The PSP

[Dragoon Knight]

It's mine!  Mine, I tell you!  I come home from work, and the cardboard box sitting by the door as I go in tells me that Gameplay have delivered my PSP on time!

It's charging right now, but as soon as that little orange light blinks off, I'm set for the night. :D

I created this topic mainly for all future PSP discussion, but right now, I just want to know; how many people have one?  Today is the day they were released in the UK (pre-orders FTW) and I got the Value Pack and Lumines for about

[Spectral Paladin]

Nintendo DS > PSP

Less powerful yes, but better games (at least so far) and mouse-like control thanks to its touch screen. As far as I know PSP has no analog input, right? Try playing a FPS with it  :P

[Dragoon Knight]

Oh the PSP has Analog, alright.  It's just underneath the D-Pad.  It just looks like a mini-speaker or something. :P

And no, PSP > DS.  Both of my friends have one, and so far, the games released on the DS are nothing but puzzle / mini-games, with the possible exception of the Mario 64 remake and Mario Kart DS.  The PSP has Lumines (puzzle / mini-game), Medievil (adventure), Ridge Racer / Wipeout Pure / F1 2005 / TOCA (racing), Metal Gear Acid (action), X-Men Legends 2 (RPG)... and that's just SOME of the RELEASE titles.

Needless to say... PSPwns. :P

[Kiyouta]

Can't be arse with this tbh. Maybe I'm just too old now... I dunno. Only games I like to play now are those with friends, that is people sitting next to you, not over the Internet.

All the stupid people who say "Oh It's so cool you can watch movies on the go!" - big f'ing deal. How many times have you ever had the need to watch a film in some random place. Gonna watch it on the bus are you? I don't think so. And because its a different format disc you will not be able to just play any old film, you'll have to buy the film again. You won't be able to play those films on a DVD player.

The games will just be PS2 games. If you have a PS2, you have a PSP, just wait til you get home to play it. Have a conversation, play a multiplayer game, don't just sit on your arse wasting time playing the same old shit you've played months before. Improved light effects eh? Look at the friggin sky for once, pretty cool light effects there too ya know.

Good for music are they? Buy a MP3 player, they are cheaper and you'll get more listening time from it.

If there is one thing I would get PSP for (and actually, this is the only thing) is the Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children film. But I'm not that stupid, if it doesn't come out on DVD soon after I'll just download it. You won't be able to get me to buy a PSP, not in a million years. ;D

[Spectral Paladin]

Oh the PSP has Analog, alright.  It's just underneath the D-Pad.  It just looks like a mini-speaker or something. :P

And no, PSP > DS.  Both of my friends have one, and so far, the games released on the DS are nothing but puzzle / mini-games, with the possible exception of the Mario 64 remake and Mario Kart DS.  The PSP has Lumines (puzzle / mini-game), Medievil (adventure), Ridge Racer / Wipeout Pure / F1 2005 / TOCA (racing), Metal Gear Acid (action), X-Men Legends 2 (RPG)... and that's just SOME of the RELEASE titles.

Needless to say... PSPwns. :P

Aren't you forgetting need for speed? Which may be the best game for DS so far (tough to decide between this and mario 64). And Metroid Hunters is coming.

From what I 've heard so far the PSP doesn't have good games. You 're also forgetting Splinter Cell and Rogue Agent for the DS which are not of course puzzle/mini games but it doesn't matter. Why? Because they 're not really worth it, like most PSP games.

Don't forget that on a DS you can play all game boy advanced games, which include a great variety of genres. But again that doesn't matter. You 're not buying the DS for that.

What the hell is the analog stick doing underneath the D-Pad? How are you supposed to use both to play a FPS?

Until the day a game comes that truly makes use of PSP's  power, I will say DS>PSP :P

[Spectral Paladin]

I agree with Kiyouta's post above, which of course applies to both PSP and DS. But DS may be worth it for the following reasons:

1) It has its own games.

2) It's not a weaker version of an existing console; it's a different console.

3) Most importantly it costs 100$ less. Since a portable console is not something you 'll be frequently using, it's unnecessary to spend much money on it.

[Dragoon Knight]

Only games I like to play now are those with friends, that is people sitting next to you, not over the Internet.

The PSP has WiFi Wireless LAN; wireless multiplayer gaming has never been easier.

