Jump to content
MrFlibble

Wyrmsun - an RTS game inspired by Warcraft II

Recommended Posts

To much work perhaps if you keep changing. There are always people who advice otherwise.

How about you first make some drawings in paint? You could edit the picture above by shifting and resizing. A 15 minute job to get several pictures.

And show them as options, here and on other forums.

 

Once you get some feedback, make a final choice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To much work perhaps if you keep changing. There are always people who advice otherwise.

How about you first make some drawings in paint? You could edit the picture above by shifting and resizing. A 15 minute job to get several pictures.

And show them as options, here and on other forums.

 

Once you get some feedback, make a final choice.

 

The artist has already made all the elements for the new UI though, so it's too late now to modify it now.

 

By the way, I implemented stone now - being used mainly for fortifications, and also for researching the Masonry technology.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I took some more time to look at video's etc.

 

Erhm, perhaps you can fill in this request:

There was always one thing annoying me. When tree's are chopped. You see the remains visible. This made warcraft 2 (and warcraft 3 to an extend) looking very ugly after a time. Other games had this annoyance as well.

 

Perhaps now is the time that one game removes this and adds something new.

 

- Perhaps removing the stumps after a time as well?

- Perhaps making part that slowly regrow? Unless build on?

- Perhaps giving the player a choice to completely remove the stumps manually (a bit extra wood, faster and easier, experience and/or technology required), or else they might regrow?

 

What do you think of these suggestions?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think those are interesting ideas. Actually, I had already implemented tree regrowth (it takes a rather long time for trees to regrow though, so it should only happen once or twice per match), which happens only if no building (or unit) is on top of the tree stumps.

 

By the way, I found a way to make buildings have semi-transparent shadows:

screen_new_shadows.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What makes you say that? The game has some very Blizzard-like graphics. Some of the assets were created by this artist, and I should say it's some impressive work.

Sure, but those are unit portraits. I meant the actual game sprites and their animations.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All of those Wargus mods seem like textbook definitions of "bad looking game clone", to be honest...

Sure, but those are unit portraits. I meant the actual game sprites and their animations.

It's hard to make sense of what you are saying, because Wyrmsun isn't a wargus mod and doesn't use wargus mods.  What exactly bothers you about which sprites and animations? Have you played Wyrmsun, or are you speaking of old videos, or some wargus mod? I made almost all of the animation in Wyrmsun and am open to improvement suggestions, but it's not easy to quantify a criticism with no specific information.   We're currently experimenting with converting things to blitted sprites, so if revisions to the sprites are appropriate, now might be a good time to figure that out.   Most people who've commented on the sprites/animations have given positive responses.  Jinn even commented on one of the animated sprites in a positive way.  Someone else told me that what I was making was better than WC2 stuff. They pointed out the flaws in WC2 sprites.   They pointed out the knight and elf as examples, which have many transparent pixels in the middle of objects/bodies, and the bow string traveled through the body while the quiver faced the wrong direction on the elf, the peasants had a black spot instead of a head, etc). Personally, I think some aspects of the WC2 graphics are better(WC2 sprites were rendered from 3d models converted to 2d images, while wyrmsun sprites made no use of 3d models), and other aspects of the wyrmsun graphics seem better to me (There are more animations and animation details in wyrmsun; bow strings rattle, archers have melee animations in addition to their long ranged attack animations, goblin thieves alternate between stabbing/chopping attack animations, workers have heads, etc. There are idle animations. Fauna are fully animated in wyrmsun while critters in WC2 were completely static except for their deaths).  There are of course a few sprites which were included in wyrmsun which could obviously be improved, some of  which I would like to improve when I get around to it, but we don't have enough man power to work on everything at once.  So if you could clarify what you are talking about specifically, that might be helpful.  

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

0-9, welcome to the forums!

We're currently experimenting with converting things to blitted sprites, so if revisions to the sprites are appropriate, now might be a good time to figure that out.

Hmm, I'm not familiar with the concept of blitted sprites, could you please explain that?

