Why the collapse of the economy would be GOOD

[Dante]

Oh I do love controvertial topics, don't you?

Right! Here's one of my (numerous) arguments for the complete and utter destruction of the world's economy.

If the economy were to collapse (for whatever reason), then so would politics. It's quite simple. Without monetary backing, no elected leader would be able to stay in power. Without a stable economy, no country could work with any other. Trade would cease, international finance would grind to a halt. Without money to run them, power stations and factories would shut down. And this in turn would halt water works, transportation, etc. Lack of oil or oil processing would mean that aeroplanes and cars would become useless. In short, next to nothing would work.

This process would take perhaps a week, maybe a month. But no lives would be lost by crashing planes or some such.

And then... the return of agriculture. Without trade to bring in shop goods, people would be forced to rear and grow their own, simply to survive. Industries that survived the initial onslaught would fall as their workers realied that food was more important than the archaic concept of money.

This in turn would bring about two classes of people. The farmers, which broadly covers everyone honestly trying to survive; and the fighters, broadly covering everyone exploiting the farmers.

Quite simply, there would not be enough food to go around. This would not be the only resource unavailable (think water, toilet paper, etc), but you get the idea. People would die. Only those strong enough to survive in a world without electricity or modern convenience would stay alive. These people would be the strong, and the brutal. But power always attracts the weaker elements. These brutes would be hailed as leaders, and those that saw them as a way to survive would flock to their sides. This would include those who could think. The intellectuals, the brains; those that could plot but perhaps not fight.

In short, a form of global gangland warfare would ensue. There would be no nukes, no warheads, no tanks, no battleships or aeroplanes. After a year or two there would be no guns. There would be fists. There would be knives. There would be daggers, swords, clubs, sharp sticks; anything that a person could lay thir hands on. And they would fight. It is human nature to fight, and these gangs would. Think about all the people in cities, all the millions of people crammed into such a small space. Cities would become warzones, and people fleeing to the country would find a similar, if perhaps slightly calmer situation there. It would be survival; band together with common minds and reject the others lest they kill you via stealing your food.

Anarchy would reign. Countries would cease to exist, only gangs and their territories. Sooner or later alliances would form, and a kind of feudal system. An autocratic 'government' in every gang. Peace treaties made, wars won... sooner or later things might settle down. Then again, they might not. Does it matter?

What matters is that modern warfare would be destroyed. The population of the earth would drop dramatically, cars and other enviromental problems would cease and hunting would become legal since 1) Nobody would enforce the non-existant laws and 2) It would be OK as it was for survival. Communism, other democratic political states, and capitalism, wouldn't even be options in that world. Autocracy would rule supreme.

It would be a wonderful world. A simple world where there is no financial burden, no moral bickering over abortion or euthanasia. No governments, no politicians, no nukes, no bureaucracy, no paperwork. A world of survival. A world of chaos, plots and intregue. A world of death, true. But perhaps the life that would rise afterwards would be all the better for it.

Not that I care. I would want it for the sheer thrill of being part of such a world. A world of fighting, simple warfare, autocracy tempered by agricultural life.

And wouldn't that solve all of the problems in recent debates?

[Acriku]

Quite ironically, America's most huge collapse of economy radically changed people's opinions about the government and enhanced government support, and thus a liberal influx.

[Dante]

The difference between that and my version being that the economy recovered afterwards.

[Acriku]

God Bless America :)

But anyways, yes I'm sure political reform would take place. After all, the crises following economic collapse would revert the country back to what is necessary under those conditions, and that is a simpler political system. However, once the economy begins to stabilize and then grow, politics may just revert back to what it was, or what the current generation feels is necessary.

[Dante]

I believe that would take too long. Perhaps two or more generations could pass until things returned to what this generation describes as 'normality.' And during that time, a lot could change.

Peerhaps the same systems wouldn't evolve, perhaps they would. But the chaos in between would provide an interesting starting point.

[Dude_Doc]

Well, if we "invent" robots and such, those could be to our advantage.

However, your scenario sounds like something from Deus Ex ;) ...

[Scrinlord]

sounds like "fight club" writ large. But it is a good idea, in theory. Problem is how it would recover

[Dante]

Who said it would recover?

[Caid Ivik]

How nice world. If countries perish, then we will turn into feudal society with unlimited power for those, which had enough courage to take all guns, which aren't too heavy. Or I think it would be even worse. It will be a world of barbarians, unruly tribes fightning for every resource. And once they will create states again. Next time you should limit joints when thinking, Scout...

[Edric O]

For once I agree with Caid.

How exactly would the collapse of human civilization and the return to barbarity and chaos be a good thing? ???

I shudder to think what would happen if one of those warlords somehow managed to find a way into one of the old and abandoned missile silos...

[Caid Ivik]

What missile silos? In a barbarian world without media they won't have a use. Enough is any weapon store. I don't see a difference between a world scarred by nuclear war and a barbarian tribes ruled by rifles aimed at slaves' heads.

