Hitler and his beliefs

[Acriku]

It is very hard to establish and conclude what beliefs Hitler had. He was the perfect leader, charming and assertive, and his quotes can say many things. He has many quotes supporting christianity and his belief in christ...

"Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."

-Hitler (Mein Kampf)

His views on religion :

Amongst the accusations which are directed against Germany in the so called democracies is the charge that the National Socialist State is hostile to religion. In answer to that charge I should like to make before the German people the following solemn declaration:

1. No one in Germany has in the past been persecuted because of his religious views (Einstellung), nor will anyone in the future be so persecuted....

The Churches are the greatest landed proprietors after the State... Further, the Church in the National Socialist State is in many ways favoured in regard to taxation, and for gifts, legacies, &c., it enjoys immunity from taxation.

It is therefore, to put mildly-- effrontery when especially foreign politicians make bold to speak of hostility to religion in the Third Reich....

I would allow myself only one question: what contributions during the same period have France, England, or the United States made through the State from the public funds?

3. The National Socialist State has not closed a church, nor has it prevented the holding of a religious service, nor has it ever exercised any influence upon the form of a religious service. It has not exercised any pressure upon the doctrine nor on the profession of faith of any of the Confessions. In the National Socialist State anyone is free to seek his blessedness after his own fashion....

There are ten thousands and ten thousands of priests of all the Christian Confessions who perform their ecclesiastical duties just as well as or probably better than the political agitators without ever coming into conflict with the laws of the State....

This State has only once intervened in the internal regulation of the Churches, that is when I myself in 1933 endeavoured to unite the weak and divided Protestant Churches of the different States into one great and powerful Evangelical Church of the Reich. That attempt failed through the opposition of the bishops of some States; it was therefore abandoned. For it is in the last resort not our task to defend or even to strengthen the Evangelical Church through violence against its own representatives....

But on one point it is well that there should be no uncertainty: the German priest as servant of God we shall protect, the priest as political enemy of the German State we shall destroy."

-Adolf Hitler, a speech in the Reichstag on 30 Jan. 1939 [baynes]

Hitler emphasized that he attached the greatest importance to cooperation with the Catholic church and spoke of himself as a Catholic:

I am absolutely convinced of the great power and the deep significance of the Christian religion, and consequently will not permit any other founders of religion (Religionsstifter). Therefore I have turned against Ludendoriff and separated myself from him; therefore I reject Rosenberg's book. That book is written by a Protestant. It is not a party book. It is not written by him as a member of the party. The Protestants can settle matters with him.

My desire is that no confessional conflict arise. I must act correctly to both confessions. I will not tolerate a Kulturkampf.... I stand by my word. I will protect the rights and freedom of the church and will not permit them to be touched. You need have no apprehensions concerning the freedom of the church.

-Hitler

His views on religion in schools...

Secular schools can never be tolerated because such a school has no religious instruction and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith. from our point of view as representatives of the state, we need believing people. A dark cloud threatens from Poland. We have need of soldiers, believing solders. Believing solders are the most valuable ones. They give their all. Therefore we will maintain the confessional schools in order to train believing people through the schools, but this depends upon having truly believing teachers, not by chance Marxists who do not stand fully by their religious faith, as teachers.

-Hitler,

A lot of other quotes can explanations can be found.. http://www.nobeliefs.com/hitlerchristian.htm (NB: Do not be intimidated by the main URL, let the information speak for itself)

The conclusion of that webpage, conscerning Hitler compared to God/Jesus/Christians (if you're lazy) is:

Conclusion

Not only were Hitler's atrocities consistent with God and Jesus' actions in the Bible, but his intransigent attitude parallels many of the fanatical beliefs of Right-wing conservatives of today but he even uses faith in the same was as many mainstream Christians. It's clear from the history of Christianity that Hitler brought nothing new to Christianity, albeit he brought its violent nature to new heights.

Like the Biblical God, Hitler created war and destruction.

Similar to the Biblical laws against marrying outside one's group, the Nazi race laws outlawed Jews from marrying Aryan Germans as outlined in Hitler's private notes. Julius Streicher confessed that the race laws were based on Old Testament laws.

Like the Biblical Jesus, Hitler did not live for peace. He created many divisions among the people.

Like many Christians in the past and today, Hitler aimed to protect the image of the Lord.

Like Christian leaders of the past, Hitler wished to unite the churches. He fought for his beliefs using the Lord as his justification. He created intolerance, divisions, and hatred as have Christians of the past.

Hitler was a confessed Christian. He was brought up a Catholic and spoke and prayed as a Christian. He believed that the Bible represented the history of mankind. Nothing in his rhetoric spoke against Christian faith. Although some of his enemies happened to be Christians, they were political not religious enemies.

