Acriku Posted September 23, 2003 Author Share Posted September 23, 2003 the moment you say that there is no right and wrong, you speak for everyone. Even if it is your opinion, you are still saying "It is my opinion that everyone who thinks there is a right and wrong....is wrong. Right and wrong is only determined individually....and if you disagree, even though you are not me, you are wrong."I can be of the opinion that everyone who says otherwise is wrong (although I'd be willing to try and understand how they came to that conclusion), but I still speak for myself. If I spoke for everyone, then I would be assuming that they are of the same opinion, and since I know they all are not, I cannot speak for them. a SERIOUS contradiction here. So sad that your atheism has blinded you to simple logic.I don't see how a discussion like this would deal with anything SERIOUS, and I also don't see what in atheism could blind me from anything. You're putting more into the definition than what the definition entails.an atheist could have stopped the slave trade, but not do so rationally and be consistent with himself. The only way to have stopped a WORLD WIDE institution that was accepted as RIGHT by the MAJORITY of humans on earth, is to make an appeal to an absolute moral standard. It is impossible to do so otherwise...or are you going to explain how?If that person's morality is that slavery is wrong for everybody, that does not make the morality absolute, or universal. You said it yourself, not everybody would abide by it. And even if everyone did abide by it, it still does not sufficiently prove that there is an absolute, universal morality. If it is universal, and absolute, why doesn't everyone abide by it? Also, if it was part of my morality (Note: my morality) that treating humans unfairly based on their race, or ethnicity, is wrong, then I could very well be an advocate of the stopping of the world wide trade. I don't see why I could not. My morality is not therefore universal nor absolute, but it's still my morality. We all have moralities, but not one is universal, nor absolute, and also no morality is less valid for being relative. You seem to think they do become less valid, and that is where I think you are wrong.wrong for just you? Or wrong for everyone, for all time?If it is your opinion that slavery is wrong for everyone, then you just contradicted yourself (again).Slavery is wrong for me, and anyone who also thinks so. It is my opinion that it is wrong, and not a universal moral. Acriku is making objective claims about moralityThose objective claims themselves do not constitute a morality, and do not suggest that there is a universal morality, either. So there is no contradiction.Either Hitler's actions were WRONG or they were NOT WRONG. They cannot be both right and wrong simultaneously.You're using the fallacy of the excluded middle. It can't either be wrong or not wrong, as it is relative. They can be neither right nor wrong simultaneously, as I do suspect. This statement is true for all humans.Oh omniscient emprworm, tell me my future so that I can avoid future tragedies ::) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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