Avatar is the same thing as Dune.

[HarryCanyon]

I mean when James Cameron wrote the film in 1993 he had to wait until 2004 for the technology to catch to capture his vision! he stated he was influenced by one of his favorite novels known as Dune.

You'll find similarities to Dune in his latest movie and maybe the sequel will be like Dune Messiah and part 3 will be like Children of Dune.

[Lawliet]

There are a LOT of similarities between Avatar and Dune.

1) The story lines are VERY similar: So the story follows (Jake Sully / Paul Atreides) on this weird planet of (Pandora / Arrakis). **** hits the fan with the death of his (brother / father) and he takes up refuge with the indigenous people, the (Na’vi / Fremen) who are wise in the ways of nature on this alien world and speak in a strange language that sounds oddly (Polynesian / Arabic).

(Jake / Paul) is seen as an outsider until he mates with a local girl and passes the right of manhood. Eager for vengeance against (the corporation / House Harkonen) for their brutal rape of the world for the precious (unobtanium / spice), a clear analogy for (oil / oil), (Jake / Paul) sets out to unite the tribes together for a final assault by mastering how to ride a (weird bird bat thing / weird worm thing). Despite all odds, the technologically inferior primitives defeat the technological might of their foes, liberating the world and ending happily.

2) The use of kick-*** looking (VTOL’s / ornithopters) for all transit needs.

3) Reference to Dune Entertainment in the credits.

[SandChigger]

I mean when James Cameron wrote the film in 1993 he had to wait until 2004 for the technology to catch to capture his vision! he stated he was influenced by one of his favorite novels known as Dune.

Pity he didn't spend the time improving the story more.

You'll find similarities to Dune in his latest movie and maybe the sequel will be like Dune Messiah and part 3 will be like Children of Dune.

Not likely. Cameron's said the first sequel will revolve around Pandora's oceans. It'll probably be more Empire Strikes Back than Dune Messiah.

Eager for vengeance against (the corporation / House Harkonen) for their brutal rape of the world for the precious (unobtanium / spice), a clear analogy for (oil / oil)

That wasn't Paul's motivation at all. It was pure revenge for the betrayal and murder of his father. And was Arrakis really being "brutally raped" for spice?

Meh.

[HarryCanyon]

Well i'm a huge fan of both the Dune novels and Avatar, i gotta say bravo for Cameron for doing a tribute to one of his favorite books, although he was disappointed in Lynch's adaptation in 1984 because even though he does admire David Lynch's movies and the books by Herbert he thought "It works good as a Lynch movie but not much as a Dune movie".

Anyone thinks the Colonel is the same as the Baron and Parker being like Emperor Shaddamn IV?

[Lawliet]

Pity he didn't spend the time improving the story more.

Not likely. Cameron's said the first sequel will revolve around Pandora's oceans. It'll probably be more Empire Strikes Back than Dune Messiah.

That wasn't Paul's motivation at all. It was pure revenge for the betrayal and murder of his father. And was Arrakis really being "brutally raped" for spice?

Meh.

Well, yes, that was Paul's main motivation. But there were also other things, like Liet's death, etc.

Personally, i didn't enjoy Avatar. Great special effects but it was kind of boring for me.

[SandChigger]

Personally, i didn't enjoy Avatar. Great special effects but it was kind of boring for me.

I enjoyed it well enough while I was in the theater watching it, in the moment of the thing. (I've only seen it once, btw.) It was only later when I started thinking about it that the problems with the setting and story elements and skimpy plot started to detract from it.

Two of my satellite movie channels are going to show it on New Year's Day, so I'm planning on watching it again, to see how different it looks in 2D and what does & doesn't hold up after one year.

Anyone thinks the Colonel is the same as the Baron and Parker being like Emperor Shaddamn IV?

Which one was Parker? The top guy from the company?

Anyway, Harry, there's such a thing as carrying it too far. NO, I don't think the Colonel is equivalent to the Baron; the Baron didn't like getting his own hands dirty. He never actually takes charge himself and does anything directly on Arrakis. Ditto for the Emperor.

Besides, the character motivations are completely different as well. The Baron is acting to conclude an implausibly long family vendetta against the Atreides, while the Emperor is acting to negate a potential double threat to his power & reign (the Duke's popularity in the Landsraad and the superior military force the Atreides were developing).

The threat to the supply of the valuable resource is actually kind of secondary to the Baron and Emperor but of primary importance to Parker. As for the Colonel's motivations... I guess he just doesn't like being disobeyed? That or maybe he just hasn't popped a nut in a LONG time.

Anyway, your adoration for Cameron & Avatar seems just a reflex of your hate for Lynch's movie. Yawn.