How many times have you ever had the need to watch a film in some random place. Gonna watch it on the bus are you? I don't think so. And because its a different format disc you will not be able to just play any old film, you'll have to buy the film again. You won't be able to play those films on a DVD player.

I travel between the North-East of Scotland and Edinburgh a lot, so having a PSP to watch films on is quite handy.  Long car journeys are much easier as well.  As for the whole "buy the movie again" thing... yes, you have to; if you want to watch UMD movies, that is.  You can, alternatively, just rip a DVD you have already onto your computer, convert it to MPEG4, and move it to your PSP.

The games will just be PS2 games. If you have a PS2, you have a PSP, just wait til you get home to play it. Have a conversation, play a multiplayer game, don't just sit on your arse wasting time playing the same old shit you've played months before. Improved light effects eh? Look at the friggin sky for once, pretty cool light effects there too ya know.

I simply disagree with you on this point; the games aren't quite PS2 quality graphic-wise, but the sheer portability is astounding.  I like to game all the time, and this helps.

Good for music are they? Buy a MP3 player, they are cheaper and you'll get more listening time from it.

Turn that argument around; I was going to buy an MP3 Player seperately, but now I don't have to, because I have a PSP.

If there is one thing I would get PSP for (and actually, this is the only thing) is the Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children film. But I'm not that stupid, if it doesn't come out on DVD soon after I'll just download it. You won't be able to get me to buy a PSP, not in a million years.

Now here's where we see eye to eye! :D  I will get FF:AC for both DVD and UMD, probably.  I simply MUST see this film. :P

Aren't you forgetting need for speed?

Ahem... Linky. :P

From what I 've heard so far the PSP doesn't have good games.

Ahem... Linky 2. :P

As for your arguments about them not being worth it, see my response to Kiyouta's comments.  And backwards compatibility only works on the DS for GBA games... so not exactly a tip-top feature, eh?

The analog stick is fine where it is.  If you can't use it properly, it's your problem.

1) It has its own games.

Uhh... so does the PSP.  See Linky 2.

2) It's not a weaker version of an existing console; it's a different console.

I could simply say that the DS is a weaker version of the Gamecube, except it's not.  The DS has touch-screen.  Similarly, the PSP has picture, video and music storage, wireless multiplayer, and WiFi LAN access.

3) Most importantly it costs 100$ less. Since a portable console is not something you 'll be frequently using, it's unnecessary to spend much money on it.

It depends on how you intend to use said console.  The DS is meant for short bursts of amusement; the PSP is a tool unto itself.  A real multimedia portable console.  I repeat... PSPwns. :P

[Spectral Paladin]

The PSP has WiFi Wireless LAN; wireless multiplayer gaming has never been easier.

Btw, so does the DS. (I know this was directed to Kiyouta).

As for your arguments about them not being worth it, see my response to Kiyouta's comments.  And backwards compatibility only works on the DS for GBA games... so not exactly a tip-top feature, eh?

I don't get your point. Why not?

The analog stick is fine where it is.  If you can't use it properly, it's your problem.

Well, the vast majority of FPSs in any console or PC requires you to use both hands to control the movement of your character. I can't see how the psp will achieve it with 1 (I 'm sure a configuration will be found. But certainly control will not be great).

I could simply say that the DS is a weaker version of the Gamecube, except it's not.  The DS has touch-screen.  Similarly, the PSP has picture, video and music storage, wireless multiplayer, and WiFi LAN access.

So does the DS (though it doesn't do everything right out of the factory). And any portable console should.

It depends on how you intend to use said console.  The DS is meant for short bursts of amusement; the PSP is a tool unto itself.  A real multimedia portable console.  I repeat... PSPwns. :P

The DS can do pretty much everything the PSP can; provide short bursts of amusements with the many minigames available for it (and it's features); allow you to play video, music, play homebrew games, watch tv whatever; and it is powerful enough to provide a decent gaming experience. Granted, not as much as the psp, but for me the difference isn't worth it.

[Dragoon Knight]

I don't get your point. Why not?

The big selling point of most consoles is backward compatability.  This is usually considered mandatory in modern consoles, unless the medium which the games are stored on is drastically changed.  The GBA:SP can play GBA, GBC and GB games, while the DS cannot play either of the latter two.  Just because it would stick out a bit, or were the developers simply too eager to leave the old formats behind?

The PSP is somewhat exempt from this argument, as it uses UMDs as the medium for games storage.  The only console I know of that is going to totally pop the ass-cherry of backwards compatability is the Nintendo Revolution; the ability to download games from the NES all the way to the N64 (and I think it plays GC games as well, but I'm not sure).