Otherwise, personally I think you did a great job with all the graphics in the game. I believe it is a very positive thing that Blizzard style art was created from scratch and with such attention to detail. Actually I think that the reason why Warcraft II has less detail and animations was more of the technical nature (limited memory of PCs from back then etc.), and I think Blizzard would have gone the same way if they had more room in this respect.

BTW, are you guys familiar with Orda, the Russian Warcraft II "clone"?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's hard to make sense of what you are saying, because Wyrmsun isn't a wargus mod and doesn't use wargus mods.  What exactly bothers you about which sprites and animations? Have you played Wyrmsun, or are you speaking of old videos, or some wargus mod? I made almost all of the animation in Wyrmsun and am open to improvement suggestions, but it's not easy to quantify a criticism with no specific information.   We're currently experimenting with converting things to blitted sprites, so if revisions to the sprites are appropriate, now might be a good time to figure that out.   Most people who've commented on the sprites/animations have given positive responses.  Jinn even commented on one of the animated sprites in a positive way.  Someone else told me that what I was making was better than WC2 stuff. They pointed out the flaws in WC2 sprites.   They pointed out the knight and elf as examples, which have many transparent pixels in the middle of objects/bodies, and the bow string traveled through the body while the quiver faced the wrong direction on the elf, the peasants had a black spot instead of a head, etc). Personally, I think some aspects of the WC2 graphics are better(WC2 sprites were rendered from 3d models converted to 2d images, while wyrmsun sprites made no use of 3d models), and other aspects of the wyrmsun graphics seem better to me (There are more animations and animation details in wyrmsun; bow strings rattle, archers have melee animations in addition to their long ranged attack animations, goblin thieves alternate between stabbing/chopping attack animations, workers have heads, etc. There are idle animations. Fauna are fully animated in wyrmsun while critters in WC2 were completely static except for their deaths).  There are of course a few sprites which were included in wyrmsun which could obviously be improved, some of  which I would like to improve when I get around to it, but we don't have enough man power to work on everything at once.  So if you could clarify what you are talking about specifically, that might be helpful.  

 

Yes, I agree, without specific information on what could be improved criticism ends up not being very constructive.

 

 

Hmm, I'm not familiar with the concept of blitted sprites, could you please explain that?

 

It's a really exciting feature that became possible with some technical improvements we did to the engine lately. It means that instead of a unit being drawn from a single spritesheet, it would instead be drawn as a series of layers (one for each arm, another for the body, along with layers for equipment, etc.). In practice this means that it will be possible to mix-and-match different types of equipment for units, making it easier to do things like having the shield in the unit's graphics change when a shield upgrade is researched.

 

BTW, are you guys familiar with Orda, the Russian Warcraft II "clone"?

To be honest, I hadn't really heard of it, but it does seem interesting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's a really exciting feature that became possible with some technical improvements we did to the engine lately. It means that instead of a unit being drawn from a single spritesheet, it would instead be drawn as a series of layers (one for each arm, another for the body, along with layers for equipment, etc.). In practice this means that it will be possible to mix-and-match different types of equipment for units, making it easier to do things like having the shield in the unit's graphics change when a shield upgrade is researched.

That sounds very exciting indeed!

I haven't commented on the new interface and other updates you have posted, they are all very neat! I have to admit I would love to have the option of switching to the oldschool sidebar interface but I understand that it would take up too much effort to implement such a feature.

One thing though, the top bar with the menu button and the resource icons in its present state appears to have a lot of unused space. Perhaps adding an ornamental centrepiece would make it look more organized? I'm thinking of something like Rise of Nations (and/or other Age of Empires inspired titles), except that the central part of the bottom bar is also used to display the current technological tier/age and not just for ornamental purposes.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That sounds very exciting indeed!

I haven't commented on the new interface and other updates you have posted, they are all very neat! I have to admit I would love to have the option of switching to the oldschool sidebar interface but I understand that it would take up too much effort to implement such a feature.

One thing though, the top bar with the menu button and the resource icons in its present state appears to have a lot of unused space. Perhaps adding an ornamental centrepiece would make it look more organized? I'm thinking of something like Rise of Nations (and/or other Age of Empires inspired titles), except that the central part of the bottom bar is also used to display the current technological tier/age and not just for ornamental purposes.

Thanks!

