...Everywhere a Nation

[ErasOmnius]

Here is a good op-ed piece from the Financial Times. In it, Christopher Caldwell wonders if NATOs desire to help prevent a humanitarian crisis in Libya, will lead to a long drawn-out affair. Caldwell compares events in Libya to events in Serbia in the 1990s, which resulted in the splitting off of Kosovo. Many countries have considered Kosovo a nation, many have not. Which leads one to ask, 'Is Macedonia a nation'; 'Does it need to be?'. Do the Basques have to have their own nation in Spain? Does Quebec in Canada? Taiwan? North Cyprus? Some of these nations can get pretty small in area. Are they really necessary?

[TheCurtOne]

I think that it would depend on the country named, and in what region of the world the secessionist attempt is being made.

As far as Quebec goes here in N America, in the past Quebec has come close to voting to secession from their mother country, Canada. It seems like, if I remember correctly, the Quebecois voted numerous times in the 20th century to try to secede, or at least talk about it. Thankfully, cooler heads prevailed. This is an example of the mother country waking up to the needs of the region that is trying to get their attention. I understand that Quebec now gets special subsidies from the Canadian government, and everyone seems to be much happier.

The same can be said for Scotland and Wales in Great Britain. These areas are so synonymous with England that with just slight bits of self determining legislative chambers, all are happy.

Can the same be said of areas where secession might be a benefit. Kurds in Turkey and Iraq have long been put down, and have basically no rights whatsoever in Turkey, although they have self-determination in Iraq. Hey, VP Joe Biden thinks they should have almost complete autonomy. The Kurds have a different language than the Turks and a different culture, yet they have almost rights in Turkey. So this would be a good example of allowing nation building.

Nation building today seems to be an attempt to save the nation's culture. This should be allowed and able to be accomplished even if the region is part of another country.

[Dante]

Actually, Scotland is pushing harder and harder for independence. And we don't like it when people treat England and Britain as the same thing. Just FYI. ;)

Also, what is a "necessary" country, exactly?

[TheCurtOne]

Hi, sorry I don't understand the difference between England & Britain. I understand Great Britain to be all of the lands basically that are in the northeast Atlantic Ocean? Is that right? Wow, I didn't know that Scotland wanted to be independent. What's the beef with the people "down below" in London? It would be like it was during the time of Braveheart and the Tudors, before you all became the same country.

Anyway, I think that to have a separate and necessary country there should be a set of rules set up by the United Nations. You have to have a different culture, maybe different religion. So for example, not sure that the break up of Czech Rep and Slovakia would count. Looking on a map here, not sure Slovenia should be separate, either. Here in North America we are used to our countries big, and trying to get along and work things out in the legislature. Everything doesn't have to be genocide like it is in the Balkans.

I do understand that in the Middle East, France and the UK drew the boundaries after World War I, and that some of the lines may need to be moved here and there. The Kurds didn't get their own country, it took Armenia 60 years to get a country. I see Ethiopia split in 2 (Eritrea), and now Sudan is splitting into a northern and southern part. Seems to be a bit much, overall.

[ErasOmnius]

I think South Sudan is a good example of when a new nation is a good thing. How else are the poor people of Darfur going to be protected if we don't separate them from the soldiers of northern Sudan? Once that line goes up, hopefully there will be less refugees in the south. I know it did not help very much in Northern Ireland in the seventies, but something has to be tried. The only problem with nation building is once the new nation is created, the process is pretty much irreversible.

When you say that it seems to be a 'bit much', do you mean that you don't feel like memorizing new capitals, or what? To me, all of the examples that you mentioned seem to be good ones, except for The Czech Republic and Slovakia. They should be

. Not sure about Scotland getting their independence, would the UK Fleet protect the highlands and lowlands?

The island countries: Nauru, Tuvalu, St Kitts, Mauritis, Seychelles, Comoros. They look like giant coral reef atolls, not countries. But then again, one has to consider the minerals, oil, and natural gas that would have to be in the Continental shelves. Vatican City - No. Andorra, San Marino, Liechtenstein, Monaco - No. Got to be Luxembourg and bigger.

The longer that one thinks about this issue, the more complex it can become.