Drewski

Glad your enjoying it :)

LoL, hey its still the holidays, Im still drinkin, sober enough to have fun....I'm quite pleased with the map, maybe will add more towns when I've studied the Atlas more....(I LOVE Geography & History too)...and I'm good at both ;)

Ok, As the title says S America 1832. I've taken the base map, and made it more sensible. Everything is adjusted for an 1832 economic start, the Gold Win is Extremely tough. I've adjusted a lot on the map, especially producing viable mountain passes, and remodelling industry, but expect things to be hilly,,, Industry actually exists now, and doesn't necessitate a sheer drop down to the coast. It's a V1.0 of the map, only the basic win conditions, no visible events, robbers added and well, you might get annoyed with them.. Tips:- Rio to Sao Paulo now has a pass that roughly follows the real life Railroad. You can connect from day one and stay under 3% grade if you get it right. Look for a potential pass to Brazil's interior via Vittoria. As always, let me know. As I said V1.0, if anyone cares about the map (excluding me ;)) I'll add events galore... South America 1832.zip

While this would seem logical, experience tells me it's not the case. In extreme micromanagement games (e.g. finger permanently above pause, every time a bell rings, stop the game, and check what the train needs to pick up), after a few runs, I've had perfect balance on many routes. For example, a train is scheduled to pick up 2 pax from a station, and when I pause the game on train arrival, that's time and time again exactly what is there. No more no less.This is despite the odd crash and robbery (and of course relies on an economy staying at the same lvl for a while, and the train in question not getting blocked much or breaking down)

Good points...that vaguely crossed my mind, but I thought they might become a little too useful....maybe not....I shall peruse the matter more while doing grocery shopping in a moment (and hopefully not forget items as my mind is on gaming matters as usual) :D

Nice work!A few comments:- 1) That sounds just about right. 2) Yes the buildings actually have the effect of making the cargo hang around longer. An early Post Office is a must, as it in effect gives you 50% more post to deliver...and since Post tends to arrive in stations not steadily but in clumps, there's a good reason for dedicated mail trains...(mail also pays better than anything else) 3 & 4) Yes. The game calls this a ROT factor (it's in the strat guide appendix). The formula depends on economy model, economy lvl, cargo type, demand lvl, distance, ROT factor. There may be other variables. Hitting upon the exact formula by accident isn't going to happen. N.B. Goods don't rot when in a station's storage (after being dropped off for a later train) 5,6,7) It's as you said. Hauling Coal and Iron for instance, over a long distance isn't very profitable. It's better to haul them on cheap trains to a local steel mill, then ship the steel with more powerful locos to where it's needed. I think that from experience, a player can look at a map, and very roughly estimate incomes (taking a normal economy lvl as a norm). ------------------- One of my pet peeves, is that goodwill doesn't seem to effect revenue. Take these scenarios:- a railroad is serving cattle country (represented by one ranch on the map). But the train picking up from there, let's say also picks up grain from farms elsewhere, and takes it to a bakery. The cattle don't get to market as they should, in fact many stand around grazing in the fields. Yet the railroad possibly profits from this situation, by keeping the market price high (via the demand model). Wouldn't a rancher pay more for a better service, where his cattle were picked up on a regular basis? Another scenario:- a triangle of three towns have a pax/mail service but it's so irregular, that no-one really knows when the trains are supposed to turn up ("When's the train arrive Stationmaster?...."Probably tuesday, maybe wednesday, might be thursday") Again the railroad keeps the demand high, but doesn't suffer from a bad service rating. Wouldn't folks be prepared to pay a little more for a reliable service? I'm thinking of using the event manager to represent this. E.g. Goodwil = Normal no bonus, then maybe a sliding scale of -10 to +10% on various/all cargo, depending on the goodwill lvl....not sure if this is a good idea or not...would probably have to ban the goodwill boosting managers. What d'ya think?

