Elite Players, I need your Help

[Navaros]

Elite Players, I need your HelpI need help against Inkvines. About the only thing that I can't handle these days is Inkvines. I *really* need help on dealing with Inkvines. They always kill all my Inf when a good player is using them, resulting in my death Minos too. Whenever a Hark player is overwhelming me with millions of units, my stupid Minos *spin* around all over the place without even firing! My Minos die before getting off a volley a lot of the times! They just keep spinning as the Hark units move, without firing. This NEEDS to stop. I need to learn how to make my Minos work better. I need to know how to win against players who know how to use Inkvines. This is unacceptable.Elite players, please train me on these two things. I need some intensive hands-on training about how to stop people who use these things to beat me. Please.

[Desert_Eagle25]

i'm not elite, but one thing i do is surround my infantry with some mongooses and minos so inkvines are net likely to get into range before i hae my mongooses move up for a counter attack. also, i support my Minos with allot of various units like sandbikes, mongooses, infantry,and repair vehicles.

[ken124578]

1. to counter inkvines use fedaykin.

2. to let ur mino's NOT spin place some blocking units in front of it (sandbikes) they are annoying to any play not because of his weapon but because it takes ammo and time to kill it!

[Desert_Eagle25]

yes, i forgot to mention fadeykin :)

[Navaros]

1. to counter inkvines use fedaykin.

2. to let ur mino's NOT spin place some blocking units in front of it (sandbikes) they are annoying to any play not because of his weapon but because it takes ammo and time to kill it!

Feds can't access the Inkvines of good players. That's a good thought though.

Putting bikes in front of Minos helps them to stop spinning, yes, but that does not solve my problems, because when a Hark player beats me up it is as a result of me having to move *forward*. There is no good way to keep your bikes in front of your Minos and your Minos firing without spinning as they move forward into the battle. It's moving forward that always causes the problems. Whenever I don't have to move forward, I almost always pulverize the Hark army.

[Desert_Eagle25]

I think there is a Hold Position key, i think its 'S'. If not then I must have programmed it into my hotkeys and no one else has. whenever im surrounded by troops i press 'S', they stay in position and into 15 secs i got moderate or more, and troops are gone.

[SurlyPIG]

They're hard to counter because of their speed and range. Get the first few ones with feds. When your opponent adapts, advanced carryalls will do the job (even if his inks are protected by aa [excluding sard elites]). The trouble for atr is they dont have any quick AV units that pack a punch. Lasers are the common solution for ordos, but the only thing that atr can use in a well defended inkvine front, are NIABs. Nothing scares harks more than a decent camper with NIABs.

[Navaros]

They're hard to counter because of their speed and range. Get the first few ones with feds. When your opponent adapts, advanced carryalls will do the job (even if his inks are protected by aa [excluding sard elites]). The trouble for atr is they dont have any quick AV units that pack a punch. Lasers are the common solution for ordos, but the only thing that atr can use in a well defended inkvine front, are NIABs. Nothing scares harks more than a decent camper with NIABs.

Thanks for the tip I was wishing I didn't have Sards 'cause they are next-to useless against a good Hark player. I'm gonna have to NIAB-it-up vs. Hark. One question though, should I get all my refs, three Facs, three Fremen camps a hangar), and then the Guild Palace (not in that order exactly, of course, i mean should i get all the stuff i need and 3 of everything i need 3 of before building the Guild Palace in QM)? I am thinking it's probably best to do it that way.

[Frodo_I]

ummmmmmm, you must have a guy thats throwing ALOT of inkvines at you, cause their like armorless?? Two fed's can kill an inkvine in one shot, and fed's are faster than inkvine discharges by the way

For your mino problem what i did that worked well was i would move the mino while keeping them highlighted (click on one and press the "T" key once for the minos on screen, twice for all minos), whenever anyone tried to spin them i just hit the "S" key to stop them all

As you know, or i would hope everyone knows it by now since i've only said it a million times, minos that are parked are infinately more accurate, have a faster rate of fire, and longer distance of fire than moving minos

[SurlyPIG]

Sards are actually the best subhouse against hark - at least in the early game. Sards mow down buzzsaws and also make effective harv/base killers. The only think NIABs are good at killing about harks are inks, assaults, and maybe missles. I'd reccomend getting a couple facs and a camp or two before getting a guild palace.

[Desert_Eagle25]

een frodo agrees...press the 's' key!

