but I do.

I guess you don't get terrorised by ''Marokanen and antilianen'' everyday do you?

No I don't. But then again I treat people with respect. Funny thing about not discriminating people is that if you do it right, you won't have any problems. I and my friends (of all ethnic descent) can have fun about it. (Yes, I just accused you of being a rascist)

Thats even worse than PvDA

Greatly founded. In the future you might add some explanation instead of pucking out some rubbish

Being egoistic makes you and the economy richer, as for yourself you are more undepended on other people.

Other people that have no right to have a normal live in your opinion??

I voted for LPF once, That was after PIM was killed, just to show him some respect. I think many people voted because of that.

Voting for a dead guy out of respect.... Politics is not about mourning. It's about running a country. You can't run a country when your 6 feet under.

If you could only see the stupitity of PvDA and SP.. people like that raised the criminal actions in this country by 5 times (at least).

Great numbers! Where did you get them? (I personally find the uprising of racism and discriminating caused by people like Pim Fortuin (not saying he was a racist, but he reached people who where) far more criminal than what is happening now. Of course your "5 times" is completly made up. Pure nonsense)

Volkert van der G. komt uit die Linker hoek, En de media heeft Pim een slechte naam bezorgd. Mensen zoals jij trappen daar blindelings in.

"Where still on an English forum, so I will translate:

Volkert van der G. comes out of the Left corner (Left-winged) and the media gave Pim (Fortuin) a bad name. People like you follow that blindly"

I can't see that, because it's not there. Volkert was left-winged, yes, but Volkert killed Pim, not the left-wing. The Left-winged political parties are smarter than that. It's easier to out-talk someone then to shoot him. Pim has become a marter now, an icon for stupid, narrow-minded people (like you). That's never a good thing for the oposition.

[Guest Eric E.]

And Anton Mussert came from the right direction, what is your point?

That He is like one of those groenlinks characters.

Not all of todays members maybe, but even Fortuyn himself said once that nobody on his list (except himself) was worthy of any ministrial position.

MY POINT EXACTLY! Thats the reason the LPF screwed up so bad after PIM's death.

And you do?

thats right

Ridiculous. The US, the epitome of selfish societies, has more economical problems then the Netherlands or most other EU countries. And even if it were better, what good is it to anybody except the richest 5 %?

Roflmao, The us is the most powerfull country in the world. Also the richest, exept for some small oil countries

Show me some graphs about that estimate of yours, because it smells to me like it came straight from your ass.

And SP was never a government party you dumb shit, and guess who the minister of justice was during the Paars cabinets? Korthals, VVD.

Sure, A few years ago, Holland made this agreement with ''Suriname'' : Every citizan had the right to leave ''Suriname'' and continue his life in holland. You know what happend? All the criminals and other people who where in jail at the time got a choise:

Either they would stay in jail, or get a free single trip to holland where you would get welfare, a house and a car.

The crime percentage in holland went through the roof!

Now this was caused by those socialists like PvDA.

And i never said SP was in any government I was referring to their members.

No, I'm not 10 years old. But I stronly suspect you are.

Pim Fortuyn could have prevented his party screwing up everything if he came up with some decent candidates from the beginning.

Funny, you're the one flaming, flaming makes people look retarded you know?.

Unlike you I don't believe everything politicians or the media says. Pim Fortuyn made a lot of ridiculous promises and came up with abysmal solutions to todays problems (like closing our borders to imigrants, violating half a dozen treaties with other countries). I don't close my eyes for things like these, apparently you do

Heh, thats right he made rediculous promises, and it had a great effect on the netherlands! people woke up! more than 4 million( could be less don't really remember) people voted on him. As you can see, the most votes for the LPF came from city's with the highest crime percentage (like rotterdam, amsterdam, utrecht, den haag etc.) Why? some people might think Pim was a racist, thats also rediculous, just because he called the Islam a stupit religion ( God and he's so right you know ) alot of people voted on him. Cause they were so sick and tired of those harrassing ''Marokanen (E.d)''

Zoals de meeste buitenlanders hier, Ze kennen wel hun rechten maar niet hun plichten. Ze hebben ook geen plichten volgens onze ''Government''

[Guest Eric E.]