[HarryCanyon]

Nope, i just adore the Dune novels and Avatar ok. But i do like the mini-series of Dune despite some problems but Children of Dune got it right and applaud that.

Do you think Avatar 2 will surpass the original and be as one of the best sequels to surpass the original like Empire, Two Towers, Aliens, T2, Dawn of the Dead, Evil Dead 2, Toy Story 2 or whatever awesome part 2 movie there is?

[ErasOmnius]

Nope, i just adore the Dune novels and Avatar ok. But i do like the mini-series of Dune despite some problems but Children of Dune got it right and applaud that.

Do you think Avatar 2 will surpass the original and be as one of the best sequels to surpass the original like Empire, Two Towers, Aliens, T2, Dawn of the Dead, Evil Dead 2, Toy Story 2 or whatever awesome part 2 movie there is?

I am not sure why you would like the movie 'The Two Towers' more than 'Fellowship of the Ring'. The liberty with license that Pete Jackson took with the story-line of his Two Towers movie was way over the top.

1. Aragorn falling off the cliff, and arriving at Helm's Deep a day later, after having a semi-tryst in his mind with Arwen.

2. Of course the most glaring. Frodo almost handing the ring to the

. Aside from the ridiculousness of that scene; Pete and his wife, Fran Walsh, reduced the honor of Faramir to almost zero. As you know, in the book, he decided at the hidden outpost to let Sam, Frodo, and Smeagol, go free.

[HarryCanyon]

Of course, Unorbtanium is nearly like the spice and who thinks the Na'Vi are like the Freman? i mean they are literally blue while freman only have blue within blue eyes.

[ErasOmnius]

Do you really think the Na'vi are capable of violent Jihad 'across the Universe' like the Fremen are?

[athanasios]

Fremen were of a peaceful origin though.

[SandChigger]

Do you really think the Na'vi are capable of violent Jihad 'across the Universe' like the Fremen are?

How far in the future was Avatar again? Only about a century and a half, right? So it's not like there's a lot of human universe for them to jihad across, now is there?

They have no ships of their own and it's not like the "Do as we say or we'll destroy the unobtanium" gambit is going to work on the Terrans for them like it did for Paul and the Fremen against the Guild.

They're adapted to a lower gravity world, and would require spacesuits or breathers on planets hospitable to humans (like Earth).

And I seriously suspect that they would begin to suffer severe psychological distress once they were separated from the Pandoran biosphere and the Eywa entity.

Na'vi are pretty poorly adapted to space travel and conquest, I'm afraid.

[ErasOmnius]

Well maybe 'Avatar' is more like 'Dune' than I originally thought. Maybe thousand years of years from now, the Na'vi will be imposing their brand of 'Jihad' on human-kind, with apparatus to adapt to other planets.

[HarryCanyon]

Well maybe 'Avatar' is more like 'Dune' than I originally thought. Maybe thousand years of years from now, the Na'vi will be imposing their brand of 'Jihad' on human-kind, with apparatus to adapt to other planets.

I'm sure Jake Sully might evolve into Kwisatz Haderech terroritory.

[SandChigger]

I'm sure Jake Sully might evolve into Kwisatz Haderech terroritory.

Why? That makes ZERO sense.

There was no Messiah/Mahdi prediction in Avatar, only a tradition of the toruk makto who united the tribes in time of danger. (I just watched the movie again on New Year's Day, so the details are fresh in my mind.)

Sully evinced NO psychic powers or prescience; the use of Kwisatz Haderach (g*dd*m it, LEARN TO EFFING SPELL) is COMPLETELY WRONG.

Ugh.

Ish yara al-ahbal habal-u.

[Lawliet]

Why? That makes ZERO sense.

There was no Messiah/Mahdi prediction in Avatar, only a tradition of the toruk makto who united the tribes in time of danger. (I just watched the movie again on New Year's Day, so the details are fresh in my mind.)

Sully evinced NO psychic powers or prescience; the use of Kwisatz Haderach (g*dd*m it, LEARN TO EFFING SPELL) is COMPLETELY WRONG.

Ugh.

Ish yara al-ahbal habal-u.

Does the movie get better or worse the second time you watch it?

[ErasOmnius]

There's no question that Avatar gets worse the more it is watched.

One accepts that it is a 'pretty' movie with a thin plot after a while.

[SandChigger]

Does the movie get better or worse the second time you watch it?

Well, this was only the second time I had watched it, so I'd honestly have to say that it didn't change much for me, but that I picked up on some things that I'd missed the first time around.

I didn't hate the movie, by any means. (Again, I'm WAY less demanding of TV/movie scifi than I am of books.) I just didn't think the story warranted all the hooplah when it came out. The CG were still impressive, even without the 3D.