[Release] Emperor assasination mission

[aarmaageedoon]

Hello all,

I made a single mission at a bit higher difficulty you might have experienced so far.

Download link:

DOWNLOAD

You need to unzip files in your dune 2000 -> data -> maps folder.

It's essential that you use cncnet platform to run this mission. 

The file contains 3 difficulty version.

Settings must be like on following screenshot.

Spoiler

https://imgur.com/a/IhDi6

A short plot:

Spoiler

The time has come to take revenge on the Emperor for his support to Harkonnen. You will need to lokate his palace and destroy it. That is your main mission. Protect Fremen sietch. 
We can't forget about those who helped us in past. Our spies report that the Ordos claimed rich in spice nort west land and heavily fortified it. They are neutral, they came only to harvest spice. You can try to wipe them out and take control over their mining facilities but maybe it would be more beneficial to convince them to join our side. You will be provided more information during the mission. 

Destroy the Emperor.
 

FOR THE DUKE!

Any thoughts and suggestions are welcome.

Have fun!

[Cm_blast]

16 hours ago, aarmaageedoon said:

Hello all,

I made a single mission at a bit higher difficulty you might have experienced so far.

Any thoughts and suggestions are welcome.

Have fun!

Good. Knowing you I'll probably play it in easy  (the hard one, I don't know about the other two).

[aarmaageedoon]

9 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

Knowing you I'll probably play it in easy

You must play it via cncnet. When you launch it using mission launcher, map will not work properly.

[Fey]

Yay :O

[Shawn19]

I can not find mission in the laucher. Why?

• Quote

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[Cm_blast]

6 hours ago, aarmaageedoon said:

You must play it via cncnet. When you launch it using mission launcher, map will not work properly.

Yes, I know, but if I remember well the handicap makes the costs and time production to imitate the easy-normal-hard difficulty. But anyay; I'll play with the current configuration of your screen, even if I loose.

32 minutes ago, Shawn19 said:

I can not find mission in the laucher. Why?

He made the map to be loaded with the online-multiplayer "cncnet5.exe" fron gruntmod instead the mission launcher.

Edited April 20, 2018 by Cm_blast

[aarmaageedoon]

24 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

56 minutes ago, Shawn19 said:

I can not find mission in the laucher. Why?

He made the map to be loaded with the online-multiplayer "cncnet5.exe" fron gruntmod instead the mission launcher.

Exactly. Cncnet provides different AI behavior for this map.

24 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

Yes, I know, but if I remember well the handicap makes the costs and time production to imitate the easy-normal-hard difficulty. But anyay; I'll play with the current configuration of your screen, even if I loose.

Handicap 1 (like in the screenshot) means easy, 2 - normal, 3-hard. And this map is meant to be played on easy.  So if you play it on easy you won't make it easier than I wanted it to be.

 

 

[Cm_blast]

2 hours ago, aarmaageedoon said:

Exactly. Cncnet provides different AI behavior for this map.

Well, techinally one can copycat the AI behavior into the mission launcher. I had the same AI used in practice mode (training eengineers included), but that was from the vanilla Dune game; If I am not mistaked the current AI for the cncnet online mode has tweaked to be harder (or cheats having extra initial money so it can train eengineers and still not running out of money).

The only things you can't do by using the mis-launch it's the Harkonnen being grey or the Emperor building Devastators on his own, which could be a problem from your map.

2 hours ago, aarmaageedoon said:

Handicap 1 (like in the screenshot) means easy, 2 - normal, 3-hard. And this map is meant to be played on easy.  So if you play it on easy you won't make it easier than I wanted it to be.

Not really. In campaign style playing in easy cut in half any enemy reinforcements and deliveries; on top of that, if the AI buy units through the Starport only half of them are delivered (I think the AI on easy don't buy anything at all, just because he is going to waste money on units that won't appear on the game). So yes, if there are starports involved on your map playing on "true easy" would make you map more easy :P.

Edited April 20, 2018 by Cm_blast

[aarmaageedoon]

17 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

"true easy" would make you map more easy

If you want to enjoy all the features you can set enemy AI to be easy. Not really sure how much would be changed.

[Cm_blast]

On 21/4/2018 at 4:24 PM, aarmaageedoon said:

If you want to enjoy all the features you can set enemy AI to be easy. Not really sure how much would be changed.

Since AI don't have any handicap, my guess it's "Hard" = AI playing on easy (low prices - fast building) and a AI set on easy it's the opposite.

Anyway; I played this map and, as expected, I loose.

I was happy because I manage to survive a massive Harkonnen attack (comming for every direction possible), but... then, the other enemy joined at the worst time possible; that was too much to me.

