[WIP] Harkonnen Campaign progress thread

[Fey]

18 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

Well, I didn't know exactly what will happen after I destroy a sietch; you warn about " - Expect resistance at each Sietch, even after they're razed." so I just took my time to build the army. Who knows how many tanks you will spawn (I still have nightmares because your smuggler campaign xD).

You can do another way. For example, you have 2 Fremen spawming next from a sietch. You can reconvert that to appear always, not only when no units are present, a very small guardgroupside to avoid grouping all those new Fremen, and firstattack and timebetweenattack set to 1000 or something like that, so he creates 2 Fremen, he send them, he creates another 2, he send them (or 4-6 at most). But anyway, that's was only an idea. If you want to maintain the rule for all the maps/campaigns with the only spawning if no other units are present that's ok for me too.

Not exactly. buildings don't have vision, only the units. Here is the proof.
 <-- the VCM is already building concrete, but I cannot see anything.

Usually you can see the ally base because the units wandering around it. 

 

I can tell you, this will happen in the future more times. The culprit is the Time between attacks.
You have exactly this number = 6250
While I was doing my based on Dune 2 campaign, I was using "7500" as the default time between attacks. Being 2 enemies building at a good pace was good, but when only 1 enemy is present (and low tech), the Ai just waits too much, the player has enough time to build everything and the AI only do the "first attack" wave, so I reduced to a half, this means 3750.

I have 6 levels (2 per faction) with only 1 enemy, so all were using that number. What happens? depending of the map (but happening always), the AI stop attacking. Some maps after the 2º wave, others after the fourth, but sooner or later that will happens.

And then, in my mission 9 with three enemies at once 7500 was too opresive, being constatly attacked the player don't have time to rest, so I just added a extra of 50% of time between attacks, this means 11250. Then I test the map and... again... at least 1 of the Ais suddenly stop the attacks, and never attack again.

So... 3750 and 11250 have in commond... they only have 1 zero. I can't tell you the true reason why this makes the AI go dumb, but I guarantee you: happens.
As a workaround I give of them "3751" and "11251" respectively. 3700/3800 and 11200/11300 should be a better choice, but in my stubbornness desire a perfect -50% and +50% from the default 7500.

The problem never happened again, and for this kind of test I always place 50 devastators and let the game play while I set the timer to -2 so I can check the time that has passed. 30 minutes in, and those single/3 enemies still were attacking (and the mission 9 of that campaig take at least 1 hour, so the attacks were still going with the "11251" number).

If you want to make sure that does not happen again, change it to any number with at least 2 zeroes.
Pd: Another reason why a AI can attack less often has to do with the morale attack building.

Oh yeah, I think I remember you talking about that problem. I'll do some more testing and make sure that's fixed.

Haha, yeah! I like to keep ya on your toes I just thought it'd be cool to have different sorts of endings for my maps, twists and plot changes and stuff. You know! This is a little different, though, you will definitely be warned during the actual briefing that will be released about Fedaykin retaliation following the destruction of Sietches. Gunseng also mentions to "defend [his] base until a Refinery is established" after the first MCV is deployed, so I thought that would help too. In addition, the briefing will also mention that the Fremen will only defend their territory and that you should attack aggressively and without mercy. Think of it like S1V1 - the Imperials don't attack Sumadi, but you must take the fight to them. That's the idea! H1V1 is the duelist map like S1V2, with an opponent that will actually try to attack you without provocation.

So... fix time to win condition on version 1, adjust sight issues on version 2, get the briefings done, and fix AI derp on level 2. Thanks again, Cm!

Hey, you know where Feda went? He tested the smuggler campaign maps very well and I'd love his feedback again during the testing process for this campaign

[Cm_blast]

11 minutes ago, Fey said:

Oh yeah, I think I remember you talking about that problem. I'll do some more testing and make sure that's fixed.

Yeah, that give me a headache. I remember changing plenty of lines and exploring everything, until I notice that "detail".

 

12 minutes ago, Fey said:

Haha, yeah! I like to keep ya on your toes I just thought it'd be cool to have different sorts of endings for my maps, twists and plot changes and stuff. You know! This is a little different, though, you will definitely be warned during the actual briefing that will be released about Fedaykin retaliation following the destruction of Sietches. Gunseng also mentions to "defend [his] base until a Refinery is established" after the first MCV is deployed, so I thought that would help too. In addition, the briefing will also mention that the Fremen will only defend their territory and that you should attack aggressively and without mercy. Think of it like S1V1 - the Imperials don't attack Sumadi, but you must take the fight to them. That's the idea! H1V1 is the duelist map like S1V2, with an opponent that will actually try to attack you without provocation.

Yeah, having the briefing probably help to know a bit better what to expect (more or less). I will wait until more mission are created.
 

14 minutes ago, Fey said:

Hey, you know where Feda went? He tested the smuggler campaign maps very well and I'd love his feedback again during the testing process for this campaign

No idea.

[Cm_blast]

I encountered something that maybe you are interested. I found the exact way to trigger the crash related with the "set cash" event.