Other people that have no right to have a normal live in your opinion??

Incase they come from a diffrent country and they don't adjust to our ways of living, like chinese for a good example, No they don't they should go back from whatever ''monkeyrock'' they came from.

Voting for a dead guy out of respect.... Politics is not about mourning. It's about running a country. You can't run a country when your 6 feet under.

Not just that, I voted because other party's should know he was right!. about some things that is.

No I don't. But then again I treat people with respect. Funny thing about not discriminating people is that if you do it right, you won't have any problems. I and my friends (of all ethnic descent) can have fun about it. (Yes, I just accused you of being a rascist)

If you call me a rascist, you call Pim a rascist, which makes you an idiot, cause he wasen't. I haven't said anything that Pim didn't ever say in his life.

If you look one of those characters more than 2 seconds in the eye they attack you ''WAT KIJK JE'' ''MOET JE KLAP HEBBE''. Hah go holland.

Great numbers! Where did you get them? (I personally find the uprising of racism and discriminating caused by people like Pim Fortuin (not saying he was a racist, but he reached people who where) far more criminal than what is happening now. Of course your "5 times" is completly made up. Pure nonsense)

read my previous post about Suriname.

Do I have a story that supports this claim? yep, a news show called ''Netwerk'' on nederland 1 broadcasted it about 4 weeks ago.

[Timenn]

"And Anton Mussert came from the right direction, what is your point?"

That He is like one of those groenlinks characters.

Yeah, sure. He truly was a leftist. Ever heard of the left ideals?

"Not all of todays members maybe, but even Fortuyn himself said once that nobody on his list (except himself) was worthy of any ministrial position."

MY POINT EXACTLY! Thats the reason the LPF screwed up so bad after PIM's death.

Kind a bad leader and politician he is then. That he can't even form a good party

"And you do?"

thats right

Wow, then you must be very unlucky. I'm rarely "terrorized" by those people. I more terrified and terrorized by all those agressive people who are so angry at foreigners for a strange reason.

And note this: When someone has a Dutch passport, then he/she IS dutch! Doesn't matter where the parents come from.

"Ridiculous. The US, the epitome of selfish societies, has more economical problems then the Netherlands or most other EU countries. And even if it were better, what good is it to anybody except the richest 5 %?"

Roflmao, The us is the most powerfull country in the world. Also the richest, exept for some small oil countries

I can see that you are thinking with your ass indeed. Because the US has one of the biggest militaries, and alot of influence they have the best economy? I have seen enough images of poor people living in the city. And I have seen enough interviews with people who lost everything because of everything. Then people in some EU countries are better off though.

Make a note: Good economy means that all people live in wealth

Sure, A few years ago, Holland made this agreement with ''Suriname'' : Every citizan had the right to leave ''Suriname'' and continue his life in holland. You know what happend? All the criminals and other people who where in jail at the time got a choise:

Either they would stay in jail, or get a free single trip to holland where you would get welfare, a house and a car.

The crime percentage in holland went through the roof!

Now this was caused by those socialists like PvDA.

And i never said SP was in any government I was referring to their members.

Those people were brougth here because they were needed for labor. But now they are not welcome anymore because the economy turned out differently then expected. And alot of Surinames are coming back to Suriname btw.

And what is wrong with helping people who are less wealthy then yourself? Are you so selfish that you can't spare a little bit of your wealth? Ooooooooh!

