Not Site Updates

[athanasios]

OK!

[Dante]

Ugh, argh, blergh.

And other utterances of disgust.

Every so often I think of starting a post "pay attention, because I'm only going to say this once," but I never do. You know why? Because I will inevitably repeat myself, as the point never sinks in. Regardless, pay attention anyway eras, as my whimsically epithet-free mood will shatter the moment you next say something stupid, and General has higher standards of discourse than PRP.

> You do not inspire thoughts, you inspire irritation.

> If you learned anything from any of the arguments, you have yet to show it. If you think you taught us anything... well, "barking up the wrong tree" doesn't even begin to cover it. Perhaps the wrong orchard. In the wrong farm. On another planet.

> What I enjoy about interacting with you can be divided into three distinct categories:

1) I revel in my superiority.

2) Crafting insults is fun.

3) That feeling of satisfaction you get when a distasteful job is completed. Like unblocking the sink or passing a large bowel movement.

But "dialog?" No, that's largely a chore. Reading anything you write is a chore. It's reading bad half-arguments written badly. There's nothing even slightly enjoyable there.

> The sole reason I've never asked for you to be banned is because it would reflect badly on me. It could suggest that I'm incapable of dealing with your... idiosyncrasies and have to run to the rulebook for help. It's not because you don't deserve it, because you certainly do, it's because I'm prideful.

> To touch on an earlier point: you don't promote free thinking and you aren't a sparkling diamond. To borrow your metaphor, you're the flaw; the part of the gem that needs to be cut away so that the rest of it can shine free of obstruction.

Finally, I'd just like to add that I second everything Wolf said. Everything.

[ErasOmnius]

If there is anything in specific, a particular post, that you would like to talk about, I am always open to discussion. But to cut off viewpoints that are valid and defendable, just so they aren't posted or talked about, that would be censorship, and no person wants that.

[Spectral Paladin]

There's truth in what Eras said; the forums reflect the state of the Dune world. It's dead, or hibernating at best,and so is this board. Therefore I 'm not sure whether there's salvation for PRP. Other than that, I stand by Wolf.

A couple of suggestions if the staff cares:

-Delete posts rather than lock/send threads to dungeon. PM the offender with a warning.

-If warnings are not heeded, start with short term bans. ie a week to cool off and reconsider what one posts.

[athanasios]

A week? If mods start issuing weekly bans soon the forums will fall into hibernation.

[ErasOmnius]

Sadly, this Thread has fallen to being a type of referendum on me.

So, this is definitely a Thread that needs to be locked.

Now, back to watching 'Hockey Night'. Hopefully the Detroit Red Wings can climb out of their perpetual 1-0 deficit against Phoenix Coyotes in Game 1 of the playoffs.

[Andrew]

So, this is definitely a Thread that needs to be locked.

Forum Guidelines

Unless you are a moderator do not reply to threads acting as one. If the moderators feel a thread is improper or should be moved they will do it themselves.

A week? If mods start issuing weekly bans soon the forums will fall into hibernation.

I think only "Fed2k staff" can ban. Duration depends on severity.

[Wolf]

Back in the old days, if I recall correctly, inane conversations between two users, or needless posting by one user (especially in the context of agreement within PRP) was frowned upon and actually punished (deletion of posts, etc.) for "post-count jacking". I don't think that's the intent behind the behavior of these particular two users, but the deleterious effect on the forum is the same.

[MrFlibble]

Forum Guidelines

Yay, Forum Rules are back! I wonder why they're now called guidelines though. "Guidelines" sounds like it's up to a particular user to decide whether to follow them or not...

[Dante]

More like how strictly the moderators decide to interpret them. ;)

Fed2k has never been a democracy, and I'm cool with that. Mods rule autocratically and almost always (like 95%) fairly. If they decide to close this thread, there won't be much arguing against it.

That said, I think this is a discussion that needs to be had, and will be had sooner or later. eras is a problem, and problems need solutions. He isn't, as he likes to think, prompting the free exchange of differing viewpoints. His arguments boil down to "eww, buttsex," or "there are holes in this theory that I won't specify and can't offer alternative explanations for." That's not an exchange of viewpoints, it's barely viewpoints at all. Censoring opinions that are "valid and defendable" would be bad, but in this case they have yet to put up a valid defence. Until they do, perhaps it really would be best to silence them.

[athanasios]

... "Guidelines" sounds like it's up to a particular user to decide whether to follow them or not...

I like that. Thanks MrFibble ;-)

[Gruntlord6]

For the most part, athanasios contributes to the d2k section. He is one of the few people to be active there. Losing him would be unacceptable.