The game will crash when this two conditions are met:
1: Spending money building something (a tank, an upgrade or a building)
2: The harverster is dropping the spice on the refinery.

If you let the game play by itself (doing nothing) with a "set cash" to loop every few seconds, after some minutes the game still don't crash. If you remove the ref and let the "set cash" loop in the same way, you can do all the upgrades, place buildings, doing orders on the starport... and the game still don't crash.

Seems that repairing units/buildings or doing/undoing orders on the starport are safe for crash.

Edited May 6, 2017 by Cm_blast

[Fey]

On 5/6/2017 at 9:26 AM, Cm_blast said:

I encountered something that maybe you are interested. I found the exact way to trigger the crash related with the "set cash" event.

The game will crash when this two conditions are met:
1: Spending money building something (a tank, an upgrade or a building)
2: The harverster is dropping the spice on the refinery.

If you let the game play by itself (doing nothing) with a "set cash" to loop every few seconds, after some minutes the game still don't crash. If you remove the ref and let the "set cash" loop in the same way, you can do all the upgrades, place buildings, doing orders on the starport... and the game still don't crash.

Seems that repairing units/buildings or doing/undoing orders on the starport are safe for crash.

That's a huge help! So if the Harvester is returning Spice, AND you're building something, and you add cash, that's RIP for the game?

[Cm_blast]

3 hours ago, Fey said:

That's a huge help! So if the Harvester is returning Spice, AND you're building something, and you add cash, that's RIP for the game?

Yes, this happens also if reducing cash, it's just the "set cash" event that the game can't handle.

[Fey]

5 hours ago, Cm_blast said:

Yes, this happens also if reducing cash, it's just the "set cash" event that the game can't handle.

Interesting. Thanks for finding this, Cm

[Fey]

Oh, how odd. I never added the next map I'd completed to this thread? Well, I'll add it now. This was done a few months ago, not sure why I didn't post it here.

Please note that this level is overtuned at the moment, so you may want to peek under the spoiler to even the odds. If you're brave, good luck trying it blind. I left some tips in the placeholder briefing.

H2V2 Details:

Spoiler

H2V2: Placeholder
Defeat Sumadi and Durant alongside an Imperial field commander.
 - Smuggler and mercenary forces have surrounded and pushed on an Imperial commander's position.
 -- Sumadi's main base is directly northwest of your initial position. Durant possesses two bases, one of which guards Sumadi's Starport.
 -- The Imperial commander has access to basic equipment with the occasional Sardaukar unit. He cannot stand alone against these enemies.
 - The coordinated enemy forces must be defeated to ensure victory. However, they have certain weaknesses.
 -- Sumadi relies on Durant for offensive and defensive power and Durant requires Sumadi's aid to keep his economy going. Harass Durant's harvesters to cripple his economy and overwhelm Sumadi with your military might. They may assist each-other, but their resources are not infinite.
 -- Your targets are well coordinated and will strike in unison and support each-other through economic or military reinforcements. To intercept enemy transmissions and get better intel, build an Outpost. Missile Tank reinforcements will be available to shoot down enemy Carryalls, but you only get three of 'em, so make 'em count.

Strategy during testing:
Like I said earlier, I think this level is a tad overtuned at the moment. I'll be reducing the difficulty later, maybe adding grenadiers or an additional missile tank to the reinforcements you get, changing up enemy build rate, etc. Until I figure out what exactly I want to change, this is my strategy for hard mode.

Since we start from scratch with only 7,000 Solaris, normal may allow you plenty of leeway to get up a barracks, light factory, and some refineries, but on hard mode, your resources will be extremely limited. To make matters worse, Durant attacks fiercely and when he's not throwing bodies at the Imperials' one turret, his raiders and quads are eating your harvesters. Or your ally's. I preferred to go Wind Trap > Refinery > Barracks > Wind Trap > Heavy Factory for initial build order so I could start pumping out harvesters. I got a second Refinery up when I had like three or four Harvesters and when my Light Factory was up, and I refrained from upgrading my Barracks for quite some time.

Infantry are powerful, but fragile. There's a LOT of infantry rock all around the map, and near Spice fields, so I leave masses of light infantry on the rocks. They don't come at you with tanks, but it helps to restrict raider movement. They may mass raiders or grenadiers though and you'll need to keep an eye out in case your infantry are getting overwhelmed. A little light vehicle support will help ensure your infantry will survive to heal up. You could also use infantry rock near enemy-controlled Spice fields to fire on harvesters without fear of being run over. There are plenty of infantry-only passages all over the map, but you may need to scatter your infantry before funneling them up or down cliffs so they don't have screwy pathing.

Alternatively, starting with a light factory and massing vehicles will give you great mobility during the defense of your base. This also worked out for me, but you'll benefit a lot from eventually training troopers for the attack on an enemy base.

While your missile tanks will arrive in due time, only building an outpost will allow you to intercept crucial words between Sumadi and Durant at the time they're transmitted. Unless you already know what's going to happen, I'd suggest building an outpost before attacking so you know what kind of aid they'll send each-other, and when. It'll also help you spot attacks on your harvesters!