[Navaros]

oldbie thanks for the tip, i am with you on the worm thing, i try to use them whenever it makes sense to, though this was a small map and his warriors kept sniping my feds no matter where they were. he was *really* paying attention, unfortunately for me. if i had gotten just one worm out, things could have been mighty different.

ACE if you read this again, can you please comment on the best tactical commands to issue in the following situation:

I move my army forward as I am being bombarded with Inkvines so as my Minos get within range of the Inkvines... I attack-move like how you showed me to to with warriors vs. sards... however when I do this, my Minos spin and do not fire because of the Hark units that blitz the screen in all different directions, making my Minos turn several times instead of firing right away - it appears the options are:

1. Move everything forward just a fews steps, and stop them all right after they take a few steps.

or

2. Move my Minos enough into range so that their splash damage can encompass most if not all of the Hark forces, and do not stop them until they are in this position.

So far I have been using the attack-move with option 2 and getting slaughtered. Would you advise me to just move my Minos forward a few steps and then stop them in this situation (option 1), or should I take the punishment until they close enough to do more splash damage to the Hark units in the rear of his formation (option 2)?

[undsputed]

try leaving all games which involve a hark player ;D

Hehe Sards are good against hark (as a recent hark player) if they are on some sort of protective ground like infantry rock....then they are almost unstoppable. BUT, if I am to catch your sards in open space, 4 or 5 buzzsaws will guarantee that you lose almost all of those sards. It only takes one buzz to get through and 1 second to run over them...cost wise, that favors hark. Again though, if they are protected, hark is in trouble.

[SurlyPIG]

Its not a good idea to use attack move with minos. When you move minos on attack mode, their guard range is about 1/2 of their weapon's range. It works fine and dandy if you're just getting them from point A to point B, but in battle situations it doesnt utilize their range. Get them where they need to be and fire on the outside units of the enemy force. If he's attacking you from several angles, flank your minos accordingly to match. A great strat to use with sards is to fire on your enemy's outside units and "provoke" them into moving forward, then the sards destroy them.

[Navaros]

Its not a good idea to use attack move with minos. When you move minos on attack mode, their guard range is about 1/2 of their weapon's range. It works fine and dandy if you're just getting them from point A to point B, but in battle situations it doesnt utilize their range. Get them where they need to be and fire on the outside units of the enemy force. If he's attacking you from several angles, flank your minos accordingly to match. A great strat to use with sards is to fire on your enemy's outside units and "provoke" them into moving forward, then the sards destroy them.

Flank my Minos? Minos move too slowly to flank effectively, unless I spread them out beforehand...????

[Navaros]

Its not a good idea to use attack move with minos. When you move minos on attack mode, their guard range is about 1/2 of their weapon's range. It works fine and dandy if you're just getting them from point A to point B, but in battle situations it doesnt utilize their range.

This statement should be "Stickied" on these Forums. I just realized how profound that statement is. I always wondered why my Minos often didn't fire when they were supposed to but I attributed that mostly to pathfinding bugs.

ACE, you are a sage. You have just permanently made me a much more powerful killing force. ;D

If only one day you'd teach me *all* your ghetto tricks. *sighs*

[ImpSard]

Instead of wasting your caryalls in trying to pick up the enemy army, try dropping in some minos from behind, and with this tactic, you CAN flank the enemy with minos. The LZ should be out of the range of his units, so you don't get immediately attacked by units on guard. This will mean some walking, though.

Be sure to circle around the two engaging armies with your caryalls. This way, he probably won't notice being embroiled in the battle, and his missile tanks won't shoot down any of them if he doesn't notice.

It helps to group your caryalls as well, but as a group, you can only make them move by clicking on the radar map, and you can only deploy them by using the "D" key. This way, you have many minos touching down at the same time, and immediately decimating the attacking column. ;D

After that, drop in a repair vehicle or two behind your Air Mobile column.

Ever read Thoxen's Atreides Brick Wall strategies at emprworm's site?

http://www.songwave.com/dune

Use kindjals on inf. rock, and cliffs, sards on inf. rock, and minos... and whatever else you want

around these establishments. Read Thoxen's strats for more specs. The Death Hand Missile, while annoying, can't do much more than destroy a mino and any kindjals in the vicinity. You can move most of the minos in the area away from the immediate destruction zone. They'll still take some damage, but you can repair that.

Having 2-3 repair vehicles behind your defending army helps too. They can repair your vehicles, then pull back and repair themselves. Esp. useful if playing against a Hark player who loves supers.