For now I can no longer trusth Fey's or your maps =(. Both of you are a deceivers.

Spoiler

And I am not talking about the constact harass for the DH, but the mere presence of the Ordos and how pointless they proved to be. At the end figthing against all of them with devastators and all it's just too hard to me.
 

Well, I survive enough to kill 700 enemy units and my ally 700 units more. At least I survive several enemy big waves so it's ok. I wasn't expecting to win anyway :P.

 

Edited April 22, 2018 by Cm_blast

[Feda]

CnCNet difficulty levels are related to how much starting cash the AI gets. Easy gets 2500, normal gets whatever you set it for the players i think, and hard gets 40k. If I remember correctly, funky set all AI modes to use handicap 0 settings.

 

Of course, overwriting the cash with events in the mission file renders that difficulty AI option useless. If it's a singleplayer mission, I recommend doing it as a mission launcher type of mission instead of skirmish-mission. As Cm said, it is very easy to copy the cncnet skirmish AI over to your map, or copy some other AIs. I can tell you, the cncnet AI is not the strongest that is available, there are some which are stronger. Also, you can create your own AI.

Edited April 24, 2018 by FedaYkin

[Cm_blast]

6 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

If I remember correctly, funky set all AI modes to use handicap 0 settings.

What this means? There is handicap 1 to 3 for the player; I guess the AI just use the normal prizes, right?

6 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

As Cm said, it is very easy to copy the cncnet skirmish AI over to your map, or copy some other AIs

Do you know if the AI it's stored in the "_PRAC.MIS" file from the "maps" folder? If I open that file with the editor (with a map called "prac.map") in the Atreides AI tab the values are skirmish type (building prioritys and etc); but I don't know if this is the one used for the cncnet or it's just the dune 2000 vanilla meanwhile the new AI it's loaded from another file.

Or maybe both are the same AI and giving 40.000 credits it's the only true balance done to the AI?

6 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

normal gets whatever you set it for the players i think,

I barely played online cpu games; but the last time I remember playing with a friend in a 2 vs 2 match I got my ass kicked by the AI. It's true that I wasn't playing too serious, but I never lost that hard when I played the vanilla practice mode, even with 3 AIs in the game (which focus, at least early, against the player).

Maybe in normal they start with 10.000-15.000 credits (or +X extra credits based on the initial money given). or maybe the combination of "no eengineers" (AI not wasting money) and myself underestimating the AI it was the culprit.

Someone know for sure?

Edited April 24, 2018 by Cm_blast

[Feda]

14 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

What this means? There is handicap 1 to 3 for the player; I guess the AI just use the normal prizes, right?

Handicap 0 is the one labeled "easy" for the player. It means the AI builds as if it were on easy. I'm not sure if cncnet adopted this in the end, but in early testings that I did with funky it was set to 0 for the AI. In the vanilla game, it was set to 1 (normal) for all AI players, no matter what the player difficulty was.

 

14 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

Do you know if the AI it's stored in the "_PRAC.MIS" file from the "maps" folder? If I open that file with the editor (with a map called "prac.map") in the Atreides AI tab the values are skirmish type (building prioritys and etc); but I don't know if this is the one used for the cncnet or it's just the dune 2000 vanilla meanwhile the new AI it's loaded from another file.

Or maybe both are the same AI and giving 40.000 credits it's the only true balance done to the AI?

The AI is stored in _PRAC.mis. That is where all maps which do not have custom .mis files (so, the standard skirmish maps with no events) load the AI from. 

 

The AI is modified, it's not the original dune AI with more money. They are set to build very quickly and the unit composition/unit build priorities are also changed a bit. Something that I still don't understand is why they ditched the 3 factory for AI feature. It is superior to an AI building just from one, no matter what they say, as I have tested this personally  Hence why I said there are better AI versions out there than the cncnet default one. 

14 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

I barely played online cpu games; but the last time I remember playing with a friend in a 2 vs 2 match I got my ass kicked by the AI. It's true that I wasn't playing too serious, but I never lost that hard when I played the vanilla practice mode, even with 3 AIs in the game (which focus, at least early, against the player).

Maybe in normal they start with 10.000-15.000 credits (or +X extra credits based on the initial money given). or maybe the combination of "no eengineers" (AI not wasting money) and myself underestimating the AI it was the culprit

Maybe you played a coop map. The coop maps, while they look exactly like skirmish, use custom .mis file with most likely custom AI. At least I know for sure all my maps use custom AI with probably 3 factory builds.