Each of the three enemy bases has two turrets. The base to the north is split on two islands, and each one has one turret, so that might be a wise first priority target. Sumadi doesn't pose much of a threat on his own and can be safely ignored, unless you really hate stealth raiders or something. Just note that Durant's going to send support if you don't take him out first. Durant, on the other hand, can be significantly weakened by targeting his harvesters and carryalls, and he's a much greater threat to you with his superior military production and fierce attacks. Quads are strongly recommended for taking out his harvesters. Durant's attacks also consist of powerful unit combinations, such as raiders + troopers, or quads + light infantry + grenadiers. Good luck taking out any of his bases.

Once you take out the base north of your position, crushing Sumadi's base and Durant's other position becomes a lot easier. You'll have rid yourself of half of Durant's attack power and Sumadi's starport. Keep your ally's rocket turret at the front of his base safe, be responsive to attacks on your harvesters, and use grenadiers liberally. Good luck and have fun.

If you REALLY want to know what the various reinforcement events that can occur are, see below this second spoiler:

Spoiler

1. Destroying one of Durant's carryalls will result in Sumadi sending two raiders and another carryall. This only occurs once, although Durant will continuously see his last harvester replaced until he's finished off. The carryall reinforcement can be prevented by destroying Durant's carryalls after Sumadi's high tech factory has been destroyed.

2. Destroying the turrets at the front of Sumadi's base will prompt Durant to send four raiders and two quads for each light factory still active. Destroy both light factories to prevent mercenary interference. These units are aggressive and will immediately hunt down your forces.

3. Sumadi will receive two additional stealth raiders and three grenadiers if you destroy either of the above targets, no matter what.

4. Destroying Sumadi's high tech factory will cause eight stealth raiders to spawn on the map. These units are aggressive and will immediately hunt down your forces.

5. You will receive three missile tanks not long into the level.

Here are map image previews, so you can see it was built off the original H2V2:

Spoiler

Original:


New:

And here's a download link:
H2V2.zip

This map was designed with my mod in mind. Please play it with that mod, or you may find the map is in an unintended state. You can find the mod included in the smuggler campaign download:
https://forum.dune2k.com/topic/27508-release-smugglers-campaign/

Have fun and please do let me know what you think. And remember, I'm looking for suggestions on how to make the map easier! I have some ideas, but I need outside opinions. If you have any, I'm all ears!

Edited June 4, 2019 by Fey
Attachments removed; out of space for new uploads.

[Fey]

A first draft for H3V1 has been drawn up. It's been tested on hard mode, both with and without capturing the bonus objective. More details can be found in the briefing.

Map comparisons:

Spoiler

ORIGINAL:

NEW:

Download link:
H3V1.zip

Please remember to play with the same mod used in my smugglers campaign.

This map pits you against entrenched and fiercely defensive Atreides forces. You have the option of capturing a smuggler base in order to boost your economy and receive reinforcements, but it's unnecessary. If you decide you do want the goodies, remember that Summers is both crafty and vengeful. She won't take kindly to your meddling in her affairs and she'll likely seek revenge at the nearest opportunity.

There is a friendly AI, Gunseng, with a Palace on this map. This seems excessive and I plan to remove it. The smuggler base bonus objective and Atreides forces are enough for H3V1.

As always, I look forward to any feedback y'all might have for me. Thank you.

Edited June 4, 2019 by Fey
Attachments removed; out of space for new uploads.

[Fey]

@Cm_blast - I've been working on the Harkonnen maps a bit and I want to make the Fremen defend the areas around their Sietches on H1V2, and stay very deep inside the Atreides bases on H2V1. How did you set defense areas again? Could you break it down for me?

I did the briefings for H1V1 and H1V2. Here they are:

Spoiler

HARKONNEN 01: First Strike

     Escorted by Harkonnen Royal Guard, you arrive in the command room of the first staging base on Arrakis. The steel hall sings with each step you take, and the rows of Guard, staunch and statue-like, hold their weapons high to let you pass. Their awe-inspiring presence re-affirms your confidence in Harkonnen troops.

     The vertical door slides upwards. The voice of the Baron himself pours out as you step inside, and then the door shuts behind you. There are two men in the room with you. Two more appear as holograms in the center of the room, and one of them is the Baron, Rakhan Harkonnen.

     "Good, Gunseng," he says, finishing a conversation you never heard. "And what of our initial forces? Are they prepared for the first strike?"

     "Yes, father. They're scouting for the Atreides landing right now."

     The gray-haired man beside Gunseng eyes you first. Like all Harkonnen, his gaze is cold. His lips are stained red, and he beckons you with his gloved hand. You approach while the conversation continues.

     "Good," the Baron repeats. "You are to wipe them out. Bury them all in the sand, and leave their corpses strewn about for the rest to find." He looks at you. "The new military commander I summoned will help you raid the Atreides."

     At this, Gunseng looks over at you. "Commander Krillys," he recalls. "You cut your teeth on unruly slaves on Geidi Prime. Hardly an admirable feat..."