Here's an idea I've used on several maps, for example a `tweaked version` of the Midwest map, starting in 1830, where I've altered population to a more realistic lvl, and there are hubs like Chicago and Detroit far apart(albeit small hubs at that time), with fledgling villages with great potential in between. To help the `villages` grow, I supply a limited passanger and mail service. Lets say we have villages a-b-c-d-then Chicago. Chicago is the only one to actually accept pax and mail. So start a train at a) red light -one pax car. Move on to b) yellow flag , yellow light, add another pax car, c) yellow flag, yellow light three pax cars, d) yellow flag, yellow light, four pax cars, Chicago unload all , get paid, reload one or two pax to village a). I also do the same procedure for mail. This allows 2 things:- 1) The trains don't wait forever at each station, but will arrive with at least 2 full pax/mail cars to Chicago, with full distance payment. 2) It allows pax/mail and cargo to be kept seperate, which allows a better train selection, plus generally helps stop cargo intended for one train being picked up by another (though of course this can still happen). It also helps villages with no appropriate industry to grow, when you'd have no otherwise reason to deliver/collect there. You don't get a fantastic income from these trains, but they more than pay their way, and their aim is to provide a service and help the fledling settlements grow to towns. As for cargo, (if using expert lvl), you get virtually nothing for hauling e.g. food to a village, compared to somewhere that demands it (even with a demand lvl of only 1). So If I haven't anywhere else to deliver food to (let's say Chicago and Detroit are being well supplied, and I own all the industries involved), then hauling food to a fledling Indianapolis isn't really worth it. Better to start supplying a goods chain instead. As for back hauls, to go back to my first example. I'd purposefully look to supply industries that `fitted` my line. Say village c) had grain nearby and a) had a bakery (this would be ideal). Then the backhaul from Chicago to c) could be a single pax car or even empty--enough money would be made on the first two stages of the run. I would rarely run more than 3 cars of cargo on the early trains, :- if grain was being left in the fields, I'd add a duplicate train. If a) had the grain, and d) the bakery, the run is less lucrative, but the backhaul would still be a single pax or mail car (the route would still make money, just less). If Chicago had the bakery, and there was nowhere that wanted food, I'd forget all about hauling grain in my earlier plans, and hopefully have a goods chain or cattle chain , and plan accordingly. Of course, if you have multiple towns, then you can make all your early money hauling pax/mail, with a few choice cargo lines, but I find that too easy (unless the map is all about beating up on ai tycoons and ai companies ;)) A few ideas, hope they're of some use...I kept wanting to draw diagrams to illustrate , but maybe you can follow the rambling narration..

Thanks for all the info Jeff :) I thought about using the event manager, but since I don't have any defined goals on that map, will probably leave significant `eventing` to my next map , when I've researched the possibilities more further- that was my first effort with RRt2 after all..

I've never seen an ai sell anything that they've bought. For instance, on one of the Japan maps, there was an area with 4 granaries close together, one of which I was servicing very well early on. The ai beat me to buying it, so I shut down services completely, and moved on to the next granary which I bought. 50 yrs later, the ai still owned it, even though it hadn't had a service for 50 yrs...

Pretty sure that it does. I've bought e.g. a Distillery when it was the only sensibly placed one on the map, then changed my priorities, and not serviced it until decades later (forgot to sell it ), but it never disappeared. This was because one had popped up before, but with an intermittent service, it annoyingly disappeared, just as I had the chance to make it lucrative and buy it So I'd have to say, once bought by anyone, an industry stays for good.

Well in the early days, everything has pretty terrible acceleration. I'm sure you've noticed how much the trains slow down when they make almost any kind of turn. By keeping the routes straighter, but maybe a bit further, the trains do tend to get there quicker. They also get up to a good speed more quickly on a straight stretch. I of course try to keep all gradients `green`, but you'll notice that on a long straight, where a train has already got a up head of steam, a smallish portion of 2 -2.5% won't slow it down much (unless it's overloaded in the first place). I personally aim for everything under 3%, unless its absolutely unavoidable (my current railroad on that map, has one single grid tile higher than that: a 3.5%). Also, trains apparently have a much higher breakdown chance on bends (the game acts like they are carrying a much heavier load) .I haven't looked into the exact mathematics behind it, maybe Jeff knows a bit more.