Well, the vast majority of FPSs in any console or PC requires you to use both hands to control the movement of your character. I can't see how the psp will achieve it with 1 (I 'm sure a configuration will be found. But certainly control will not be great).

Ye gods, can't you remember what an FPS was like before Timesplitters?  Not every FPS needs the weird dual-analog control first coined by that game.

So does the DS (though it doesn't do everything right out of the factory). And any portable console should.

That's just a kind way of saying "you need to buy an add-on to do anything extra".  The PSP pwns the DS as standard. :P

*Recalls the laughter experienced when he found out the GBA:SP needed an adapter for headphones*

The DS can do pretty much everything the PSP can; provide short bursts of amusements with the many minigames available for it (and it's features); allow you to play video, music, play homebrew games, watch tv whatever; and it is powerful enough to provide a decent gaming experience. Granted, not as much as the psp, but for me the difference isn't worth it.

The DS can't play UMD movies, which are fast becoming a popular medium for both classic and new films.  The DS can't match the graphics of the PSP.  The DS can't do a lot of the things the PSP can; at least, not without spending at least half the price of the console again on add-ons.

On the flip side of the coin, I'll never be able to draw a deformed Pac-Man or experience the thrill of blowing virtual bubbles. :'(

[EWS]

Or play Advanced Wars DS, Mario Kart DS, Animal Crossing DS, Nintendogs (wooo), Hunters, Resident Evil DS (**** yeah), and so many amazing games.

Give me innovation over gameplay.

Anyway, long bus journeys are a problem, the battery life on the PSP is awful whilst watching movies.

Saying that, I'll prob get one anyway.

Check this list for the DS.  All the RPGs that are coming out for it.

zure Dreams

Boktai

Dark Reflections

Dragon Quest Monsters

Far East of Eden II

Final Fantasy III

Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles DS

Harvest Moon DS

Korokke! DS: Tenkuu no Yuushatachi

Lunar: Dragon Song

Magical Vacation 2

Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time

Mega Man Battle Network 5: Double Team

Mistwalker DS RPG

Monster Rancher

Naruto RPG 2: Chidori vs Rasengan

Pokemon Diamond

Pokemon Pearl

RPG from Gamearts

Rune Factory

Slime Mori Mori Dragon Quest 2

Spyro Shadow Legacy

Tsubasa Chronicle

World of Mana Project

Animal Crossing DS

Egg Monster Hero

Baten Kaitos DS

Xenosaga DS

RPG from Namco

Pokemon Ranger: The Road to Diamond and Pearl

Pokemon Mysterious Dungeon: Blue Rescue Force

Deep Labyrinth

[Dragoon Knight]

Or play Advanced Wars DS, Mario Kart DS, Animal Crossing DS, Nintendogs (wooo), Hunters, Resident Evil DS (**** yeah), and so many amazing games.

*Goes through list* Don't care; is the same damned thing all over again; can get on PSone or Gamecube; is shite; never heard of; can play on PSone, PS2, Gamebube, etc.  Whereas the PSP has a multitude of... I don't know...

Original games as shown by each of these link words.

Give me innovation over gameplay.

Buy a PSP and you'll get both. ;)

Anyway, long bus journeys are a problem, the battery life on the PSP is awful whilst watching movies.

*Reaches for PSP Manual*

Estimated Battery Duration

Game: Approximately 3 - 6 hours.

Video Playback: Approximately 3 - 5 hours.

Game figures are "based on tests conducted in single player mode, headphones with remote control in use, wireless LAN not in use".

Video playback figures are "based on tests conducted using variables of system speakers versus headphones, volume level and screen brightness level.

I don't know about you, but gaming for about 4.5 hours straight is something I only do on a PC or Home Console... and I don't know of too many movies that last longer than 3 hours. :P

And as for your list... there's too much Pok

[Spectral Paladin]

The big selling point of most consoles is backward compatability.  This is usually considered mandatory in modern consoles, unless the medium which the games are stored on is drastically changed.  The GBA:SP can play GBA, GBC and GB games, while the DS cannot play either of the latter two.  Just because it would stick out a bit, or were the developers simply too eager to leave the old formats behind?

No. In order to play Gameboy Color games, the DS would need another processor, increasing size, production time, and cost.