It's well known that Hitler allowed the destruction of Jewish synagogues and Temples. But if for one moment you still harbor the thought that Hitler was against Christianity, then ask yourself why he never ordered the destruction of Catholic or Protestant churches? Why did he not prevent his Nazis from worshiping in Christian churches, but instead encouraged it? And why did he spend so much time in trying to strengthen and unite the religion into one Christian Reich Church?

Even acknowledging Hitler's most atrocious acts as sinful cannot exclude him from Christianity. Tenets of Christian belief allege that all people sin and can be redeemed through faith in Jesus Christ. Therefore, sin, regardless of how atrocious, cannot be used against Hitler's state of Christian mind. His own words reveal his faith and Christians are upheld by their Bible not to judge others.

Under all possible conditions then, Hitler lived and acted as a Christian and anyone who does not think so can only be redefining Christianity from ignorance and denial.

For those who acknowledge Hitler's Christianity, they might begin to see that it is not Christianity itself that creates the problems of religion but that the foundations of any faith (reliance on hope and ignorance) creates a defense mechanism that must be protected at all cost, including the slaughter of innocents if necessary. A fanatical believer who gains political control of destructive weapons cannot help but use these instruments to favor his religious inclinations. A belief-system that contains the violent scripts such as Bibles, Korans or manifestos, can easily create similar intolerances that occurred in Germany in the 1930s. Hitler's faith, his Christian actions, the majority of Christian churches who supported him, and the very Bible with its appeal to superstition, provides important examples of how beliefs can create dangers to society.

It is hard to say he was against christianity, when many of his quotes conscerned his faith and justification of his doings with that faith. It is also hard to say what his actual beliefs were, because all we have are quotes, which may or may not be what Hitler really believed. But it can be a fair assessment that he used christianity to justify his doings, but it isn't a fair assessment to paint a different religion or faith on him just because it might hurt christianity (for whatever reason) with his "membership".

[SurlyPIG]

Good article Acriku. It seems to me when things started to go against his way that he turned on it, but up until that point that's what he was all about. Fraudulent in any case.

[TMA_1]

he supported many faiths. He was also an evolutionist, a social darwinist, a devout follower of the arts and so many other liberal things. He believed in christ. He also believed that the ancestor's of germany and of other nordic backgrounds gave his troops power.

At the same time of supporting the churches, he silenced many pastors with his secret police. He supported the large established churches because their's was a beurocracy. Easily curruptable and bendable to his will.

I read teh article, and he said that he would study the beliefs of hitler with no religious bias. Instead he gave us his own view. Christians are bad because hitler is bad and people like him are bad. look at this quote to see how ignorant this man is of our faith.

"He always maintained an honor and belief in Jesus. This alone put him as a Christian believer. "

Hmmmm. Does this guy even know what belief in christ is? honoring and believing christ is not good enough. I know so many people who say they believe in christ, but they just believe him as a historical figure or a great man. well thats not good enough and this guy needs to stick with what he is good at, which isnt much in the history or religious department.

acriku, I have heard you shreek in sheer anger when somebody says "stalin was an athiest, so that shows what kind of people athiests are". You are doing the same here. it is as clear as the morning sun. you will take snippits of history and leave out all of the other portions to help your cause. You will use people in history as a measuring tool of other christians. When we do that to you with athiesm you back away in anger. that is so hypocritical. For instance, stalin was a social darwinist who believed that the white racial stock was superior to other races. Dont think that somehow that only was something that hitler believed. who was also an evolutionist and social dawinist. Stalin would constantly illiminate people because of race. especially the jews (which is a largely untold story). All of these ideas came from agnostics and athiests, so that shows what kind of people they are for coming up with these ideas, right? of course not! we are individuals man, start treating us like human beings and not a collective pile of filth. Instead of being a biggot, why dont you treat us with equality? you say you do, but you post these kinds of articles.

Here is an example. What if I took Shaka Zulu and used him as an example for all black people? Shaka Zulu, though a great leader, was a genius to the point of insanity. He was ruthless, insensitive, at times thoughtless, and even heartless at times. He was driven so mad that he claimed himself to be jesus christ.

Now for my conclusion. From seeing Shaka Zulu and understanding that he symbolizes the south african Zulu Culture, all Zulu people and blacks in gnereal are heartless, insensitive, thoughtless, insane, and ruthless. They are inferior because Shaka Zulu is a model of how all black people are.