 

About the unused space, the thing is that it is used in different circumstances: there is one scenario which has an extra resource (coal), in network games there is a "diplomacy" button on the right side of the bar, and in Grand Strategy mode it has to display 5 resources (gold, lumber, stone, research and prestige), and the numbers for those take up more space, since they display not only the current amount but also the player's income of that resource. Everything also has to fit the 640 resolution width (the smallest one), so all that space is already used depending on the situation.

 

Implementing an option to have the old school sidebar is not really difficult to do code-wise, the problem would be having to make both types of UI for each new civilization, and allowing the old school sidebar for some civilizations but not others would probably feel a bit too unpolished.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

About the unused space, the thing is that it is used in different circumstances: there is one scenario which has an extra resource (coal), in network games there is a "diplomacy" button on the right side of the bar, and in Grand Strategy mode it has to display 5 resources (gold, lumber, stone, research and prestige), and the numbers for those take up more space, since they display not only the current amount but also the player's income of that resource. Everything also has to fit the 640 resolution width (the smallest one), so all that space is already used depending on the situation.

Wow, I didn't realise that you're coding the game to be this flexible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You could already start selling it on steam.

Just make sure you have an update button in the menu. Which should automatically tell you if an update is ready.

But allowing players to update on their own accord.

Also, with each update, a warning: That saved games might become useless etc. etc.

If a player updates while 2 are available: let them choose, all at once. Or 1 by 1. Some still have low connection ;)

 

Even though you are sharing the game for free through that hub.

Well, I tried it at home and at a friends place. We both had our computers alarming before we even could hit the download button for your game. Seems that the sharing program does something that is not completely correct? In short, we could not try the game. Sorry.

 

Steam on the other hand, I got 1 account there. And if payment is possible with ideal. You got a buyer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You could already start selling it on steam.

Just make sure you have an update button in the menu. Which should automatically tell you if an update is ready.

But allowing players to update on their own accord.

Also, with each update, a warning: That saved games might become useless etc. etc.

If a player updates while 2 are available: let them choose, all at once. Or 1 by 1. Some still have low connection ;)

 

Even though you are sharing the game for free through that hub.

Well, I tried it at home and at a friends place. We both had our computers alarming before we even could hit the download button for your game. Seems that the sharing program does something that is not completely correct? In short, we could not try the game. Sorry.

 

Steam on the other hand, I got 1 account there. And if payment is possible with ideal. You got a buyer.

 

:) About the automatic updates, Steam should already allow you to turn automatic updates for a particular game off and on. Strange that you had that problem with GitHub... but since version 1.0.2 has already been released, you can get it directly from IndieDB instead:

http://www.indiedb.com/games/wyrmsun/downloads/wyrmsun-v102

 

 

 

Does this mean that the game is going to become commercial at some point?

 

I was thinking of pricing it at $5 on Steam  (which could help a lot with commissioning artwork and etc.), while keeping it free for download elsewhere. Basically people would be paying for the convenience of having it on Steam with automatic updates and such, or as a sort of "donation version".

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, the last link that you have given me works without troubles. :)

 

I have played the first quest. And it is impressive work.

You may expect me to give todo lists on a regular basis :)

 

There are 6 things that are rather important in my eye's:

 

1- Quest 1 seems to be bugging. Destroying the town hall it says. But I have cleared out the map completely. Had to turn off the fog to be sure. And there is notching left.

 

2- Health on any thing. Makes it more fun to players. They can relate easier if one would beat another. They can also plan ahead better.

 

3- Tutorials on anything. For example, the XP spending? I don't know if I could do so, and how to do so. I am sure that if this is an option, I would have been able to do so in quest 1?

 

4- Healing. When having a game where units get stronger with XP. Make sure they also heal over time. Notching is more frustrating then having an unit almost dead. While it just gained some XP, enough for an upgrade. 100% over a time of 1000 seconds is regular. Races that specialize in healing, have this 2 to 3 times faster. Of course only the organics. Further, a medic job is to heal units fast during combat. I don't know yet if you have these.