You can lower grades by laying small chunks of track at 45 degrees to the main line, then delete them, but it's a pain to do. While the main Australia map is slightly more accurate (in some aspects) topographically than mine (in the main, the Blue Mts West of Sydney are further away on my map than in reality, this is done to stop virtually unclimbable grades, that don't really exist irl), I refined a lot of terrain, and slightly adapted some for gameplay's sake. Thanks for the tip!, I've corrected that, and also spelled `Rawlinna` correctly this time ??? No worries 8) , Glad you enjoyed it. There's different ways of playing of course . I tend to buy every industry I supply, then even overserve the industries. This seems to help villages grow to towns a little quicker. I also tend to try to have VERY long straight lines of track; in this way gradients have less effect (trains only really suffer if they have to take turns on gradients). You track layout was very organic, you could tell it literally "grew" a little at the time.As Jeff said, and I agree, it's sort of like a small chess game with track layout. When I lay track, and place a station, I'm looking at where the track will go next, unless that station happens to be a complete terminus,e.g. on the tip of a continent. It's possibly the trickiest part of RRT2. Slight criticisms( well you did ask ;))- I thought that you had possibly taken on too much industry at once, and goods were sitting around and piling up, and also had a lot of `low milage` track that you were paying for. Still, you were very unlucky in getting NO ports anywhere, I think you did a great job :) If you're interested, here's my map from 1900. I started playing it before Christmas, (and decided to relax with a few beers, and then pay my Tycoon all the profits for a good 10 yrs, while enjoying watching the trains go round and round :D )....played for a couple of hours before typing this and I'm as far as Adelaide...with around a $2-3M annual profit....I love my absolutely ridiculous straight line across Australia, plus I've just started exporting Alcohol and refining my own oil......well have a look :) P.S. The only reason I enforced the "no connected track option" was to force the player to actually railroad trans-continentally. In other words, no getting a bit of a bankroll, then buying rights and running a seperate track between say Melbourne and Adelaide (which is far too easy..). If playing `on honor` and just using disconnected track for flattening purposes then I'd say remove it.. WA.zip P.P.S. Forgot to add, you can make a silly amount of money from The Melbourne/Perth or Adelaide/Perth Expresses...I put 2 for each route -one starting from each city, with a dining car- and a dedicated mail train. They're not regular, but they're huge cash cows when they arrive

Glad you had another go :)I'll be pleased to have a look at your game, but maybe tomorrow, as too much Christmas Spirit yesterday (literally) is probably going to confine me to the sofa today ;) Oh, And Merry Christmas to all ~!

Wrong thread me thinks ;) , but nevermind. I had a look at your .ods file, excellent source of information.Unfortunately, I too bought the game online off steam, and have therefore no CD. (I've bought several games off steam e.g. Napoleon TW, Empire TW- many new games even have its as a mandatory requirement e.g. Napoleon TW, Civ V) Your right in that it replaces a CD with a connection requirement (well not exactly, it calls a steam game ID to launch the game you want to play-I'm not exactly sure of the process, never really investigated it ), but anyways, the shortfall of this, is that I haven't figured out a way to use your modded .exe file. It looks for a CD which doesn't exist. I'm not keen on searching the net for crack files, even if I do legitimatly own the game, and not even sure they would work in this case...

Thanks for the feedback :)I was playing the map last night, and by 1875, I'd grown 2 villages to towns (the key- giving you more places to deliver food/goods/pax/mail too) and am steadily progressing Eastwards with a good profit. I'd set up the ports to be especially useful, so the random roll up of the map is quite influencial on how tough the game is; having a port pop up in the first 20 yrs is a godsend. I'd also bankrupted 3 of my 4 ai opponents :D (love doing this). I still fail about 50% of the time on this map though, but i like it to be tough.(On expert settings btw)

I haven't got that far yet, I'll look out for them and let you know.

Yeah, the lumber was fine, except even when I'd delivered an adequate cargo requirement for "the next 3 yrs" the next yr, I'd often be told I hadn't met the quota..hence a penalty again. (surely not intended?) As for Steel, if I can't own the mill, I sulk and it can become stainful and rot ;) Re the Kansas events, it's an old game; I don't think they ever envisioned it being taken to your history lesson...still it's weak original design/code, I agree.