Now was that racist? Was that at all biggoted? Of course it was. What you state is no different. There is a difference between debating an issue and actually offending people for the sheer sake of doing that. There is nothing wrong with an athiest and christian debating to the point of harshness about their ideologies. It crosses the line when an athiest says "your an insane subhuman who depends on a silly man who never existed. You guys are all alike." Or if the christian said, "You guys are ignorant, all you do is complain and all of you are childish activists! you are pompus,arrogant asses."

Why not treat us like equals man? you say you do but empty lies with no evidance of change say differently.

[Acriku]

he supported many faiths. He was also an evolutionist, a social darwinist, a devout follower of the arts and so many other liberal things. He believed in christ. He also believed that the ancestor's of germany and of other nordic backgrounds gave his troops power.

And now for the evidence to support your claims (not that it's wrong)...

At the same time of supporting the churches, he silenced many pastors with his secret police. He supported the large established churches because their's was a beurocracy. Easily curruptable and bendable to his will.

Ditto to above.

acriku, I have heard you shreek in sheer anger when somebody says "stalin was an athiest, so that shows what kind of people athiests are". You are doing the same here. it is as clear as the morning sun. you will take snippits of history and leave out all of the other portions to help your cause. You will use people in history as a measuring tool of other christians. When we do that to you with athiesm you back away in anger. that is so hypocritical. For instance, stalin was a social darwinist who believed that the white racial stock was superior to other races. Dont think that somehow that only was something that hitler believed. who was also an evolutionist and social dawinist. Stalin would constantly illiminate people because of race. especially the jews (which is a largely untold story). All of these ideas came from agnostics and athiests, so that shows what kind of people they are for coming up with these ideas, right? of course not! we are individuals man, start treating us like human beings and not a collective pile of filth.

It may be morning sun to you, but I have no idea what you're talking about. I don't leave out other portions, if I had to include all other portions, the post would be thousands of pages long. If you have these 'other portions', replying would allow you to present them. I have not used people as a measuring tool. Darwinism does not support nor justify racism, so even if Stalin was a Darwinist (which you have not established), what valid connection is there? If he did believe that, then he is mistaken. Too bad for him. Oh, and us human beings are a pile of filth, some people however try to make us out to be more than what are really are. Some can't handle it, but hopefully they can adjust to that perspective if needed.

[SurlyPIG]

Well, let's just all agree that they were full of themselves and they took that to the extreme (them being Hitler, Stalin, Zedong, Pol Pot etc.) and that most of them were contradicting themselves anyway at a lunatical level.

[Acriku]

That's fair enough, but misrepresenting them is not a very good thing to do, no matter how 'evil' they are made out to be.

[TMA_1]

If he did believe that, then he is mistaken. Too bad for him

exactly hypocrite. Read what I wrote above, I added more stuff to my post. Your a biggot. Now keep hurling insults at us.

[Acriku]

If you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all. Nema has warned us both, and I held up my end of the bargain...

Hmmmm. Does this guy even know what belief in christ is? honoring and believing christ is not good enough. I know so many people who say they believe in christ, but they just believe him as a historical figure or a great man. well thats not good enough and this guy needs to stick with what he is good at, which isnt much in the history or religious department.

A christian is one who believes in Jesus Christ. Some christians believe him as their savior, some believe in his teachings only, etc. You have your kind of christianity, and they have theirs. But in the most general sense, believing in Jesus Christ does make you a christian. And what relevance does this have to the article? Please do not bring it offtopic by arguing about something like this.

Here is an example. What if I took Shaka Zulu and used him as an example for all black people? Shaka Zulu, though a great leader, was a genius to the point of insanity. He was ruthless, insensitive, at times thoughtless, and even heartless at times. He was driven so mad that he claimed himself to be jesus christ.

Now for my conclusion. From seeing Shaka Zulu and understanding that he symbolizes the south african Zulu Culture, all Zulu people and blacks in gnereal are heartless, insensitive, thoughtless, insane, and ruthless. They are inferior because Shaka Zulu is a model of how all black people are.

This post is about Hitler and his beliefs. Not about how bad christians are. You obviously missed that somewhere...

[TMA_1]

I am not saying anything, you just really hurt my feelings dude. I know that it shouldnt, but I havent heard such insensitive stuff in a long time.

[Acriku]

You have nothing to be offended by. This is about what Hitler believed, and the evidence, and whether or not this evidence really supports it.

[TMA_1]

keeping my big mouth shut.

[Gobalopper]

Hitler wanted to control the people. Taking control of religious institions is the easiest way to achieve that because for many they follow blindly what the Church says. Dictators say a lot of things that aren't true, just look at the recent gov't of Iraq for evidence of this. Of course he tried to unite the Church into one group, if he could have done that it would have been a lot easier to get his message out to everyone in Germany. Hitler used the Church to gain control over the country but his actions do not follow what the Bible teaches.