[Edric O]

Hmmm, good point.

In the world scarred by nuclear war, however, everyone would be more or less dead. I'm not sure if that's any worse than barbarity, though. Living as a slave is no life at all, IMO. I'd rather die trying to win my freedom.

[Dante]

There would be no way to launch them, even if they were found.

Collapse of civilisation would be a good thing! A world of roaming mercenaries; death and destruction with no beaurocracy, no bickering, no ineffectual politicians of democracy. By no means perfect, but certainly never stagnent. War would be a constant state of affairs, but it would be localised. There would be wars over land, food... raids by enemy parties and defences. After ammunition ran out there would be a new form of fighting with whatever came to hand. Hopefully, nobody would rise above the others too much. And if they did, the rival groups should unite to bring them down.

Limit joints? Eh?

Barbarianism? Not quite. Barbarianism is brutish, thug-like. Or at least in most sense it is. If everone is a world of my envisioning was like that then everybody would die. No, there would be simple plans, strategies. "Capture the high ground." And yes, most likely slavery. But probably very little discrimination, that is a luxury only the reasonably well off can afford.

I don't care about equality, freedom of the masses, rights of the whatever. This world is stagnating. It is boring. The only way to make things change is to STOP trying to please everyone. Anarchy, chaos, whatever you want to call it. It would be blissfully simple.

[Sardauker-Kirov]

A Zombie plague would be more horrifying than a Nuclear threat.

(Not the zombie plague of resident evil and the horrible corny mutation crap.)

Something like Night of the living dead or Dawn of the dead.

Zombie plague would ensure total destruction in a sickening and gruesome way and could be more torturing than a Nuclear bomb since it could wipe a city or destroy the earth's atmosphere.

If the Terrorists invents a disease like this, it would be impossible to stop.

[Acriku]

Kirov, please stop posting offtopic irrelevant posts.

I don't care about equality, freedom of the masses, rights of the whatever. This world is stagnating. It is boring. The only way to make things change is to STOP trying to please everyone. Anarchy, chaos, whatever you want to call it. It would be blissfully simple.

So make your life more colorful at the expense of other's lives and comforts. Yes, that's very rational. ::)

[Sardauker-Kirov]

Kirov, please stop posting offtopic irrelevant posts.

I don't care about equality, freedom of the masses, rights of the whatever. This world is stagnating. It is boring. The only way to make things change is to STOP trying to please everyone. Anarchy, chaos, whatever you want to call it. It would be blissfully simple.

So make your life more colorful at the expense of other's lives and comforts. Yes, that's very rational. ::)

Contribution to the collapse of the economy in a more torturing way is not irrelevant, in your eyes it is irrelevant however. ::)

So think before trying to make someone's post look like a fool.

[Acriku]

Not at all am I trying to make your post look foolish, but it is rather irrelevant when you start talking about zombies and the night of the living dead in an economy thread.

[Dante]

So make your life more colorful at the expense of other's lives and comforts. Yes, that's very rational. ::)

Perhaps not rational, but damn interesting! Why should I care about others? It's not like most of the people I know have ever been nice to me. I have no qualms about making the lives of people I have never met absolutely miserable. Well, perhaps I do... But I quash them. People I care about on the other hand, I will do my best to protect.

Don't say that's not fair. I know it isn't. So don't point it out; because I know. And I don't care.

Er... I fail to see how terrorists or zombies relate to this thread. I don't want to destroy everyone, just make the livs of the survivors more.... worth living.

[nemafakei]

Wow. You would make things more interesting. Hmph! Corruption and civilisation will return.

The only way to permenantly set crime rates and unemployment and so on to zero is to finish the job: to completely destroy humanity and preferably all life as well.

That's not going to happen any time soon.

However, your suggestion will almost definitely lead inorexably to another basically stagnant, antagonistic society, perhaps somewhat different from our own now, but still just as boring.

[Dante]

That's inevitable though. All other systems would get the same thing. But at least in mine, the interim period would be interesting. And that's the only one I'd occupy.

[Scrinlord]

yes, it would be interesting, but also full of death and destruction, which may or may not be worth it. it all depends on what comes out of it in the end

[Caid Ivik]

Scout, it would be a very weird world, if we would think about world as a thing for our short life. "Flood after me" thinking shows only a lack of true sense. Then you can think about anything as good, even absolute robbespierric tyranny - if you're the ruler...

[Dante]

yes, it would be interesting, but also full of death and destruction, which may or may not be worth it. it all depends on what comes out of it in the end

No it doesn't. Who cares about what comes out of it? I plan to prolong it throughout my life so that when I die it will just do what comes naturally. Then I won't care. And death and destruction would do the world a power of good.

What exactly are you saying Caid? That everything is good from a different perspective? Possibly.

[Scrinlord]

So what kind of a society would you WANT to live in after the collapse. Total anarchy? Nomadic tribes wandering the landscape. what would you want?

[nemafakei]

I still don't see how you could call it 'good' with any degree of confidence whatsoever!