 

5- Music and music lists. Can't press on this matter enough. The same song, over, and over, and over again. Quickly kills a game. Or, make it longer where the melody sure makes changes. Or make several songs. Your list needs to be a total of 30 minutes the least. Also, those who enjoy the music, might want to be able to choose from a list in the options menu. The best way to do this is like in C&CDawn and Red Alert.

 

6- Units should be able to respond with a voice. Reason: you might accidentally click somewhere on the map and they start walking. Without informing you. Suddenly your units are dead. And you don't know why. This happens a lot to players who turn off the sounds.

 

I leave it at this for now. I know the list might seem long. And I know some things might take a lot of work. So I bid you success.

 

There is one thing that I like to say to you and your crew:

 

52991509.jpg

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, the last link that you have given me works without troubles. :)

 

I have played the first quest. And it is impressive work.

You may expect me to give todo lists on a regular basis :)

 

There are 6 things that are rather important in my eye's:

 

1- Quest 1 seems to be bugging. Destroying the town hall it says. But I have cleared out the map completely. Had to turn off the fog to be sure. And there is notching left.

 

2- Health on any thing. Makes it more fun to players. They can relate easier if one would beat another. They can also plan ahead better.

 

3- Tutorials on anything. For example, the XP spending? I don't know if I could do so, and how to do so. I am sure that if this is an option, I would have been able to do so in quest 1?

 

4- Healing. When having a game where units get stronger with XP. Make sure they also heal over time. Notching is more frustrating then having an unit almost dead. While it just gained some XP, enough for an upgrade. 100% over a time of 1000 seconds is regular. Races that specialize in healing, have this 2 to 3 times faster. Of course only the organics. Further, a medic job is to heal units fast during combat. I don't know yet if you have these.

 

5- Music and music lists. Can't press on this matter enough. The same song, over, and over, and over again. Quickly kills a game. Or, make it longer where the melody sure makes changes. Or make several songs. Your list needs to be a total of 30 minutes the least. Also, those who enjoy the music, might want to be able to choose from a list in the options menu. The best way to do this is like in C&CDawn and Red Alert.

 

6- Units should be able to respond with a voice. Reason: you might accidentally click somewhere on the map and they start walking. Without informing you. Suddenly your units are dead. And you don't know why. This happens a lot to players who turn off the sounds.

 

I leave it at this for now. I know the list might seem long. And I know some things might take a lot of work. So I bid you success.

 

There is one thing that I like to say to you and your crew:

 

52991509.jpg

 

Thanks :D

 

Nice that the link worked fine for you.

 

Now, onto your points:

 

1. The quest works fine here, I wonder what could be causing the issue you experienced. Did you only meet enemy warriors, or did you find the town hall (it should be by the river in the extreme south) and destroy it as well? Did you complete the game in one run, or did you save and load it at some point? By the way, you can use the cheat "showpath" to reveal the map, and "fow off" to remove the fog.

 

2. You mean the health of an enemy unit also showing up when it's selected?

 

3. Some tutorials would indeed be nice. If it helps though, you can go to the encyclopedia, and then to the "game concepts" section, and there's an explanation of the different game features. About XP, first a unit's XP bar needs to get filled, and when it does the unit will level up. When that happens, you will be able to select a submenu in the unit's command panel, where new abilities can be learned, or the unit can upgrade to a better unit type.

 

4. Yes, adding more forms of healing is definitely something I want to do. I'm not sure about all units regenerating automatically, though; that might make healing too easy. When a unit levels up its HP is automatically restored. Also, if you destroy an enemy farm, there's a chance that a food item will drop from it, which can be used (when a damaged unit steps on it) to restore a little bit of HP (3) (when cheese, carrots and etc. get icons, I'm planning to make them creatable at your own farms too). Some scenarios have healing potions around, which restore 45 HP. When priests get introduced, they will be able to heal friendly units (gnomish herbalists already do so, but the gnomes are a NPC civilization). Perhaps a building which restored health to nearby units would be good, too.

 

5. I agree, but playlists are already in the game; the Germanic civilization has 11 different pieces in its playlist. If you heard the same repeatedly, then it might have been a bug, or chance. Or maybe that particular piece was long and sounded too repetitive.