"Unlike you I don't believe everything politicians or the media says. Pim Fortuyn made a lot of ridiculous promises and came up with abysmal solutions to todays problems (like closing our borders to imigrants, violating half a dozen treaties with other countries). I don't close my eyes for things like these, apparently you do"

Heh, thats right he made rediculous promises, and it had a great effect on the netherlands! people woke up! more than 4 million( could be less don't really remember) people voted on him. As you can see, the most votes for the LPF came from city's with the highest crime percentage (like rotterdam, amsterdam, utrecht, den haag etc.) Why? some people might think Pim was a racist, thats also rediculous, just because he called the Islam a stupit religion ( God and he's so right you know ) alot of people voted on him. Cause they were so sick and tired of those harrassing ''Marokanen (E.d)''

Zoals de meeste buitenlanders hier, Ze kennen wel hun rechten maar niet hun plichten. Ze hebben ook geen plichten volgens onze ''Government''

Since you don't have the guts to state that last line in English, I will translate it for non-dutch (speak english on this forum)

Like most foreigners here, they know their rights but not their duties. They also have no duties according to our 'Government'

Final conclusion:

You are a rascist. You keep generalising other people because you encountered some of them.

Furthermore you are judging religions without an argument. That is discriminating.

You don't know what you are talking about. This is the world. And in that world live people who have to look after each other and who need to care for each other. Humans is a specie that lives in groups, and members of groups need to tolerate each other for what they are, and not picking out the negative aspects of them. Also you need to take care of the weaker people.

The Netherlands wasn't waken up. They were pushed back to sleep even more. Pim Fortuyn was only so popular because he acted like a clown, and people needed some entertainment.

Make a note: Politics isn't entertainment, and it isn't about the most popular person

[Guest Eric E.]

'Wow, then you must be very unlucky. I'm rarely "terrorized" by those people. I more terrified and terrorized by all those agressive people who are so angry at foreigners for a strange reason.

And note this: When someone has a Dutch passport, then he/she IS dutch! Doesn't matter where the parents come from.'

Someone with a dutch passport makes him dutch even though he preys to islam and lives on welfare and terrorizes people that do NOT believe in the islam because it says so in their bible the koran?

I have to say, You are nuts

Quote:

"Ridiculous. The US, the epitome of selfish societies, has more economical problems then the Netherlands or most other EU countries. And even if it were better, what good is it to anybody except the richest 5 %?"

Roflmao, The us is the most powerfull country in the world. Also the richest, exept for some small oil countries

I can see that you are thinking with your ass indeed. Because the US has one of the biggest militaries, and alot of influence they have the best economy? I have seen enough images of poor people living in the city. And I have seen enough interviews with people who lost everything because of everything. Then people in some EU countries are better off though.

Make a note: Good economy means that all people live in wealth

I don't understand who you are talking to here, you half quoted mine with someone elses post.

''Good economy means that all people live in wealth''

maybe in the evil communism.

Since you don't have the guts to state that last line in English, I will translate it for non-dutch (speak english on this forum)

Roflmao You think any guts is involved? This is a post about dutch people so I don't really get why we would have to speak english but ok, whatever.

''You are a rascist. You keep generalising other people because you encountered some of them.

'' some? if you call thousands of people ''some'', thats ok. LOL

''Furthermore you are judging religions without an argument.'' Nah I was just talking about the Islam because pim mentioned it, If you want, I'll copy his words from an old news paper.

They were pushed back to sleep even more. Pim Fortuyn was only so popular because he acted like a clown, and people needed some entertainment.

sure, so you're saying 4 million people are retarded and they don't know what they want except for entertainment.

Politics isn't entertainment, and it isn't about the most popular person

Pim fortuyn got popular because he said what alot of people were thinking,

Seriously, I don't know what you're talking about tim, I know alot of people are stupit in our country, But not THAT stupit to vote for someone for only one reason, entertainment

[ordos45]

Someone with a dutch passport makes him dutch even though he preys to islam and lives on welfare and terrorizes people that do NOT believe in the islam because it says so in their bible the koran?

I have to say, You are nuts

Actually, if you want to go into legalities, if you have a Dutch passport, issued by the government of the Netherlands, you are Dutch.

You saying what you did is like me saying-That if someone has an American passport (but was originally an immigrant), is a Mormon, and is always trying to get people to convert to Mormonism, then they are not a citizen of the United States. Which is obviously not correct, because they are a citizen of the United States legally. It's referred to as "religious tolerance".

