Religious Divide & US/Europe Politics

ordos45 · July 16, 2003

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewCulture.asp?Page=%5CCulture%5Carchive%5C200307%5CCUL20030716b.html

An interesting article. It sites differences between Europe and the United States in matters of religion, and how it influences politics in both.

Just to show what it's like...

According to recent findings by the Pew Global Attitudes Project, sponsored by the Pew Research Center for the People & the Press, 59 percent of Americans identified religion as an important part of their lives. In contrast, 11 percent of the French, 14 percent of Russians and 33 percent of Britons said religion was important to them.
"Europe is decidedly a post-Christian society," said Dr. Richard Lessner, executive director of the Family Research Council's American Renewal Project. "Faith is far less important in the daily lives of Europeans. Their institutions are not rooted in a particular faith point-of-view. They are thoroughly secular societies, with a very different national history from the national history of America."

Sardauker-Kirov · July 16, 2003

The Bush part is interesting.

If god existed, God would rather smash Bush's face into a iron table multiple times and send a pack of angry German and Thai Kickboxers after him.

And drags him through a lake of lava etc etc.

But I don't see what is wrong with expressing your religion or faith, besides, if people can build a satanic worship temple.

The goverment and police doesn't give a damn, but when you throw a prop of paper on the ground, the police is always there.

Ironic isn't?

If you're a Christian or Catholic in a muslim country, they will blow your head off. Countries in example;

Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Egypt etc etc.

nampigai · July 16, 2003

those countries have Christian and even jewish groups Kirov so I think you're a little off there.

My opinion is that Bush did a mistake by making it into a christian crusade (the war on Iraq). I don't have the source but saw a speech on the tv where he said something like "god is with us" This make him sound more like a religius fanatic than the leader of the most powerfull country in the world....however this just show the lack of brains he suffers from.

Sardauker-Kirov · July 16, 2003

Nampigai, go in to a Arab country and express your Christian religion.

Don't come to me crying when your head got exploded by a ak-47 bullet.

There are jews in the Arab countries but they're isolated from the general population.

What Bush is doing is beyond stupidity, if he keeps on saying 'We are the holy warriors of god, or we do this in the name of god and sacred'

We can expect a Jihad from the Arabs, not only does the innocent people suffer, but so does the whole world.

nampigai · July 16, 2003

people are expressing their christian religion in various arab countries without having their heads blown off.

Acriku · July 16, 2003

Kirov you sure do have a closed-minded view of the world. Christian killings do exist, but those are in remote countries that chaos roams and hardly any order exists. Every arab does not want to kill christians. And I have never heard Bush refer to us as the warriors of god, that's just stupid. He has mentioned god a lot, but he doesn't rub it in.

nampigai · July 16, 2003

oh btw Ordos45 an interesting article. I don't agree with all of the views, but basicly, it hits the nail rather well.

Edric O · July 16, 2003

There's one more thing that the article forgot to mention: American atheists are far more militant than European atheists, and they are also generally angry, elitist and sometimes outright intolerant. European atheists are usually far more friendly and they don't have anything against religious people.

It would be VERY useful if theists and atheists on both sides of the Atlantic understood all these differences. That way, American atheists will stop lashing out at European Christians for what American fundamentalists do.

Acriku · July 16, 2003

Eh? What are you basing that off of? Atheist Network? I'm sure they are the minority, Edric. Pretty insane what goes on over there.

Caid Ivik · July 17, 2003

Nampigai, go in to a Arab country and express your Christian religion.
Don't come to me crying when your head got exploded by a ak-47 bullet.
There are jews in the Arab countries but they're isolated from the general population.

Tarik Aziz, former iraqi premier, was a christian. Ancient coptic communities, with direct link to Catholic Church, are across whole Middle East. Most in Syria, Libanon and Iraq. They take about 1-3% of population. About Jews it is also similar, altough after constitution of Erets Jisrael most emmigrated there. Muslims have a religious law of "dhimma", what is something like a tolerance agreement, only some militants like bin Ladin don't know about it.