     "He doesn't look like much," the man beside the Baron quietly adds.

     "...But looks can be deceiving, Copec," Gunseng replies, looking back at him. Copec, the Baron's eldest son. In the brief moment Copec and Gunseng lock eyes, you witness smugness in Gunseng's smirk, and envy burning behind Copec's hazel eyes. Suddenly, it's less curious a fact that Gunseng, his youngest, is present beside you.

     "Enough chatter," the Baron insists, practically shoving Copec out of the way. His hologram grows in size and he stares you down. "I want to hear of the Atreides' defeat as soon as the last man is executed. And should the new commander perform poorly, I want to hear of that too."

     "Yes, father," Gunseng replies loyally, and the hologram deactivates.

     The Mentat and you exchange glances. "Have you no tongue?" he asks impatiently. You grin and chuckle in response, and the Mentat grins back. You both understand it's unwise to speak over the Baron. "I am the Mentat, Hayt," he introduces himself. "I will be briefing you and Gunseng on favorable strategies."

     "We have already been over the attack on Baklawa Flats," Gunseng informs you. Unlike his brother and the Baron's fiery red hair, Gunseng possessed blond hair and blue eyes. "My father is eager to inherit Arrakis from that foolish old Corrino. Atreides forces have landed on the other side of the planet, and we will to drive them out before they can thieve away with even a handful of our Spice." After handing you several reports on terrain and Atreides troop presence, Gunseng turns away. "Our first troops on Arrakis are the most blood-thirsty, and you will assume command over them, after I take the first shot. Study the reports carefully and make good use of our invasion reserve and subsequent reinforcements. I won't tolerate failure."

     You glance down at the papers as Gunseng leaves. To the Harkonnen, failure is death, and often torture beforehand. The Mentat, before departing as well, speaks up with one useful reminder: "Watch the worms."

     The reports indicate that the Atreides have two bases. The western one on a small rock island is marked for destruction, and arrows pointing east indicate your ideal direction of attack... after you build your own base atop the ruins of their own.

     The only failures in Baklawa Flats will be the Atreides vermin.

PRIMARY OBJECTIVES:
1. Establish a base.
2. Crush the Atreides.

NEW STRUCTURES:
Construction Yard:
     Necessary for base construction. Multiple Construction Yards can be used to increase the efficiency of base construction, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new project.

Concrete Foundation:
     Although structures can be built on bare rock, the elements of Arrakis are so hostile, doing so will cause the structure to degrade quickly. Concrete Foundation protects structures and prevents them from degrading. With an upgraded Construction Yard, you can place even more Concrete Foundation at once.

Wind Trap:
     On the planet Arrakis, the most efficient source of power is the relentless wind. Wind Traps are designed to capture the wind and generate power from it. They generate less power depending on how damaged they are, so always build these on concrete and maintain them well. You will need many Wind Traps to power an entire base.

Refinery:
     A handful of dust on Arrakis is worth your life a hundred times over, for only amidst the Arrakian sand is the Spice Melange found. The Refinery is able to process Spice for profit, and each Refinery can hold up to 2,000 Solaris worth of Spice.

Silo:
     Used to store Spice. Each Silo can hold up to 1,500 Solaris worth of Spice.

Barracks:
     Harkonnen infantry are the strongest and most ruthless on Arrakis. The eager killers can be equipped and briefed within this facility. Multiple Barracks can be used to organize troops faster, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new trainee.

Outpost:
     The Outpost assists in combat operations as a proxy command structure by exposing enemy forces to the overseer and organizing troops in the region more effectively.

Light Factory:
     The Light Factory produces lightly armored vehicles useful as cannon fodder, for quick and hectic attacks, and for harassment of enemy Harvesters. Multiple Light Factories can be used to produce light vehicles faster, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new vehicle. Light Factories are standard equipment for most Harkonnen bases.

Heavy Factory:
     Heavy Factories produce heavy equipment, such as Harkonnen Combat Tanks or Harvesters. Multiple Heavy Factories can be used to produce heavy vehicles faster, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new vehicle. Heavy Factories are standard equipment for most Harkonnen bases.

NEW UPGRADES:
Barracks:
     Upgrading your Barracks will allow you to deploy more useful and powerful infantry, such as Troopers or Grenadiers.

NEW UNITS:
Light Infantry:
     Harkonnen Light Infantry can easily spill the blood of weak Atreides infantry, but will be torn to pieces by enemy Trikes, or crushed by enemy Combat Tanks. Nevertheless, they're cheap, quick, and easy to train, and so can prove useful en masse.

Trooper:
     Troopers carry explosive missile launchers and can raze enemy structures, especially turrets, or destroy enemy vehicles in very short order. They're more useful garrisoned in rock formations or covered by vehicles, for they can be slaughtered quickly if caught in the desert without support.

Trike:
     Trikes are fast light vehicles armed with machine guns perfect for slaughtering infantry. Many Trikes can cut down hundreds of infantry in seconds, but they're not very effective against enemy armor.