[Guest Eric E.]

Seriously I couldn't care one bit about what the govenment thinks.

Wouldn't you get upset if some people from a diffrent country were come to live in your town and just continue doing their old habits, like harrassing people that do not believe in the islam.

Koran chapter 2,

Death to all unbelievers, of course many don't take it THAT serious but because of this rule they built up some kind of hate versus non islamic people. This is a serious problem in the netherlands.

[ordos45]

Wouldn't you get upset if some people from a diffrent country were come to live in your town and just continue doing their old habits, like harrassing people that do not believe in the islam.

Koran chapter 2,

Death to all unbelievers, of course many don't take it THAT serious but because of this rule they built up some kind of hate versus non islamic people. This is a serious problem in the netherlands.

Let's see, that has happened. And I had my life threatened by the man who moved here from another country. (I now have a rather extensive Spanish profanity collection at my disposal.) He got evicted from his residence after a few months (but for those few months I walked around armed).

On the Koran quote, there's a verse in the Bible saying not to be yoked to nonbelievers, and much like you've pointed out, most don't take that very seriously either.

[Guest Eric E.]

Alright, but then U must understand my situation and That I've created some sort of hate against certain religous people.

[Babylon]

Seeing that you don't reply to my post. I will only quote you one time:

sure, so you're saying 4 million people are retarded and they don't know what they want except for entertainment.

Yes :D thats correct. You seam retarted enough. But being retarded isn't a crime. Being a rascist is!

Your two sayings:

I guess you don't get terrorised by ''Marokanen and antilianen'' everyday do you?

some? if you call thousands of people ''some'', thats ok. LOL

If somebody gets terrorised everyday and not only that but by thousands of people in total. That person MUST have deserved it.

Eric E. your a joke. I can't believe a Dune fan with this narrow-mindedness can excist.

[Guest Eric E.]

And people like you got us those criminals, 90% off all the people in the jails are NOT *white* (DOn't know how else to put it). Most criminal activities are done by *colored* people in our country.

Call that Racsim, I DONT CARE THOSE ARE THE FACTS IF YOU CANT HANDLE THEM GET THE FUCK OUT OF THIS THREAD.

That is all there is to it. I'd suggest you Go out at night in rotterdam, U'll know what im talking about. In amsterdam, ''marokanen'' and some other races aren't even allowed in disco bars. simply because they are always the trouble makers.

You think thats racsism? Of course not, they are protecting their company against thieves and other criminals. Call it what you want, You are retarded non the less.

[Babylon]

ROFLOL

And people like you got us those criminals, 90% off all the people in the jails are NOT *white* (DOn't know how else to put it). Most criminal activities are done by *colored* people in our country.

And where did you find those numbers? A feary brought them to you?

Call that Racsim, I DONT CARE THOSE ARE THE FACTS IF YOU CANT HANDLE THEM GET THE FUCK OUT OF THIS THREAD.

Those aren't the facts. Show me where you got it. Oh, and could you please take a look and see who started this thread?? :O

That is all there is to it. I'd suggest you Go out at night in rotterdam, U'll know what im talking about. In amsterdam, ''marokanen'' and some other races aren't even allowed in disco bars. simply because they are always the trouble makers.

That racism there for you.

You think thats racsism? Of course not

Of course it is, it is (not)letting people in based on the colour of their skin.

Call it what you want, You are retarded non the less.

I am retarted because I give every individual the change everyone diserves? Generelisang people, THAT's retarted. I'll judge a person once I've talked to him/her.

plus, I see that you are from ''Zwolle'' So you wouldn't have the slightest clue of what im talking about

True, I live in Zwolle. And strange but true, we do have people here in Zwolle that aren't Caucasian (the term you where searching for). Quite a lot exually. Never had any problems with a single one of them. (did have some problems with a couple Caucasian people though)

BTW I spend most of my time in Amsterdam. In the Bijlmer. Never had any problems there.