 

6. Yes, I agree. Dwarves, gnomes and goblins, already have voices, but the humans don't yet, and it would indeed be nice if they did.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. I only created a save. But never loaded again. Everything got Crushed, Killed and Destroyed.

 

2. Yes please..., the health X out of total health Y. All Blizzard games have this, it is one of the best features from Blizzard. Or else the numbers that appear during battle have no meaning.

 

3. Can I interest you in watching the tutorial given by Age of Empires? You could make the same. But also add the XP spending feature.

 

4. Remove the instant healing from levelling up please. It is a game killer, considered unfair to most.

Option 1: Actually, it would be best if the current health remains the same while total increases. Once levelled up, there is simply some auto healing to do like I suggested before. Or you use the carrot idea as a needed item after levelling up.

Option 2: You could also simply calculate the difference between 2 levels in health. And only add this difference. Example: 10/20 becomes 20/30, that is +10 on health and on total health.

 

5. I feel I need to explore your game more. Perhaps I watched an unfinished corner.

6. Ah, so this is one of those unfinished corners. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. I only created a save. But never loaded again. Everything got Crushed, Killed and Destroyed.

 

2. Yes please..., the health X out of total health Y. All Blizzard games have this, it is one of the best features from Blizzard. Or else the numbers that appear during battle have no meaning.

 

3. Can I interest you in watching the tutorial given by Age of Empires? You could make the same. But also add the XP spending feature.

 

4. Remove the instant healing from levelling up please. It is a game killer, considered unfair to most.

Option 1: Actually, it would be best if the current health remains the same while total increases. Once levelled up, there is simply some auto healing to do like I suggested before. Or you use the carrot idea as a needed item after levelling up.

Option 2: You could also simply calculate the difference between 2 levels in health. And only add this difference. Example: 10/20 becomes 20/30, that is +10 on health and on total health.

 

5. I feel I need to explore your game more. Perhaps I watched an unfinished corner.

6. Ah, so this is one of those unfinished corners. :)

1. I couldn't replicate the issue; I tried the quest here and it worked fine. Could you send me your save? Maybe that will provide me with some insight on what caused it.

 

2. I get what you mean, but I'm not sure if an enemy unit's health is something the player should be able to see directly. I think that it makes sense for an enemy unit's stats to remain hidden, although with visual cues to what it is (like fire on damaged buildings).

 

3. You mean the Ascent of Egypt missions?

 

4. Why do you think healing when leveling up is unfair? If it were removed, I think adding the difference between the new max health and the former max health to the current health would be the way to go about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. Sure, PM me your email.

 

2. True, and vehicles get smoke and soldiers should have blood?

 

3. Ehm, the one that I was talking about are with the scottish. It is in AoE2 I think. And also exactly the same in SWGB (Star Wars Galactic Battlegrounds).

Walk to the flag, walk to the flag through fog, walk to the flag with a group of units, attack the enemy soldier. Etc. etc. Somewhere you insert, spend your XP now (which is needed for defeating the last enemy) Something like that.

In SWBG they added 1 thing. Sending out a medic to that one injured soldier.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can't replicate the bug today. So I decided to continue. (7.) I noticed that some texts are a bit... confusing. I mean, what is a glyph? Maybe flag would be better?

 

Ok, here is some new stuff to put on your todo list:

 

7. After choosing from the tech tree. How about a button that says "Resume Game" ? Because it is a bit confusing what it says now.

 

8. I can't see the amount of resources in the second and third mission. Where is the option to toggle this on/off? I figured out that you can't build stuff in the second. It should be made clear that this is not your mission. With resources on, I would have noticed sooner.

 

9. When building stuff. I can't read the text. It is too small. I have max resolution on. If it is readable on other machines. Perhaps giving the option in increasing the size of this text? x 1,5 and/or x 2 should be sufficient.

 

10. Sorry to say, but. I need to click on the units to see what they are by names. The bura builds stuff. But I really can't recognise them at first glance. Is it my lack in skill in the game? Or can you make some sort of improvement on the pictures?


Until now I think I have only talked about improving the playability of the game. So instead of just having important stuff. How about some positive things to compliment on:

- I love the micro already. Walking around/away while others get into position. And this while I only have the melee units.