Harvester:
     Harvesters mine Spice from the desert and bring it back to a Refinery for processing. They're unarmed and make excellent targets for Atreides Quads, so defend them and replace any you lose using the Heavy Factory. One Harvester is delivered for free for each Refinery you construct.

Spoiler

HARKONNEN 01: The Machine

     Escorted by Harkonnen Royal Guard, you arrive in the command room of the first staging base on Arrakis. The steel hall sings with each step you take, and the rows of Guard, staunch and statue-like, hold their weapons high to let you pass. Their awe-inspiring presence re-affirms your confidence in Harkonnen troops.

     The vertical door slides upwards. The voice of the Baron himself pours out as you step inside, and then the door shuts behind you. There are two men in the room with you. Two more appear as holograms in the center of the room, and one of them is the Baron, Rakhan Harkonnen.

     "Good, Gunseng," he says, finishing a conversation you never heard. "And what of our initial forces? How goes the construction of our first factory complex?"

     "...Badly, father. The native Fremen are scattered throughout Tuono Basin, and-"

     "Is my baby brother making excuses for his failure?" the man beside the Baron teases, causing Gunseng to glare at him in return.

     The gray-haired man beside Gunseng eyes you first. Like all Harkonnen, his gaze is cold. His lips are stained red, and he beckons you with his gloved hand. You approach while the conversation continues.

     "Your excuses don't interest me in the slightest," the Baron adds sternly. "You will obey without question, or be replaced! ...Perhaps you are too young for this position."

     Gunseng stiffens slightly and looks paler in the cheeks. "I am your's to command, as always," he graciously apologizes. "I will make you proud, father."

     The Baron grins at him. "Of course you will." He looks at you next. "The new military commander I called for will help you establish your base. Once the attack begins, the sand fleas will retaliate. Crush them, and defile the bodies of their dead."

     At this, Gunseng glances in your direction. "Commander Krillys," he recalls.

     "This sounds like a fine test for our new commander," the man beside the Baron adds snidely.

     "...I will be leading the operation, Copec," Gunseng replies, smirking back at him, smug. Copec, the Baron's eldest son. Envy burns in his hazel eyes, and suddenly, it's less curious a fact that Gunseng, the Baron's youngest, is present beside you. "Commander Krillys will be assigned to protect my construction crews."

     "Good," the Baron replies, nodding in agreement with that plan. "I want an update when our factories are built, and should the new commander perform poorly, I want to hear of that as well."

     "Yes, father," Gunseng replies loyally, and the hologram deactivates.

     The Mentat and you exchange glances. "Have you no tongue?" he asks impatiently. You grin and chuckle in response, and the Mentat grins back. You both understand it's unwise to speak over the Baron. "I am the Mentat, Hayt," he introduces himself. "I will be briefing you and Gunseng on favorable strategies."

     "You've just heard the situation in Tuono Basin," Gunseng reminds you. Unlike his brother and the Baron's fiery red hair, Gunseng possessed blond hair and blue eyes. "My father is eager to inherit Arrakis from that foolish old Corrino. Every second the native insects delay our production delays our conquest of the planet. I want every last one of them killed. Disappoint me and my father will have the pleasure of torturing you." After handing you several reports on terrain and Fremen presence, Gunseng turns away. "Our troops are displeased to put up with the natives before our very first excursion. You won't see reinforcements, but you'll have enough forces to clear the Fremen out."

     You glance down at the details as Gunseng leaves. The Fremen are highly territorial and probably won't come for you first, so building up your base should be easy. After you strike out against them, they will want vengeance. The Mentat, before departing as well, states one useful reminder: "Watch the worms."

PRIMARY OBJECTIVES:
1. Establish a base.
2. Clear out Fremen settlements.
3. Protect Gunseng's expansions.

NEW STRUCTURES:
Construction Yard:
     Necessary for base construction. Multiple Construction Yards can be used to increase the efficiency of base construction, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new project.

Concrete Foundation:
     Although structures can be built on bare rock, the elements of Arrakis are so hostile, doing so will cause the structure to degrade quickly. Concrete Foundation protects structures and prevents them from degrading. With an upgraded Construction Yard, you can place even more Concrete Foundation at once.

Wind Trap:
     On the planet Arrakis, the most efficient source of power is the relentless wind. Wind Traps are designed to capture the wind and generate power from it. They generate less power depending on how damaged they are, so always build these on concrete and maintain them well. You will need many Wind Traps to power an entire base.

Refinery:
     A handful of dust on Arrakis is worth your life a hundred times over, for only amidst the Arrakian sand is the Spice Melange found. The Refinery is able to process Spice for profit, and each Refinery can hold up to 2,000 Solaris worth of Spice.

Silo:
     Used to store Spice. Each Silo can hold up to 1,500 Solaris worth of Spice.

Barracks:
     Harkonnen infantry are the strongest and most ruthless on Arrakis. The eager killers can be equipped and briefed within this facility. Multiple Barracks can be used to organize troops faster, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new trainee.

Outpost:
     The Outpost assists in combat operations as a proxy command structure by exposing enemy forces to the overseer and organizing troops in the region more effectively.