, you better shut up now.

Or what? You'll visit me and show me how 'real Caucasians' handle problems?

[Guest Eric E.]

If somebody gets terrorised everyday and not only that but by thousands of people in total. That person MUST have deserved it.

THATS THE DUMBEST QUOTE I'VE EVER SEEN.

I and tim where referring to the people I've encounterd

Not the people terrorising me, my god man, Read before you post such non sense.

[Guest Eric E.]

ROFLOL

And people like you got us those criminals, 90% off all the people in the jails are NOT *white* (DOn't know how else to put it). Most criminal activities are done by *colored* people in our country.

And where did you find those numbers? A feary brought them to you?

Call that Racsim, I DONT CARE THOSE ARE THE FACTS IF YOU CANT HANDLE THEM GET THE FUCK OUT OF THIS THREAD.

Those aren't the facts. Show me where you got it. Oh, and could you please take a look and see who started this thread?? :O

That is all there is to it. I'd suggest you Go out at night in rotterdam, U'll know what im talking about. In amsterdam, ''marokanen'' and some other races aren't even allowed in disco bars. simply because they are always the trouble makers.

That racism there for you.

You think thats racsism? Of course not

Of course it is, it is (not)letting people in based on the colour of their skin.

Call it what you want, You are retarded non the less.

I am retarted because I give every individual the change everyone diserves? Generelisang people, THAT's retarted. I'll judge a person once I've talked to him/her.

plus, I see that you are from ''Zwolle'' So you wouldn't have the slightest clue of what im talking about

True, I live in Zwolle. And strange but true, we do have people here in Zwolle that aren't Caucasian (the term you where searching for). Quite a lot exually. Never had any problems with a single one of them. (did have some problems with a couple Caucasian people though)

, you better shut up now.

Or what? You'll visit me and show me how 'real Caucasians' handle problems?

Those statistics are easy to be found, call the police station of amsterdam and ask them for yourself. But then again you live in zwolle you probable have not got the slightest idea of what im talking about, zwolle has a low crime percentage compared to amsterdam. So your comments are irrelevant to this subject.

Simply because you haven't encounterd these criminals yourself.

2 months ago, Me and my friend were driving around on our scooters, we went inside to get something, then we got outside, a group of 8 ''colored'' people were looking at our scooters. my friend mark jumped on the scooter and one of those ''nice and friendly colored people'' stabbed him in the back. one of the others held me at gun point. you know what the police did against this? NOTHING. my father talked to the mayor of Rotterdam.. but thats a long story.

[Babylon]

Those statistics are easy to be found, call the police station of amsterdam and ask them for yourself. But then again you live in zwolle you probable have not got the slightest idea of what im talking about, zwolle has a low crime percentage compared to amsterdam. So your comments are irrelevant to this subject.

Simply because you haven't encounterd these criminals yourself.

So you're not only stupid, you're blind as well. I SPEND MOST MY TIME IN AMSTERDAM, IN THE BIJLMER!!!!!

2 months ago, Me and my friend were driving around on our scooters, we went inside to get something, then we got outside, a group of 8 ''colored'' people were looking at our scooters. my friend mark jumped on the scooter and one of those ''nice and friendly colored people'' stabbed him in the back. one of the others held me at gun point. you know what the police did against this? NOTHING. my father talked to the mayor of Rotterdam.. but thats a long story.

and that kind of things never happen with 'non-colored' people. off course not ::)

[Guest Eric E.]

''So you're not only stupid, you're blind as well. I SPEND MOST MY TIME IN AMSTERDAM, IN THE BIJLMER!!!!!'' Really, most people everywhere call that the most criminal part in the netherlands. Question, are you white?

Also, you haven't replied on the fact that those statistics are correct. funny :D

and that kind of things never happen with 'non-colored' people. off course not

of course it does, but not as often. because we are simply abit more evolved. cause those people come from our kolonies etc. They have lived on bread and water while we had machines, factories and food we were able to buy in shops.