- I love the map layout already, in Warcraft 2, these small patches of forest seem very small. But here they are rather big. This due to the unit speed. Good job on that.

- Double click 1 unit selects all of that type. Hell Yeah!! That is some good programming and playability.


Is it ok to remain posting improvement suggestions here? Or would you rather have it somewhere else? Like a central spot where you gather your suggestions?

If my pace is too fast. Please let me know.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. Sure, PM me your email.

 

2. True, and vehicles get smoke and soldiers should have blood?

 

3. Ehm, the one that I was talking about are with the scottish. It is in AoE2 I think. And also exactly the same in SWGB (Star Wars Galactic Battlegrounds).

Walk to the flag, walk to the flag through fog, walk to the flag with a group of units, attack the enemy soldier. Etc. etc. Somewhere you insert, spend your XP now (which is needed for defeating the last enemy) Something like that.

In SWBG they added 1 thing. Sending out a medic to that one injured soldier.

 

1. Done.

 

2. Yes, that sounds good. I'll put that in the list of planned additions.

 

3. Ah yes, I remember that one. I personally didn't like it much, since I found the tasks given too simple. Maybe something like a popup appearing the first time a player has a unit level up, and so forth would be better.

 

Can't replicate the bug today. So I decided to continue. (7.) I noticed that some texts are a bit... confusing. I mean, what is a glyph? Maybe flag would be better?

 

Ok, here is some new stuff to put on your todo list:

 

7. After choosing from the tech tree. How about a button that says "Resume Game" ? Because it is a bit confusing what it says now.

 

8. I can't see the amount of resources in the second and third mission. Where is the option to toggle this on/off? I figured out that you can't build stuff in the second. It should be made clear that this is not your mission. With resources on, I would have noticed sooner.

 

9. When building stuff. I can't read the text. It is too small. I have max resolution on. If it is readable on other machines. Perhaps giving the option in increasing the size of this text? x 1,5 and/or x 2 should be sufficient.

 

10. Sorry to say, but. I need to click on the units to see what they are by names. The bura builds stuff. But I really can't recognise them at first glance. Is it my lack in skill in the game? Or can you make some sort of improvement on the pictures?


Until now I think I have only talked about improving the playability of the game. So instead of just having important stuff. How about some positive things to compliment on:

- I love the micro already. Walking around/away while others get into position. And this while I only have the melee units.

- I love the map layout already, in Warcraft 2, these small patches of forest seem very small. But here they are rather big. This due to the unit speed. Good job on that.

- Double click 1 unit selects all of that type. Hell Yeah!! That is some good programming and playability.


Is it ok to remain posting improvement suggestions here? Or would you rather have it somewhere else? Like a central spot where you gather your suggestions?

If my pace is too fast. Please let me know.

 

7. I had made a change that will probably solve this anyhow: now when completing a quest, instead of going directly to the next one, the player will be taken back to the quest menu for the appropriate world.

 

8. That's strange, they should show up all the time (there's no option to toggle them on and off). Do you have a screenshot? Maybe a bug happened with the UI? I couldn't reproduce the issue here though. About the glyph, I made it so the area around it will be revealed from the start. I agree that a flag would be better though.

 

9. I added an option to have larger text in popups now :)

 

10. You mean that the unit's graphics don't indicate their function very clearly?

 

About your save game, it helped me a lot! I saw what the issue was - accessing the tech tree in-game altered your civilization to "dwarf", which then made your faction be a dwarven one, and since you weren't the "Asa Tribe", the dialogue no longer fired. This was also the reason for the same music playing over and over - when accessing the tech tree / encyclopedia in-game, the playlist would be reset to the main menu one. This is all fixed now. There was also an issue with loading saved games from certain scenarios, which I also fixed.

 

And thanks for the compliments :) And of course thank you for all the feedback!

 

You can post your suggestions and comments here, that's quite alright; I get an email when a post is made here, so I can know when there's something to respond to.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

3. Ah yes, I remember that one. I personally didn't like it much, since I found the tasks given too simple. Maybe something like a popup appearing the first time a player has a unit level up, and so forth would be better.