Light Factory:
     The Light Factory produces lightly armored vehicles useful as cannon fodder, for quick and hectic attacks, and for harassment of enemy Harvesters. Multiple Light Factories can be used to produce light vehicles faster, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new vehicle. Light Factories are standard equipment for most Harkonnen bases.

Heavy Factory:
     Heavy Factories produce heavy equipment, such as Harkonnen Combat Tanks or Harvesters. Multiple Heavy Factories can be used to produce heavy vehicles faster, but beyond three it becomes impossible to manage the logistics for each new vehicle. Heavy Factories are standard equipment for most Harkonnen bases.

NEW UPGRADES:
Barracks:
     Upgrading your Barracks will allow you to deploy more useful and powerful infantry, such as Troopers or Grenadiers.

NEW UNITS:
Light Infantry:
     Harkonnen Light Infantry can easily spill the blood of weak Atreides infantry, but will be torn to pieces by enemy Trikes, or crushed by enemy Combat Tanks. Nevertheless, they're cheap, quick, and easy to train, and so can prove useful en masse.

Trooper:
     Troopers carry explosive missile launchers and can raze enemy structures, especially turrets, or destroy enemy vehicles in very short order. They're more useful garrisoned in rock formations or covered by vehicles, for they can be slaughtered quickly if caught in the desert without support.

Trike:
     Trikes are fast light vehicles armed with machine guns perfect for slaughtering infantry. Many Trikes can cut down hundreds of infantry in seconds, but they're not very effective against enemy armor.

Harvester:
     Harvesters mine Spice from the desert and bring it back to a Refinery for processing. They're unarmed and make excellent targets for Atreides Quads, so defend them and replace any you lose using the Heavy Factory. One Harvester is delivered for free for each Refinery you construct.

I hope to continue with this campaign soon.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Fey

[Cm_blast]

2 hours ago, Fey said:

I've been working on the Harkonnen maps a bit and I want to make the Fremen defend the areas around their Sietches on H1V2, and stay very deep inside the Atreides bases on H2V1. How did you set defense areas again? Could you break it down for me?

Sure.

The main part are the lines near the bottom:
First "defenceAreas" which you need to set to 1 if there is only 1 area you need, 2 for 2... but I am not sure if using more than one works fine.

Then the next lines:
Defencearea 1 MinX - MaxX - MinY- MaxY, which are just the coordinates. Save and reload the map so the editor show the rectangle on screen.

And finally the last lines:
3 unkowns and the StartDelay.
The Startdelay is the time the AI will wait until moving the units to the defence area, so if you use the value from the Original A4v1 map, the units will wait 40 seconds (20 at max speed) to start moving.
And the second of the three unknown works in the same way as GuardGroupSize, but in this case the number need to be much more bigger. 500 of guardgroupsize it's like 15.000 in this unknown (it's just an example, but it's something like that).
I have no idea about the other 2 unkowns, so just copy the values from A4v1 or H4v1 (wich are the same).

Besides that. The original maps changes the Guardgroupsize to 0.

And of course, if you place the units manually the FreePercentage needs to be 100. Spawn units are going to go to the area even if the FreePercentage it's 0 (and the area it's not filled).

And that's it. Just take care the units will move to the defence area, but they won't stand still on the sand. so If you create a defence area with 20x20 tiles, but there is only 4 rock tiles, the units will wander only on those 4 tiles (but if the player goes near the rectangle they'll move to defend).

So a 20x20 with only sand the units will move to the center but won't move. I guess it's to protect them against the sandworm.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Cm_blast

[Fey]

1 hour ago, Cm_blast said:

Sure.

The main part are the lines near the bottom:
First "defenceAreas" which you need to set to 1 if there is only 1 area you need, 2 for 2... but I am not sure if using more than one works fine.

Then the next lines:
Defencearea 1 MinX - MaxX - MinY- MaxY, which are just the coordinates. Save and reload the map so the editor show the rectangle on screen.

And finally the last lines:
3 unkowns and the StartDelay.
The Startdelay is the time the AI will wait until moving the units to the defence area, so if you use the value from the Original A4v1 map, the units will wait 40 seconds (20 at max speed) to start moving.
And the second of the three unknown works in the same way as GuardGroupSize, but in this case the number need to be much more bigger. 500 of guardgroupsize it's like 15.000 in this unknown (it's just an example, but it's something like that).
I have no idea about the other 2 unkowns, so just copy the values from A4v1 or H4v1 (wich are the same).

Besides that. The original maps changes the Guardgroupsize to 0.

And of course, if you place the units manually the FreePercentage needs to be 100. Spawn units are going to go to the area even if the FreePercentage it's 0 (and the area it's not filled).

And that's it. Just take care the units will move to the defence area, but they won't stand still on the sand. so If you create a defence area with 20x20 tiles, but there is only 4 rock tiles, the units will wander only on those 4 tiles (but if the player goes near the rectangle they'll move to defend).

So a 20x20 with only sand the units will move to the center but won't move. I guess it's to protect them against the sandworm.

Great, thanks. I'll try this later, when I get the chance, and update here.