The PSP is somewhat exempt from this argument, as it uses UMDs as the medium for games storage.  The only console I know of that is going to totally pop the ass-cherry of backwards compatability is the Nintendo Revolution; the ability to download games from the NES all the way to the N64 (and I think it plays GC games as well, but I'm not sure).

Yes the Revolution will play GC games too.

Ye gods, can't you remember what an FPS was like before Timesplitters?  Not every FPS needs the weird dual-analog control first coined by that game.

Why not if it's the best?

That's just a kind way of saying "you need to buy an add-on to do anything extra".  The PSP pwns the DS as standard. :P

*Recalls the laughter experienced when he found out the GBA:SP needed an adapter for headphones*

The DS can't play UMD movies, which are fast becoming a popular medium for both classic and new films.  The DS can't match the graphics of the PSP.  The DS can't do a lot of the things the PSP can; at least, not without spending at least half the price of the console again on add-ons.

Indeed, but that's still cheapear than getting a PSP. There is a third-party movie-player for the gameboy advance and nintendo ds that costs 25$. Of course you need a compact flash card and something with which to write on it but you should have these if you have a digital camera or anything similar. You play movies, music, images, text and programs. Sure the quality would probably be better on a PSP. But is the difference really worth it? Not IMO.

[ExSPlug]

Current;y it's still NDS > PSP IMO.

PSP just have too less games that are worth it, either it's good, but lack replaying value, or it just didn't come to par with it's home console parent (Dynasty Warrior is one good typical example...)

The most fatal point though is that PSP games lose out in the multiplayer issue, NDS can deal with up to 4 players, while for PSP it's only 2 (or more players can be supported? Didn't see any PSP games currently that does so though)

MP3/Movie player function? Ahh forget it, converting the format to allow movies to be played on PSP is a painful process, and UMD/Memory stick hurts a hell lot more to the walle then other storage devices, might as well get a PPC which have longer battery life and in addition, internet ascess.

Keeping my hands off from buying the PSP before the white ver 2.0 comes out, and before more games like Winning Eleven which is good and have high replay value comes out ;D

[Spectral Paladin]

I don't know about you, but gaming for about 4.5 hours straight is something I only do on a PC or Home Console... and I don't know of too many movies that last longer than 3 hours. :P

Battery life is too small. It ruins the concept of "portable" if it needs recharging after each gaming session.

And as for your list... there's too much Pok

[Spectral Paladin]

The most fatal point though is that PSP games lose out in the multiplayer issue, NDS can deal with up to 4 players, while for PSP it's only 2 (or more players can be supported? Didn't see any PSP games currently that does so though)

The NDS can deal with up to 8 players actually. I believe the PSP should too but I don't know.

[Danuary]

The DS can actually support up to 16 players in wireless multiplayer, anymore after that and the game would be unplayable, 8 players is just the optimal number suggested by nintendo. In theory the DS could support hundreds of people playing in same game at the same time over internet multiplayer. But this is a thread about the psp so I suggest we return to the original subject and stop trying to start a console war.

[Dragoon Knight]

I'm telling you, it's hard work to keep refuting each and every point thrown at me.  Not that the reasons are difficult to think of; it's just a lot of quoting and typing. :P

No. In order to play Gameboy Color games, the DS would need another processor, increasing size, production time, and cost.

Considering they managed to fit the PSone onto a single chip to stick into the PS2, I fail to see how making the DS compatible with GBC games would be too much to ask; the size difference would be miniscule, the production time increased by about 10 seconds at most, and my point was it should come as standard, at no extra cost.

Why not if it's the best?

Because FPS' are one genre; one that isn't usually represented on handheld consoles.  The implementation of another Analog stick would be cumbersome and simply isn't required.  How does the DS intend to get round the same "problem"?  By using a stylus to control movement? ::)

Indeed, but that's still cheapear than getting a PSP. There is a third-party movie-player for the gameboy advance and nintendo ds that costs 25$. Of course you need a compact flash card and something with which to write on it but you should have these if you have a digital camera or anything similar. You play movies, music, images, text and programs. Sure the quality would probably be better on a PSP. But is the difference really worth it? Not IMO.

You can keep making excuses all you want, but you're just using euphemisms.  You have to buy seperate addo-ons for the DS.  Having a digital camera as a prequisite for having a DS is laughable.  The difference between the two is immense; the DS is made for interactivity between user and system (hence the touch-screen and microphone).  The PSP is made to be a portable multimedia solution for gamers; games, movies, music, photos, WiFi LAN and more... all as standard.  The DS can't come close to boasting that.