Does it really matter what he called himself? His faith should be based on his actions not his words. And killing Jews is not something the Bible teaches. Nor are a lot of other things Hitler did while in power.

[Acriku]

I agree that actions should represent his faith, and the article explains a lot of them (although, I'd like you to support your claim that the words do not represent his beliefs, just because I'd like to get most out of both sides).

I'll post a few of them...

Let burning coals fall upon them: let them be cast into the fire; into deep pits, that they rise not up again.

-Psalm 140:10

Through Hitler's orders, millions of people (them) were burned in incinerators and cast into pits.

Proclaim ye this among the Gentiles; Prepare war, wake up the mighty men, let all the men of war draw near; let them come up: Beat your plowshares into swords, and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong.

-Joel 3:9-10

Hitler appealed to the German populace, building up their military might, and prepared them them for war:

"Their sword will become our plow, and from the tears of war the daily bread of future generations will grow."

-Adolf Hitler (Mein Kampf)

Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:

-Jesus in Luke 12:51

Hitler not only divided countries on earth, but divided Jewish families, many times setting family members against each other.

Hitler's work of the Lord only agrees with Biblical scripture:

And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

-Colossians 3:17

Hitler not only believed in Jesus (which alone would make him a Chrisitan) but his work against the Jews came straight from Christian reasoning just as had many Christian saints of the past.

[TMA_1]

lol ahh

I am sure you read these passages and know the context of them right? if so, dont quote idiots.

[Navaros]

Lots of what Hitler did was actually very Christian.

The main principle that made him so powerful was the core of how he held power. The Bible says: "Let there be no division of thought among you" (quote from Jesus): and this concept is why Hitler's Regime was one of the very strongest of all human history.

He used this principle of Jesus to it's fullest effect. He must have got that idea from the Bible.

[Gobalopper]

Gotta love quotes taken out of context:

¹ Rescue me, O LORD , from evil men;

protect me from men of violence,

² who devise evil plans in their hearts

and stir up war every day.

³ They make their tongues as sharp as a serpent's;

the poison of vipers is on their lips.

Selah

⁴ Keep me, O LORD , from the hands of the wicked;

protect me from men of violence

who plan to trip my feet.

⁵ Proud men have hidden a snare for me;

they have spread out the cords of their net

and have set traps for me along my path.

Selah

⁶ O LORD , I say to you, "You are my God."

Hear, O LORD , my cry for mercy.

⁷ O Sovereign LORD , my strong deliverer,

who shields my head in the day of battle-

⁸ do not grant the wicked their desires, O LORD ;

do not let their plans succeed,

or they will become proud.

Selah

⁹ Let the heads of those who surround me

be covered with the trouble their lips have caused.

¹⁰ Let burning coals fall upon them;

may they be thrown into the fire,

into miry pits, never to rise.

¹¹ Let slanderers not be established in the land;

may disaster hunt down men of violence.

-Psalm 140: 1-11

I ask how that supports any of Hitler's actions?

¹ "In those days and at that time,

when I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,

² I will gather all nations

and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat. [1]

There I will enter into judgment against them

concerning my inheritance, my people Israel,

for they scattered my people among the nations

and divided up my land.

³ They cast lots for my people

and traded boys for prostitutes;

they sold girls for wine

that they might drink.

⁴ "Now what have you against me, O Tyre and Sidon and all you regions of Philistia? Are you repaying me for something I have done? If you are paying me back, I will swiftly and speedily return on your own heads what you have done. ⁵ For you took my silver and my gold and carried off my finest treasures to your temples. ⁶ You sold the people of Judah and Jerusalem to the Greeks, that you might send them far from their homeland.

⁷ "See, I am going to rouse them out of the places to which you sold them, and I will return on your own heads what you have done. ⁸ I will sell your sons and daughters to the people of Judah, and they will sell them to the Sabeans, a nation far away." The LORD has spoken.

⁹ Proclaim this among the nations:

Prepare for war!

Rouse the warriors!

Let all the fighting men draw near and attack.

¹⁰ Beat your plowshares into swords

and your pruning hooks into spears.

Let the weakling say,

"I am strong!"

¹¹ Come quickly, all you nations from every side,

and assemble there.

Bring down your warriors, O LORD !

¹² "Let the nations be roused;

let them advance into the Valley of Jehoshaphat,

for there I will sit

to judge all the nations on every side.

¹³ Swing the sickle,

for the harvest is ripe.

Come, trample the grapes,

for the winepress is full

and the vats overflow-

so great is their wickedness!"