[Cm_blast]

1 hour ago, Fey said:

Great, thanks. I'll try this later, when I get the chance, and update here.

Good. Oh, I forgot. At the very end of the Ai tab there are several unknown byte <number>. In the two maps using defence areas have the byte 29 set to 0, meanwhile any other AI in any other map it's 1.

I don't know what it does, but just for being a copycat probably it's better changing it to 0, just in case.

Now, like any regular base, the Ai sometimes can go "all-in" after recieving one attack. You can go against a group of enemies defending the area, they kill your attack force and return, but sometimes they send all the units on the area to attack the player for no reason. This happen in regular bases too, and I still don't know why happens or how to avoid this.

[Fey]

On 10/3/2017 at 11:35 AM, Cm_blast said:

Good. Oh, I forgot. At the very end of the Ai tab there are several unknown byte <number>. In the two maps using defence areas have the byte 29 set to 0, meanwhile any other AI in any other map it's 1.

I don't know what it does, but just for being a copycat probably it's better changing it to 0, just in case.

Now, like any regular base, the Ai sometimes can go "all-in" after recieving one attack. You can go against a group of enemies defending the area, they kill your attack force and return, but sometimes they send all the units on the area to attack the player for no reason. This happen in regular bases too, and I still don't know why happens or how to avoid this.

I didn't change Byte 29, but check this out:



Works like a charm, from the looks of it. Let me try attacking them...



That works too. They met me near the rocks, and then went right back home.

Edited June 4, 2019 by Fey
Attachments removed; out of space for new uploads.

[Cm_blast]

1 hour ago, Fey said:

I didn't change Byte 29, but check this out:

Works like a charm, from the looks of it. Let me try attacking them...

That works too. They met me near the rocks, and then went right back home.

I can tell definitely works. I am already using a few defence areas for some maps I am doing and works really nice.

They usually defend the area around 4 or 5 tiles away, just as with a regular base. It's like placing a imaginary wall rectangle.

[Fey]

6 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

I can tell definitely works. I am already using a few defence areas for some maps I am doing and works really nice.

They usually defend the area around 4 or 5 tiles away, just as with a regular base. It's like placing a imaginary wall rectangle.

Yeah!

I just finished polishing up H1V2. Would you like to have a look?

Here:
H1V2.zip

There are three Sietches. The last Sietch will respawn Fremen if it's not destroyed and all other Fremen are dead. It'll also spawn one or two Fremen every 2 minutes (3k tics) that will actually hunt for you if you've destroyed either of the other two Sietches. Some of the terrain has been tweaked. The islands will be revealed after you've destroyed the corresponding Sietch so you can see Gunseng's progress. I also made side 0's attack way easier to counter, so they don't just blow up the ConYard.

If you didn't know about cheesing the Harvester replacement events to be less space-consuming, check the Events and Conditions list. I have quite a few replacement triggers. The way it works is: One of the triggers is set properly. Every other trigger requires just one event and one less condition for the flag. In this map, the Harkonnen trigger is set up properly, while all of Gunseng's triggers are cheesed, and the Fremen replacement is also cheesed. You'll notice if you observe the respawn behavior that the Harkonnen and Fremen don't get initial spawns because the Harkonnen trigger is set up completely, and side 0 already begins with Fremen. If you remove the Harvesters in the lower left corner of the map, Gunseng will receive three pointless Harvesters before he has the base to use them. A Harvester must exist already for him not to receive a new one right away.

[Cm_blast]

1 hour ago, Fey said:

There are three Sietches. The last Sietch will respawn Fremen if it's not destroyed and all other Fremen are dead. It'll also spawn one or two Fremen every 2 minutes (3k tics) that will actually hunt for you if you've destroyed either of the other two Sietches. Some of the terrain has been tweaked. The islands will be revealed after you've destroyed the corresponding Sietch so you can see Gunseng's progress. I also made side 0's attack way easier to counter, so they don't just blow up the ConYard.

Just to point, the Fremen units from the Atreides side you spawn just go to the defence area, so they only will hunt at you if the area has been filled already. Spawning guys always act like "free", doesn't matter what you choose on the editor.

To try this I just placed a bunch of devastators in the two sietchs, 2 missile tanks in the entrance of the Atreides Sietch side and a counter of 7500, so I could track the exactly time the 2 spawns are triggered. I clearly saw the first two groups of spawns (so 4 fremen) moving into the defence area.

1 hour ago, Fey said:

If you didn't know about cheesing the Harvester replacement events to be less space-consuming, check the Events and Conditions list. I have quite a few replacement triggers. The way it works is: One of the triggers is set properly. Every other trigger requires just one event and one less condition for the flag. In this map, the Harkonnen trigger is set up properly, while all of Gunseng's triggers are cheesed, and the Fremen replacement is also cheesed. You'll notice if you observe the respawn behavior that the Harkonnen and Fremen don't get initial spawns because the Harkonnen trigger is set up completely, and side 0 already begins with Fremen. If you remove the Harvesters in the lower left corner of the map, Gunseng will receive three pointless Harvesters before he has the base to use them. A Harvester must exist already for him not to receive a new one right away.