I also felt that the tutorials in Age of Empires II and some later RTS games go way too much into detail. I would say that an explanation of some game-specific concepts (like the grand strategy mode, unlocking the tech tree, XP etc.) in the readme would be just enough.

May I ask about how flexible the game is going to be in the modding department? First of all, is there going to be some kind of mod format that would make it possible to extensively change the game without substantial programming experience?

 

Will it be possible to create Warcraft II-style campaigns with scrolling mission briefing text? Do you plan to allow for branching campaigns (e.g. to mutually exclusive objectives in a mission that would open up different paths, like in StarCraft)?

 

Will it be possible to alter the tech trees of the factions? Maybe create scenarios that would allow the player to select allies, and then get the respective units as a bonus? For example in Warcraft II the Elves/Trolls as ranged units are part of the standard tech tree, however the alliance with these races is also reflected in the plot of certain early scenarios of each campaign. What if the player was able to actually choose to enter an alliance with a faction and receive that faction's special units as the result/reward for a side quest?

 

Also please forgive my still focussing on the retro style interface, but would it be at least be an option to turn it on for mods? Even if some factions do not get a unique version of the old interface that way.

 

It is my understanding (I'm sorry I didn't have the time to check out the new version yet) that Warcraft-style gold mines were replaced with this type of mines. Again, will it be possible to have the old types of mines back for mods?

 

Generally, I think I would appreciate an optional "classic mode" for skirmish games (and possibly add-on custom campaigns) with rules similar to Warcraft/Warcraft II: old style interface, two resources, no need to unlock the tech tree. Do you think this would be possible?

 

[Edit] Almost forgot, are the older versions of the game (pre-v1.0.1) available somewhere publicly?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I also felt that the tutorials in Age of Empires II and some later RTS games go way too much into detail. I would say that an explanation of some game-specific concepts (like the grand strategy mode, unlocking the tech tree, XP etc.) in the readme would be just enough.

May I ask about how flexible the game is going to be in the modding department? First of all, is there going to be some kind of mod format that would make it possible to extensively change the game without substantial programming experience?

 

Will it be possible to create Warcraft II-style campaigns with scrolling mission briefing text? Do you plan to allow for branching campaigns (e.g. to mutually exclusive objectives in a mission that would open up different paths, like in StarCraft)?

 

Will it be possible to alter the tech trees of the factions? Maybe create scenarios that would allow the player to select allies, and then get the respective units as a bonus? For example in Warcraft II the Elves/Trolls as ranged units are part of the standard tech tree, however the alliance with these races is also reflected in the plot of certain early scenarios of each campaign. What if the player was able to actually choose to enter an alliance with a faction and receive that faction's special units as the result/reward for a side quest?

 

Also please forgive my still focussing on the retro style interface, but would it be at least be an option to turn it on for mods? Even if some factions do not get a unique version of the old interface that way.

 

It is my understanding (I'm sorry I didn't have the time to check out the new version yet) that Warcraft-style gold mines were replaced with this type of mines. Again, will it be possible to have the old types of mines back for mods?

 

Generally, I think I would appreciate an optional "classic mode" for skirmish games (and possibly add-on custom campaigns) with rules similar to Warcraft/Warcraft II: old style interface, two resources, no need to unlock the tech tree. Do you think this would be possible?

 

[Edit] Almost forgot, are the older versions of the game (pre-v1.0.1) available somewhere publicly?

The new concepts are explained in the game concepts section - perhaps a popup when the player first begins to play the game should say to check out the encyclopedia for instructions, so that it is clear that the information is there?

 

The game is very moddable, and it shouldn't be difficult to make a mod that does things like adding units and etc. The game checks for mods in the /mods/ folder; basically, you need a folder there for your mod, and within that folder at least these two files: one called info.lua, and another called main.lua. In info.lua, you need to have the following line:

 

ModName = "MOD_NAME"

 

...replacing MOD_NAME for your mod's name. You can also have a similar ModDescription line in there which will contain you mod's description for the Mods screen (accessible from the main menu).