 

To clarify, the AI builds and priorities are exactly the same for all difficulty levels, the only thing that changes is the starting cash, which makes a huge difference for the AI. 

Edited April 25, 2018 by FedaYkin

[Cm_blast]

4 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

Handicap 0 is the one labeled "easy" for the player. It means the AI builds as if it were on easy. I'm not sure if cncnet adopted this in the end, but in early testings that I did with funky it was set to 0 for the AI. In the vanilla game, it was set to 1 (normal) for all AI players, no matter what the player difficulty was.

oooohhh... Then that was the reason I lost so hard xD. With no eengineers and lower prize/build-speed makes sense the AI razing my base.

4 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

The AI is stored in _PRAC.mis. That is where all maps which do not have custom .mis files (so, the standard skirmish maps with no events) load the AI from. 

I just search, but it's not in _prac.mis but in _spawn.mis.

In prac.mis the AI it's skirmish type with 1 per building, just like the vanilla one. In _spawn.mis I can see the 3 heavy factory, 3 light factory, 2 turrets, etc... plus more priority to the troopers and quads.

Or at least appears when I create a map called "spawn.map", which loads his "_spawn.mis" and the Atr Tab have this modified 3 buildings AI.

4 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

It is superior to an AI building just from one, no matter what they say, as I have tested this personally  Hence why I said there are better AI versions out there than the cncnet default one. 

Maybe the AI with 40.000 credits do better because he don't run out of money and, by the time the 3 facts are done the tanks builds faster, but for an AI with only 10.000 starting credits (or less) that's a suicide. You are forcing and AI that don't know where to place the refs to use the available money on buildings instead units. I mean, while you are low of money it's better to use 5.000 credits on tanks-quad-troopers than on having multiple factories. You build faster yes, but if you don't have the money to build non-stop it's useless.

Although I can't tell for sure. I am more used to the campaign style one. Everytime I try to do my own skirmish one I end creating one AI that: a) overflow in windtraps or b) run out of energy at some point.

Anyway; I extracted the cncnet AI, so if I need to use one for a skirmish type of enemy maybe I'll try that.

4 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

Maybe you played a coop map. The coop maps, while they look exactly like skirmish, use custom .mis file with most likely custom AI. At least I know for sure all my maps use custom AI with probably 3 factory builds.

Was a traditional westwood map. To me was a combination of AI playing on easy and no eengineers, since in the vanilla game they run out of money because the high price the eengineer requires. And being used to the practice mode where the enemy run ouf of money because the engie; I wasn't expecting the enemy to be that agressive.

Previous games I played a few coop maps like the orignal Ordos mission 9 (by dato?) and I even used your own campaings, like the "Ixian we tech-up Arrakis". Doing a few modifications so my friend and I could those maps instead only the 1 MCV - X units and doing stuff like giving to my frend grenadiers or fremen as loop reinforcements and stuff like that.

Was funny because all the players and AI have to be set in order: Atreides, Hark, Ordos, etc... but I wasn't aware about the AI tab back in them and sometimes I could see AIs building MCV xD. I was "wait, why that enemy have 10 MCV at the entrance of the heavy factory? that didn't happen in the original map"

4 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

To clarify, the AI builds and priorities are exactly the same for all difficulty levels, the only thing that changes is the starting cash, which makes a huge difference for the AI. 

Thanks a lot. I wasn't aware about this. 

On 21/4/2018 at 4:24 PM, aarmaageedoon said:

If you want to enjoy all the features you can set enemy AI to be easy. Not really sure how much would be changed.

I quote this to let you know aarmaageedoon. I extracted the AI used in cncnet, in case you want to change your three maps to be available for mission launcher. However as a campaign-type of map AI it's going to build in "normal" (but the player too) and the emperor can't build devastators anymore.

On the other hand, you can add the short-plot into the briefing; even at that point you can see "you must play this map on easy". Or since now both player and AI builds in normal let be that way.

Other modifications like setting the eng priority to 0 to not build it, the AI starting with 80.000 credits, more devast deliveries to the emperor... etc.

In short: If you are planning to do it as part of a single-map type of mission to be played using mission launcher instead cncnet, I'll upload here the AI I extracted. But if not are interested then it's fine.

Edited April 25, 2018 by Cm_blast

[Feda]

Oh yea you are right about spawn.mis, totally forgot about that. So does the ai use 3 factory by default on cncnet? That is cool, i sure am outdated since i havent played in a long while

 

The original ordos mission 9 port was something I put up very quickly to test playing missions online back when the feature was in testing. It worked quite well. It is the first ever coop mission online. 