¹⁴ Multitudes, multitudes

in the valley of decision!

For the day of the LORD is near

in the valley of decision.

¹⁵ The sun and moon will be darkened,

and the stars no longer shine.

¹⁶ The LORD will roar from Zion

and thunder from Jerusalem;

the earth and the sky will tremble.

But the LORD will be a refuge for his people,

a stronghold for the people of Israel.

-Joel 3:1-16

This war was to reclaim land that belonged to them, not conquer other nations or the world as Hitler wanted.

⁴⁹ "I have come to bring fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled! ⁵⁰ But I have a baptism to undergo, and how distressed I am until it is completed! ⁵¹ Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division. ⁵² From now on there will be five in one family divided against each other, three against two and two against three. ⁵³ They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law."

-Luke 12:49-53

Jesus came to earth to change things, so yes there are going to be conflicts because people resist change. Hitler's goals for change were much different then Jesus' though. Much different.

¹¹ Here there is no Greek or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all.

¹² Therefore, as God's chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience. ¹³ Bear with each other and forgive whatever grievances you may have against one another. Forgive as the Lord forgave you. ¹⁴ And over all these virtues put on love, which binds them all together in perfect unity.

¹⁵ Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, since as members of one body you were called to peace. And be thankful. ¹⁶ Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God. ¹⁷ And whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.

-Colossians 3:11-17

Here there is no Greek or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all. Doesn't look like Hitlers reasoning to me.

[zamboe]

Lots of what Hitler did was actually very Christian.

He used this principle of Jesus to it's fullest effect. He must have got that idea from the Bible.

This is quite a good example of how ignorance in it's highest level works when it comes to understand Christianity.

[TMA_1]

good stuff Gob. I would like to point out acriku that gob is right. The bible quotes you quoted are so out of context, that its just plain obvious. Heck, you might as well quote lord of the rings with that.lol

I mean for example, when christ said he didnt come to bring peace but division.

He came and people believed. Those who believed were ridiculed, punished, tortured, and killed. They were divided from their families because their families either disowned them or aided in their torture of murder. Or christian families being divided for being christian. This has nothing to do with what you state.Duh.lol

There is neither jew nor greek, free or slave, woman or male that arent able to come to christ and be equal in God's eyes. This strikes strictly against hitlers ideology.

Those who bless the jew, I will bless, those who curse the jew, I will curse.

This was stated to abraham when he was given the promise of israel becoming a great nation. Again hitler couldnt have agreed with this. He was cursed by God for what he did.

There will be antichrists near the end of days

this is stated in revelations and talks about the destroyers of the end times. People like hitler and stalin.

I could go on and on man. dont be ignorant and misquote scripture.

[Caid Ivik]

Jesus said he will divide us because he knew there will be many fanatical opposers of him. Let's see how divided is this thread for example. Hitler in fact united whole world against him. There were never so tough alliances than in WW2. Also fascism is based on one nation and its superiority over all others, so it's (vulgary said) even closer to judaism than to cosmopolitan christianity.

[Acriku]

Gob, is the author taking them out of context, or did Hitler take them out of context to use them for himself?

Hey TMA, I did not state these quotes. Duh.lol

[Gobalopper]

I don't remember you saying that Hitler specifically used those verses to support his actions so I have no clue if Hitler used them out of context. I'm sure Hitler could have used those verses to support what he was doing but I don't see how that makes him a Christian which is what you seem to be claiming.

[TMA_1]

exactly Gob. I think you know you are wrong on this acriku and are trying to find ways of correcting your faults. If not, then you are totally wrong.lol The guy you posted misquoted scripture, and if hitler used those scriptures, not only would he be the dumbest man alive, but he would be just as ignorant of the bible as the man that wrote this essay. Dont attack me, defend yourself for the same of your dignity. Many people have misquoted scrpitures. Just like social darwinsits who used darwin's theories in the wrong ways. so why all of the double standards?

[Acriku]

Remember gob that I said it is difficult to determine his beliefs, because quotes can be falsely given, or the truth, or somewhere in between. We don't know for sure.

TMA, stop being the "me-too" dog, Gob can handle this without negative comments from the peanut gallery... Also he didn't misquote the bible, because those quotes are not wrong, just that they are out-of-context according to you and gob.

[Gobalopper]

Hitler never used those verses though, at least you haven't shown any evidence of him using them.

How are those verses you posted not out-of-context? I just provided evidence that they are so I would like to hear why you think they aren't.

[TMA_1]

well we started the debate, and gob joined, I am just agreeing with him. Always good to do that. And they are misinterpritations. You also never responded to what I said, just ran away from it. afraid?