Also, many jewish teachers worked in arab world, not only tolerated, but also invited to many royal courts. As well as in Europe, just here were "court jews" more than just economic aides. Many of them worked in education and had arab students. Maimonides was writing his theories about Tora and Talmud in arabic and publiced it in Baghdad - seems to be a heresy?

ordos45 · July 17, 2003

Even during the spread of Islam a local religion was tolerated, unless it caused violent uprisings or that such thing. Of course, I remember from History Class a few years ago that there was a tax the non muslims payed during that period.

nemafakei · July 17, 2003

"American atheists are far more militant than European atheists"

The US is more militant than Europe. Look at the most recent bit of foreign policy.

Caid Ivik · July 18, 2003

Even during the spread of Islam a local religion was tolerated, unless it caused violent uprisings or that such thing. Of course, I remember from History Class a few years ago that there was a tax the non muslims payed during that period.

Dhimma contained some "protection money", how would we call it today.

Sardauker-Kirov · July 19, 2003

Kirov you sure do have a closed-minded view of the world. Christian killings do exist, but those are in remote countries that chaos roams and hardly any order exists. Every arab does not want to kill christians. And I have never heard Bush refer to us as the warriors of god, that's just stupid. He has mentioned god a lot, but he doesn't rub it in.

WOAH, you don't say..........!

::)

Every day people gets killed by Muslim/Christian extremists.

A normal arab maybe not, but fanatics and extremists will shoot a Christian in sight.

As for Bush, he called himself that a few times that on the television months ago.

and Caid Ivik, you're right on that.

Most goverments do tolerate other religions, but like I mentioned before, the fanatic invidiuals just blow them up in sight.

And mark it as a accident.

Ne kadar decir...

Hoe veel keer moet ik dit zeggen.

Ato hamao Xian...

Caid Ivik · July 19, 2003

What does Fatah in Israel is marked as "revolution" not an accident.

nampigai · July 21, 2003

Kirov you sure do have a closed-minded view of the world. Christian killings do exist, but those are in remote countries that chaos roams and hardly any order exists. Every arab does not want to kill christians. And I have never heard Bush refer to us as the warriors of god, that's just stupid. He has mentioned god a lot, but he doesn't rub it in.
WOAH, you don't say..........!
::)
Every day people gets killed by Muslim/Christian extremists.
A normal arab maybe not, but fanatics and extremists will shoot a Christian in sight.
As for Bush, he called himself that a few times that on the television months ago.
and Caid Ivik, you're right on that.
Most goverments do tolerate other religions, but like I mentioned before, the fanatic invidiuals just blow them up in sight.
And mark it as a accident.
Ne kadar decir...
Hoe veel keer moet ik dit zeggen.
Ato hamao Xian...

please Kirov, if you claim that there are groups whos only goal is to kill Christians, then show your source. I have never heard of this before.

Caid Ivik · July 21, 2003

Al-Qaida? ::)

ordos45 · July 22, 2003

Al-Qaida? ::)

Well they have other goals as well. But if we wish to categorize as such, here's a few others:

Islamic Jihad

Hezbollah

Hamas

nampigai · July 22, 2003

They don't kill christians because of their faith.

Caid Ivik · July 22, 2003

Bands like Hamas fight against Israel. They tolerate christians, unless they don't defend their jewish targets. Al-Qaida is specially aimed against USA and other christian powers. Bin Ladin always calls to fight against "crusaders".

nampigai · July 22, 2003

Yes Caid but until now I don't think they've said they kill people due to their beliefs.

Sardauker-Kirov · July 22, 2003

We don't know what their goals are, probably their goal is world domination and that means destroying other religions.

Like they could ::)

Unless if they have a few nuclear bombs and I doubt Korea has Muslims in their country. ;D

http://www.domini.org/openbook/home.htm

There are many many sources of religion vs religion websites.

If I type a few words about "christian violence" in the search engine, I get flooded by websites that contain information about violence on churches, religion and people.

Caid Ivik · July 22, 2003

Nice is that statement "Peace be to you!". Isalam alejkum, arab greetings...

Sardauker-Kirov · July 22, 2003

"Peace be with you" or "Peace with you"

The greeting is quite ancient.

But you can find modern day people saying "Peace"

I don't mind saying Salam Aleykum against my Arab friend.

Or Konnichiwa against my Japanese friends.

It's funny how they reply on it

Anyways, we do not know what is going on in the third world.

Once again, the media controls the outcome of what the 'result' will be in the happening.

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