Weird, but if works then fine, although you can cheat. Destroying your own harverster they will recieve one even before building the refinery.

This hard drive is doing weird stuff too, so I am worried about this (again), well, Maybe I can't even finish my job before this definitely "crash". 

Edited October 4, 2017 by Cm_blast

[Fey]

8 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

Just to point, the Fremen units from the Atreides side you spawn just go to the defence area, so they only will hunt at you if the area has been filled already. Spawning guys always act like "free", doesn't matter what you choose on the editor.

To try this I just placed a bunch of devastators in the two sietchs, 2 missile tanks in the entrance of the Atreides Sietch side and a counter of 7500, so I could track the exactly time the 2 spawns are triggered. I clearly saw the first two groups of spawns (so 4 fremen) moving into the defence area.

Weird, but if works then fine, although you can cheat. Destroying your own harverster they will recieve one even before building the refinery.

This hard drive is doing weird stuff too, so I am worried about this (again), well, Maybe I can't even finish my job before this definitely "crash". 

Actually, the Harvester destroyed is the only one that receives a replacement. I tested it!

Really? The normal non-stealth Fremen will not hunt...? Damn. Okay, I can make them spawn for the side that has already berserked... that ought to fix it.

[Cm_blast]

8 minutes ago, Fey said:

Actually, the Harvester destroyed is the only one that receives a replacement. I tested it!

Really? The normal non-stealth Fremen will not hunt...? Damn. Okay, I can make them spawn for the side that has already berserked... that ought to fix it.

I started building the refinery, Then I destroyed both sietchs and waited until the two MCVs deployed, then I destroyed my own harverster. Now me and the other two guys recieved one harverster for free. (probably the third one too, but without outpost I didn't bother to look at it.

[Fey]

3 minutes ago, Cm_blast said:

I started building the refinery, Then I destroyed both sietchs and waited until the two MCVs deployed, then I destroyed my own harverster. Now me and the other two guys recieved one harverster for free. (probably the third one too, but without outpost I didn't bother to look at it.

Err, hang on... lemme see...

Nope, that's not how it worked for me. I destroyed my own Harvester while side 4 had one already. He didn't receive another, and sides 5 and 6 didn't receive new Harvesters either.

Due to the setup, sides 4, 5, and 6 now will receive one additional Harvester before the Refinery is built since the Devastators in the bottom left will destroy the Harvester they start with to prevent the trigger from occurring before they have a base. That's intended. Are you sure that's not what you're seeing?

[Cm_blast]

3 minutes ago, Fey said:

Err, hang on... lemme see...

Nope, that's not how it worked for me. I destroyed my own Harvester while side 4 had one already. He didn't receive another, and sides 5 and 6 didn't receive new Harvesters either.

Due to the setup, sides 4, 5, and 6 now will receive one additional Harvester before the Refinery is built since the Devastators in the bottom left will destroy the Harvester they start with to prevent the trigger from occurring before they have a base. That's intended. Are you sure that's not what you're seeing?

I mean doing it before he has one.

[Fey]

Just now, Cm_blast said:

I mean doing it before he has one.

Oh yeah. The Harvesters in the bottom left prevent the AI from receiving a new Harvester before he has a base. He receives a new one after a base has started up, but before a Refinery is built.

[Cm_blast]

3 minutes ago, Fey said:

Oh yeah. The Harvesters in the bottom left prevent the AI from receiving a new Harvester before he has a base. He receives a new one after a base has started up, but before a Refinery is built.

Oh, ok; I'll won't mess up you map more then :P.

Although probably the only reason I keep using the  harverster remplacement it's for the habit, since not even the original maps uses that for the Ais when the tech it's 3 or more.

[Fey]

Just now, Cm_blast said:

Oh, ok; I'll won't mess up you map more then :P.

Although probably the only reason I keep using the  harverster remplacement it's for the habit, since not even the original maps uses that for the Ais when the tech it's 3 or more.

I always found that kind of strange, since the player could cheese the lack of a Harvester replacement to really annoy the AI's economy.

Did you try removing the Harvesters in the bottom left? It SHOULD give the AIs Harvesters 500 tics in if you do that. That's the way it worked on H3V1, which uses similar triggers.

[Fey]

Oh, actually, I just tested it, and since the AI doesn't have a base yet, it doesn't give a Harvester at all until after they lose their Harvester for the first time. I guess I can remove those Harvesters safely.

[Cm_blast]

33 minutes ago, Fey said:

I always found that kind of strange, since the player could cheese the lack of a Harvester replacement to really annoy the AI's economy.

Did you try removing the Harvesters in the bottom left? It SHOULD give the AIs Harvesters 500 tics in if you do that. That's the way it worked on H3V1, which uses similar triggers.

To me the remplacement it's just as a failsafe. A sandworm eating the Ai harverster and it's doom. But in later levels he can just build more as needed.

And the player can harass the AI with or without remplacements anyway.

And no, for today I am not going to look at the editor any more. I'll rest instead.

Edited October 4, 2017 by Cm_blast