PSP just have too less games that are worth it, either it's good, but lack replaying value, or it just didn't come to par with it's home console parent (Dynasty Warrior is one good typical example...)

See Linky 2 in one of my previous posts for a list of some of the PSP's release titles.  Expect lots more to follow very soon, but even the ones listed there are equal to or greater than most of what the DS has to offer.

The most fatal point though is that PSP games lose out in the multiplayer issue, NDS can deal with up to 4 players, while for PSP it's only 2 (or more players can be supported? Didn't see any PSP games currently that does so though)

The PSP can deal with at least 8 players using its Wireless Multiplayer functionality.  Fired Up is but one of the games that accomodates this.

MP3/Movie player function? Ahh forget it, converting the format to allow movies to be played on PSP is a painful process, and UMD/Memory stick hurts a hell lot more to the walle then other storage devices, might as well get a PPC which have longer battery life and in addition, internet ascess.

The process is simple and takes less time than it would to burn another DVD after you've ripped it.  UMD movies are cheaper than most DVDs, as far as I can see, and Memory Sticks are versatile; they can be used for pictures, video, music and saved games.  They can all be stored on the card at once, and accessed from the PSP's main menu.

And as for your other suggestion... can a PPC play PSP games?  No.  But can the PSP access the internet?  Why, yes, it can.  It comes with its own, built in browser.

Battery life is too small. It ruins the concept of "portable" if it needs recharging after each gaming session.

If you class 3 - 6 hours as a portable gaming "session", then you need to put down your DS and step away from the touch-screen.  PSP and DS sessions usually last no more than an hour at most, and with the graphical capabilities of the PSP, a smaller battery life is to be expected.  It's still large enough for any normal user to have about 10 - 15 sessions before needing recharging, and an above average user can have at least 5 - 6.

That doesn't really matter. DS is completely region free and you can order games from anywhere if you wish.

Fair enough, but I prefer my games in English, and quite a hefty amount of cartridge games never make it out of Japan.  The U.S. would still be an option, but having to resort to importing seems a tad drastic just to get a decent game. ???

But this is a thread about the psp so I suggest we return to the original subject and stop trying to start a console war.

Oh there's a war, alright.  We didn't start it; it was there already.  I've picked my side (and so have most stores it would seem; the PSP section totally eclipses the meagre DS section :D).  I simply believe the PSP to be a better console; it's why I bought it and not the DS.

[Spectral Paladin]

Considering they managed to fit the PSone onto a single chip to stick into the PS2, I fail to see how making the DS compatible with GBC games would be too much to ask; the size difference would be miniscule, the production time increased by about 10 seconds at most, and my point was it should come as standard, at no extra cost.

If it was that easy, you can bet they would do it.

Because FPS' are one genre; one that isn't usually represented on handheld consoles.  The implementation of another Analog stick would be cumbersome and simply isn't required.  How does the DS intend to get round the same "problem"?  By using a stylus to control movement? ::)

Using your left hand on the D-pad and your right one with the thumb-wrist on the touch screen, control is identical to using arrow keys and mouse.

You can keep making excuses all you want, but you're just using euphemisms.  You have to buy seperate addo-ons for the DS.  Having a digital camera as a prequisite for having a DS is laughable.  The difference between the two is immense; the DS is made for interactivity between user and system (hence the touch-screen and microphone).  The PSP is made to be a portable multimedia solution for gamers; games, movies, music, photos, WiFi LAN and more... all as standard.  The DS can't come close to boasting that.

Um, digital camera was just an example. There are many uses for a compact flash card. It's like a memory stick (but cheaper). DS+movie player=175$, still a lot cheaper than a PSP, and with all its abilities (at a lower quality I say again).

See Linky 2 in one of my previous posts for a list of some of the PSP's release titles.  Expect lots more to follow very soon, but even the ones listed there are equal to or greater than most of what the DS has to offer.

You can never be certain till the games are out.

If you class 3 - 6 hours as a portable gaming "session", then you need to put down your DS and step away from the touch-screen.  PSP and DS sessions usually last no more than an hour at most, and with the graphical capabilities of the PSP, a smaller battery life is to be expected.  It's still large enough for any normal user to have about 10 - 15 sessions before needing recharging, and an above average user can have at least 5 - 6.