[Cm_blast]

6 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

So does the ai use 3 factory by default on cncnet? That is cool, i sure am outdated since i havent played in a long while

I don't know. I executed the Cncnet only to play armagedon map, and the folder was pretty empty before doing it (only with westwood maps) so in this half year I had the game installed I didn't ever play once xD.

One day I'll play a regular map just to see what the AI do.

6 minutes ago, FedaYkin said:

It worked quite well. It is the first ever coop mission online. 

The more funny thing it's the "MCV trapped into a few turrets so they are killed quickly" xD. I was "unit lots? how?" and when the outpost was built "ooooh, I had a unit there".

Edited April 25, 2018 by Cm_blast

[aarmaageedoon]

8 hours ago, FedaYkin said:

So does the ai use 3 factory by default on cncnet?

No, I just copied a map using that AI and totaly reworked it to make this mission. If you make a brand new map and launch it on cncnet it will have "standard" AI.

When I tried to copy my mission into missions folder it just didn't run that AI. That's why I posted it to be essential to run this map through cncnet. But am still learning.

[Cm_blast]

1 hour ago, aarmaageedoon said:

No, I just copied a map using that AI and totaly reworked it to make this mission. If you make a brand new map and launch it on cncnet it will have "standard" AI.

When I tried to copy my mission into missions folder it just didn't run that AI. That's why I posted it to be essential to run this map through cncnet. But am still learning.

For working on mission launcher you need to create/import 1 AI, or else it's just inactive.

From the AI I had for _prac.mis, the AI have:
- First attack at 12.000 ticks = 4 min (max speed).
- Every other attack every 15.000 ticks.
- 2 harv and 1 carryall per ref.
- Proportion of 3 infantry and 3 troopers (half units infantry, half units troopers)
- 1 Barrack. 1 light and 1 heavy fact.

This it's the "standard" AI you are refering?

Then, if I take the cncnet one have this other numbers:
- First attack at 7000 ticks = 2,3 min.
- Every other attack every 16.000 ticks.
- 3 harv and 2 carryall per ref.
- Proportion of 7 infantry and 70 troopers (a few infantry, tons of troopers)
- 1 Barrack. 3 light and 3 heavy facts.

Take here if you like:
Practice Generic AI.misai <-- (I give it this name; it's the one I refered on top).

Press "import" in the side section and load this file; The current side selected will have from now on a skirmish type of AI. Later you can change the AI to have 5 harv per refs or whatever you want.

This AI will behave as intended: expanding the base and selling everything if he can not continue anymore (out of money-refs-factories).

Your Emperor won't have devastators, but on the other hand now he will have the Sardaukar Campaign one. Deliveries or reinforcents events can be used to give him the devastator if you really want that.

Edited April 25, 2018 by Cm_blast

[Feda]

On 4/25/2018 at 3:39 PM, Cm_blast said:

The more funny thing it's the "MCV trapped into a few turrets so they are killed quickly" xD. I was "unit lots? how?" and when the outpost was built "ooooh, I had a unit there".

Yea, that was the old way of dealing with multiplayer starting locations for coop missions. Back then we didn't have a way to prevent MCVs getting spawned, so we had to put them somewhere where they get killed quickly. Nowadays there is some entry in the .ini file to prevent MCV spawn.

Edited April 29, 2018 by FedaYkin

[Cm_blast]

1 hour ago, FedaYkin said:

Yea, that was the old way of dealing with multiplayer starting locations for coop missions. Back then we didn't have a way to prevent MCVs getting spawned, so we had to put them somewhere where they get killed quickly. Nowadays there is some entry in the .ini file to prevent MCV spawn.

Interesting. I am looking into some .ini. So "Techlevel= X" forces the tech of the map right? same with the money.

What "SidebarIconCount=1" means?

[Feda]

2 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

Interesting. I am looking into some .ini. So "Techlevel= X" forces the tech of the map right? same with the money.

What "SidebarIconCount=1" means?

About tech level and money, yes.

 

It means how many icons you will see on the right building and unit sidebar without having to scroll for the rest. It is independent of the resolution (normally using a very big res would allow you to have most icons there without having to scroll down, this option forces the game to display x icons no matter of the resolution)

Edited April 29, 2018 by FedaYkin

[Cm_blast]

1 hour ago, FedaYkin said:

About tech level and money, yes.

 

It means how many icons you will see on the right building and unit sidebar without having to scroll for the rest. It is independent of the resolution (normally using a very big res would allow you to have most icons there without having to scroll down, this option forces the game to display x icons no matter of the resolution)

Interesting to know. I guess some only works for skirmish maps loaded from cncnet.