I tend to do that too. On the East USA map, I love to supply the whole map with steel from just Pittsburgh, partly for the routing and track creation challenge, partly because hey, it's Pittsburgh, and partly because it makes me feel like an old time Steel Magnet :DI see why you restricted it for your map, makes sense in what you are trying to accomplish.

Thanks for the info.I mean Mod in the sense of Modify. I have enough patience to tinker with various code bases, but not enough to moderate forum threads (while admiring those that do, especially on busy forums).

OK , I finished the Original Thread map it's in the OP at the bottom. Let me know if you try it please :)

Superb Effort Mr Fisher ! Been playing it right from the earliest possible (1823) - Those Trevithicks are like molasses running through crude oil. Connected up Boston/NY/Philly/Balt/DC at the start (to keep the ai out of those cities), and nearly went broke personally and companywise for a while.Three one track wooden bridges for 17 yrs is quite frustrating to say the least. In the meantime, the Clevland-Columbus line went crazy and expanded all through the midwest...but I was happy eating away at their stock and merged the company with mine in around 1855 (took out 8m in bonds to do so, then of course had to destroy a lot of their useless track- But actually kept most of the Cleveland/Detroit/Chi Line intact). Made silver when the first Boston to San Fran passengers arrived in 1870. Left it there for now. Love the history lessons and events. I'm playing a house rule of no-unconnected track (except for cleaving mountain passes- The Donner pass is now more like the Donner Valley ;)) I wondered why you decided to make Industry non-purchasable, as it's the only real guaranteed way of stopping industries from disappearing. ? (e.g. I was sending Produce from Philly to Syracuse for a long time, and then suddenly it disappeared, of course you're not warned this is happened, so while I was busy with the tricky western route, I probably had a train waiting for something that would never arrive...) I know it's very easy to change myself, I just wondered why you chose that option? Thanks again for all the effort.

Re:The Australia Map, I'm still trying to perfect a few things:- mainly trying to help the ai out a bit, but I think that's beyond the old ai engine. What I mean by this, is that all the ai ever runs successfully, is passengers. Any cargo actually reaching a "proper" destination, and producing an end product (e.g.) Produce becoming Alcohol, is just a happy accident on its part. It needs several towns and cities to run to for any degree of success, Unfortunately the maps I've been tinkering with, I like to start as early as historically sensible, and tweak population Lvls (via the Economy settings) to a "proper" lvl. This makes it really tough for the player initially (the one house "towns" will grow in a decade or two if their industry is supplied), but the ai generally refuses to expand. The ai gets cash for shifting just about anything to anywhere, so they don't go broke, they just slowly stagnate.Ho Hum. I'll upload that map at the weekend. I'm also working on a Texas 1836 Independence map which starts out with tiny villages everywhere, and an 1830 South America Map similarly adjusted, with also a logical pass from Rio to Sao Paulo that doesn't go over 3.5 grade . The base S America map is impossible for the ai, it tries to build a straight line 12% route between the 2 cities, nothing every gets there and it goes bust... I was reading the discussions on the reverse engineering....but believe me, somrthing like that is a mammoth undertaking, without any source code, you're basically re-writing/coding it from scratch. I mod for various games on the net, e.g. The Total War Series, The Civ series, and even doing them for the love of the game, it can sometimes become like a job you don't want to go to ;)....I'll say that I'll help out, if a project gets started, how's that? :)

Hi Folks :) OK I'm New: so about me : I'm A programmer of 30 (sheesh yes 30) yrs experience...I love RRT2, It's mellow and utterly engrossing at the same time... Anyways: I'm making a pretty tough Australia map atm. It starts in 1850, and you only have access to Western Australia. Rights to e.g. Victoria are very expensive. Basically you have to start in Perth, and Supply the city like mad. I've adjusted the economy to a realistic 1850 lvl ...many, many (literally)one horse towns,+ Sydney/Melbourne/Brisbane/Adelaide and Perth. But then all you get is Perth. Played half a dozen trials, gave up in half of them. BUT when you take a one house town, and in 20 yrs, turn it into a town, its magical. So anyways mark II, If anyones interested, I'll upload it...no victory conditions atm, just surviving is quite good. EDIT:- Map enclosed (27th Dec 2011 - 2 minor corrections made) Australia - 1850 WA.zip