Picture editing programs

[X3M]

Ok, perhaps a funny problem to most of you.

 

For my friends and myself, I do a lot of prototype map making.

You might have seen some old maps on this forum.

But I trained and continued making better and especially bigger maps.

 

My maps have 2 layers these days. The basic hexagon field with black lines. But each hexagon is build up out of smaller hexagons with thinner grey lines, a black centre dot and 2 grey eights for numbering. All to be filled in with colour the bucket in paint.

I finished my 1 hexagon blanc and my 121 hexagons blanc yesterday.

 

Today 2 problems occurred to me.

1. Apparently the picture with 121 hexagons, that I am using is to big now for opening. Paint says, it doesn't support this kind of picture. The current picture is only 1.8 Mb while being PNG. I do know that I opened bigger ones in the past regarding bytes, colours and pixels. What might have changed?

2. Opening the same picture with Paint.Net works. But when filling in a colour with the bucket, the entire black hexagon is filled. The grey lines are completely ignored. Only the black dot in the centre remains.

 

Any one knows a picture editing program that doesn't screw things?

[MrFlibble]

I think it might be that Paint.NET ignores your thin grey lines because its senstivity settings to area boundaries is different from that of MSPaint (e.g. maybe it doesn't consider a 45 degree one pixel thin like as a boundary).

That said, I can only suggest you to check Wikipedia for other image editing programmes - that's what I did a while ago, and found some nice stuff (although not all of it turned out to be useful).

Wikipedia has those useful software comparison pages (the one relevant to the current discussion is this). While they are not always exhaustive, they are helpful in getting a general picture of what kind of tools you might find.

[Nyerguds]

Well. I dunno. You could try Gimp I guess? What are the image's dimensions?

[X3M]

About 11k x 8k pixels.

 

Thanks for the help! But I wonder if it was in time.

 

My crew and I are already taking another approach. Actually reducing the pixels if possible.

 

It seems that the designed template (using a smaller part for that test) is ugly as hell any way and does not create a natural feeling. It also took 55 fields/region to fill. Thus we are going with a simpler template. One that only carriers the exact information needed for my game. 6 ridges, 6 terrains, and only 1 height number (=7) = a total of 19 fields/region. Saves 67% of our time, and it saves thinking on design time as well.

 

Further, if the picture is still to big, we are probably going to make A4 segments instead. Just 19 hexagons, not 121. So we design 1 segment. Then another, etc. etc.

So cutting on size/hexagon and the total number of hexagons.

 

(At least I got terrain height introduced correctly now)

[Nyerguds]

I'm not sure what the purpose of this is... but if they're tiles, then surely putting the tiles together and showing it as one big play area should be done by whatever program this is all intended for, rather than pasting it all in one big image?

[X3M]

True,

 

It is always my intention to create maps that offer a lot of strategic situations. Having a big overview helps a lot in this.

 

With the others wanting to use segments that are put together. The strategic overview is a bit lost in the process.

 

However, perhaps you know of a way to do both?

Personally, I am thinking about using a map of the map. A segment of 19 hexes can have an id number. And the overview map can have simple hexagons with the segment number on each.

 

If a certain big map needs a certain segment. I can create a new one befitting that map.

[Nyerguds]

Simply make a list of different tiles, and make a simple map file format to puzzle them together? That's how I would do it.

Still, I'm not entirely clear on the concept here. Is this for a game program? Or is it to print out?

[X3M]

Yes, it is for print outs. And yes, with segments I do mean using a group of 19.

 

Now for making each tile alone, I did think about that. And I did spend a lot of time on that. With the current created options that I use. The list would require over 700 different tiles. So I am sure you understand that I am not gona use that list.

[Nyerguds]

if it's made for printouts, I don't see any point in printing out the whole thing. Just print the tiles and assemble it...

[X3M]

Nope, gona use the 19 tile (1 tile = 1 hexagon) segments instead. It beats both options, "whole map" and "tile by tile".

1 segments perfectly fits one A4, is not to big, nor to small.

 

Or are you referring to a tile as if it is several hexagons together?

In that case, we are yelling the same thing. :)

[Nyerguds]

Overall I'm not clear on how the tiles are made... did you just take a map picture and divide it into hexagons, or are the hexagons supposed to be reusable in different combinations to create different terrain (like the C&C/Dune terrain tiles)?

Because, in that second case, it seems a lot more logical to print out the different tiles and puzzle them together to make a map, in a way that they can be collected after a game and a new map can be made with them later..

[X3M]

 

This is the current basis that I am using right now.

Life got busy, or I could have had some tiles ready by now.

[Nyerguds]

That really didn't answer any of my questions... :P

[X3M]

Overall I'm not clear on how the tiles are made... did you just take a map picture and divide it into hexagons,

For having the "fun" factor, maps need to be tactical. Using a picture and divide it into hexagons will not help with that. Thus for an usable board regarding full use of the rules, this was discarded.

 

or are the hexagons supposed to be reusable in different combinations to create different terrain (like the C&C/Dune terrain tiles)?

Yes, eventually a whole set of terrain is supposed to be created.

Just like 'Advanced Squad Leader'.

 

Because, in that second case, it seems a lot more logical to print out the different tiles and puzzle them together to make a map, in a way that they can be collected after a game and a new map can be made with them later..

General speaking, the original idea, yes.

[X3M]

 

I think, this is the best blank to use for the flat 2D maps.

However, printing out does leave a rather small version. But it is cool to make these kind of segments.

I have given up on getting a way of rotating good looking numbers. Or other ways to implement height indication. So the numbers stay.

The centre will get the colour that is used the most.

 

It surprised me once again how much paint can do for me, while other picture editing programs ultimately fail in a simple tilting task.

Main reason; I need the pixels to work for me.

 

Printers suck, no matter which program you use. The one that I used on this picture managed to make a 0,5 mm difference when tilting 60 degree's.

Lucky me, I am worse in cutting shapes. So it is hardly noticeable. :D

 

[X3M]

I think the next question goes in this thread without making a new thread.

 

Paint and Paint.net are not fulfilling my needs.

Where Paint.net makes beautiful beaches. The beaches are however fixed to 1 line. I want the line to be randomized like in the other thread.

My cousin has suggested me to use GIMP.

Has anyone have experience with GIMP or a related photo shop program?

Any good?

 

PS. Sorry for the Troll in that other thread :).

It was just a try out for my dune maps. And it could be used in the future.

After all, Dune is on my design list as well.