[ErasOmnius]

I really feel that everyone has alot of great things to say. Athanasios being one of those people. Being of Italian and Lebanese descent, I feel that he is like a on-site reporter to many of these Eastern Meditteranean Sea events, and has great perspective on many of them.

[Gruntlord6]

I really feel that everyone has alot of great things to say. Athanasios being one of those people. Being of Italian and Lebanese descent, I feel that he is like a on-site reporter to many of these Eastern Meditteranean Sea events, and has great perspective on many of them.

except its very clear others do not care for your opinion unless you offer reasons why you have them.

[athanasios]

Thanks Gruntlord6. The reason I joined d2k forums was dune2k. Yet it is much later that I started posting under PRP.

If some fail to see those reasons or better say fail to see that those events affect them or will affect them in the near future it is not my fault.

Democracy benefits when all opinions count and are heard. Democracy is harmed by those who due to their lack of an opinion accuse others' opinion. Such people should be ostracized.

[Dante]

For the record, while Wolf is correct that ath's frantic link-posting doesn't engender discussion or always adhere to forum rules, I'm not actually that bothered about it. While his manner of posting leaves something to be desired, the intent behind it is, if he is to be believed, largely good natured. In other words, while his posts are spammy, they have a purpose, of sorts. And if anyone actually cared about them I'm sure they would prompt real discussions.

And since it bears repetition, ath, Fed2k is not a democracy. People who spoil the board have been banned before, though they have to put herculean effort into doing so.

except its very clear others do not care for your opinion unless you offer reasons why you have them.

Not strictly accurate, but I'll run with it. Let us assume, for example, that someone offered the opinions "all jews are thieves" or "all woman are whores." Now, are those the kinds of opinions that a civilised society would agree with? Of course not. Are they the kinds of opinions that a civilised society would allow mistaken individuals to air out of consideration for free speech? Possibly. Are they the kinds of opinions that a civilised society would allow to be aired without demanding that they be justified or opposed? No.

Some 'opinions' simply aren't kosher in this modern world of ours. Anyone espousing the opinion that interracial marriage is an unholy deformity is expected to give damned good reasons or be shunned by polite society.

Ergo eras.

[athanasios]

And since it bears repetition, ath, Fed2k is not a democracy. People who spoil the board have been banned before, though they have to put herculean effort into doing so.

That's exactly what should happen in a true democracy, and what I said! ;-)

[Dante]

Indeed, you said democracy. And this is not a democracy. Ergo your argument is inapplicable.

[athanasios]

The main point is not if the forums are a democracy or not. The main point is to ostracize spoilers. In other words we agree. ;-)

Does anyone disagree?

[Tezcatlipoca]

I'm going to be stepping in it by replying here but...

I'll start by saying that I've participated in conversations with just about everyone from both sides to some extent, and have had positive results. I've also stayed clear of conversations with many of them because they *wouldn't*.

This thread is also a primary reason I don't participate in PRP.

In short, while not demanding, suggesting, ordering or even requesting, might I gently advise (yep, a synonym of one of those earlier words) that this thread be moved into PRP because no one(me) in General wants to listen to this? Also... please stay out of Duniverse :)

Thanks

P.S.

I should mention that I think the mods are doing just fine and are certainly not a cause of the increasingly quiet nature of this forum. I should also mention that this thread made me smile to see a sudden gush of interesting activity in general, despite the above request.

[MrFlibble]

In short, while not demanding, suggesting, ordering or even requesting, might I gently advise (yep, a synonym of one of those earlier words) that this thread be moved into PRP because no one(me) in General wants to listen to this? Also... please stay out of Duniverse :)

Heh, you know what, we need a chat/shoutbox here for this sort of conversations

[Gobalopper]

There is one -> http://forum.dune2k.com/index.php?app=ipchat

[athanasios]

.

I should mention that I think the mods are doing just fine... I should also mention that this thread made me smile to see a sudden gush of interesting activity in general,...

You got it dude: Secret plan of Gob to increase activity. LOL!

[MrFlibble]

There is one -> http://forum.dune2k.com/index.php?app=ipchat

No wonder I totally missed that - because of this.

[Dante]

In short, while not demanding, suggesting, ordering or even requesting, might I gently advise (yep, a synonym of one of those earlier words) that this thread be moved into PRP because no one(me) in General wants to listen to this? Also... please stay out of Duniverse :)

Thanks

Patronising attitude aside, PRP may have been created in order to avoid offending the delicate sensibilities of the General board, but this is not a PRP thread. If anything it's a censorship/eras is a dick thread, which doesn't strike me as overtly political or religious, and only philosophical because everything is philosophical if you think about it enough.

And, while Duniverse has its own guardians (I have a rather amusing screenshot to that effect), as an aside I might point out that eras started acting like a fool there before moving to PRP. You're not immune, you know.