 

Now, for main.lua. In that file you would actually change the game with your mod. Let's say you want to add a Roman Legionary unit to the game in a mod. Your main.lua should then look something like this:

 

DefineIcon({    Name = "icon-roman-legionary",    Size = {46, 38},    File = "mods/Legionary/graphics/latin/icons/roman_legionary.png"})DefineUnitType("unit-roman-legionary", { Name = _("Legionary"),    Parent = "unit-template-infantry",    Civilization = "latin",    Image = {"file", "mods/Legionary/graphics/latin/units/legionary.png", "size", {72, 72}},    Animations = "animations-dwarven-axefighter", Icon = "icon-roman-legionary",    Corpse = "unit-human-dead-body",    Sounds = {        "selected", "click",        "dead", "basic-human-voices-dead",        "hit", "sword-attack",        "miss", "attack-miss"    }} )table.insert(editor_types, "unit-roman-legionary") -- adds the unit to the map editor

 

Note that you can load other .lua files in your mod's main.lua, so you don't have to keep everything in one file. For instance, you could move the aforementioned code from your mod's main.lua to a /scripts/units.lua file within your mod's subfolder, and load it in your main.lua with the following line:

 

Load("mods/Legionary/scripts/units.lua")

 

...and everything would work just as before.

 

Once you have your mod in place, just go to the "Mods" screen from the main menu, select your mod and enable it (you need to restart the game for the mod to be loaded).

 

It should be relatively simple to add a way for modders to display an introductory briefing with scrolling text before a mission. In fact, I went ahead and added support for that now, and that will be present in version 1.0.3. To add a new quest, you would put code like this in your mod:

 

    Quests.TheMeadOfWisdom = {        Name = "The Mead of Wisdom",        Icon = "dwarf/icons/durin",        Description = "The sage of Modsognir's clan has disappeared, taken by two dwarves called Fjalar and Galar. Modsognir has sent Durin to enter their hall, rescue the sage - or what remains of him - and bring the evil pair to justice.\n\nMap: Fjalar's and Galar's Hall\n\nRewards: 2 Dwarven Technology Points.",        World = "Nidavellir",        Civilization = "dwarf",        TechnologyPoints = 2,        Map = "maps/nidavellir/fjalars-and-galars-hall.smp",        Scenario = "scripts/dwarf/scenarios/the_mead_of_wisdom.lua",        X = 1,        Y = 1,        PlayerColor = "red"    }

 

The scenario file is what is processed after the map is loaded, adding triggers, placing quest-specific units and so forth (this allows different quests to easily use the same map). After v1.0.3 is released, to add a scrollable briefing, you would just need to put in something like this within the quest definition:

 

Briefing = "The sage of Modsognir's clan has disappeared, taken by two dwarves called Fjalar and Galar. Modsognir has sent Durin to enter their hall, rescue the sage - or what remains of him - and bring the evil pair to justice.",

 

Here's how it would look like:

 

screen_scrollable_text_briefing.png

 

Allowing for branched quests would be a bit more complicated, because the game checks within the completed quests to see which quests are unlocked. I already have an idea on how to accomplish that, though. It is definitely something I want to add support for.

 

To alter which building produces what unit and etc. is relatively easy (you only need to define the proper buttons to do that). To make them show up correctly in the tech tree screen is a bit harder, though, if you want to add new unit classes (the tech tree in the tech tree screen is generated based on unit classes like worker, infantry, etc.). It is still possible, but would require a bit of Lua programming. If you want to make those "allied" units be available only in specific scenarios, then the way to go would be to define an upgrade which would allow that unit, and would be given to the player at the beginning of the scenario. You could, for instance, allow that unit only in scenarios of a particular branch in the campaign.

 

Yes, it is possible to define new UIs in mods, and to make them look like the classic one.

 

I have actually been considering whether it would be better to make the tech tree limitations be used only for quests, making skirmish games not have such limitations. Previously quests were accessed from the single player setup menu, but since now they have their own submenu, it might make more sense to do away with tech tree limitations for skirmish games. And yes, it would indeed be possible to bypass those limitations if you want in custom campaigns.

 

To make the game use only two resources, you would only need to redefine the worker units to not be able to harvest stone from rocks, and the change the UI files to make stone not appear.

 

Pre-1.0.1 versions can be found here.

 

If you have more questions, let me know!

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×