Hm, wait till you 're on a long trip. Then you 'll wish the PSP was really portable.

Fair enough, but I prefer my games in English, and quite a hefty amount of cartridge games never make it out of Japan.  The U.S. would still be an option, but having to resort to importing seems a tad drastic just to get a decent game.

I often import games, most times games that will be released in my area, just to get them earlier. Considering the DS doesn't even require anything to play import games, "drastic" is the last thing that would come to my mind. (games can be imported from Japan too, I don't get that point).

Oh there's a war, alright.  We didn't start it; it was there already.  I've picked my side (and so have most stores it would seem; the PSP section totally eclipses the meagre DS section :D).  I simply believe the PSP to be a better console; it's why I bought it and not the DS.

Hm, people bought playstation 2 when gamecube was more powerful. You 'd think they wouldn't prefer the PSP when it was indeed the superior one? I don't mind if stores care mostly for the PSP and sales for it are higher. Victims of advertisements :P. Leave the DS to those who really know what they seek.

By the way, DS sales in Japan are almost double of PSP ones.

[Dragoon Knight]

OK, I'm going to abandon the whole "quote the quotes" system that seems to have cropped up, and just reply to posts in the classic fashion now.  Making the DS play GBC games would have been easy as hell; Nintendo just chose not to.  -1 for the DS.

That method of playing FPS' sounds retarded; all the balance will be on the left-hand side, and it limits the use of the other buttons (R button, A button, B button).  DS + Movie Player = Gimped PSP with nowhere near its abilities or it's variety of functions.  You get what you pay for.  -2 for the DS.

The games I listed are - with a few exceptions - all already out, and they are all already equal to or greater than most of the DS' games.  And I don't think I'll ever be on a trip that takes longer than 6 hours without having access to a power outlet.  Even trains have plugs underneath seats and tables now.  -1 for the DS.

The point I was trying to make about the games being imported from Japan is that they will be in Japanese. :P I like my games to be understandable.  And where do you get the idea that the Gamecube is more powerful than the PS2?  Can it play DVDs?  Is it backward compatible with the N64?  How many network games does it have?

People who buy a PSP are getting a much better deal, no question about it.  It's still all a matter of opinion, though.  If you prefer interactivity, get a DS.  If you want a powerful gaming system that comes with multimedia features as standard, get a PSP.  And are those the release figures in Japan you're comparing, or the current figures?

[Spectral Paladin]

Quotes just make reading the reply easier.

Making the DS play GBC games would have been easy as hell; Nintendo just chose not to.  -1 for the DS.

Heh, and why did it choose so? You can't just say they chose not to, for no reason at all. I gave you the reason.

That method of playing FPS' sounds retarded; all the balance will be on the left-hand side, and it limits the use of the other buttons (R button, A button, B button).

The use of A, B, X, Y is indeed severely limited. L & R are very accesible on the other hand and are very much like the left and right button of a mouse. Did you play a FPS on a PC lately? I don't think you found the control retarded.

DS + Movie Player = Gimped PSP with nowhere near its abilities or it's variety of functions.  You get what you pay for.  -2 for the DS.

Fine, if you go as far as to actually list the abilites and functions it lacks.

And where do you get the idea that the Gamecube is more powerful than the PS2?

DVDs, backwards compatibility and network have nothing to do with the power of a machine. GC, was quite simply more powerful. Of most games released for both consoles, the GC version was better.

People who buy a PSP are getting a much better deal, no question about it.  It's still all a matter of opinion, though.  If you prefer interactivity, get a DS.  If you want a powerful gaming system that comes with multimedia features as standard, get a PSP.  And are those the release figures in Japan you're comparing, or the current figures?

People who buy a PSP are ripped off, imho :P The figures I 'm comparing are quite recent ones.

[Dragoon Knight]

You gave an excuse, one I frankly don't believe.  As proved by the PS2 having the PS1, the DS could have had the GBC as well.  I played UT2004 on the PC just yesterday, and using a keyboard and mouse is definitely not retarded; using a D-Pad, a Touch-Screen and 2 shoulder buttons is retarded.  To compare the two is absurd; they're nothing alike.

I have listed what the DS lacks many times; I've also listed what the PSP has.  Check previous posts for full details of the PSP's superiority.

As for the GC being better than the PS2... if we're going solely on specs, then it's a close call.  The PS2 beats the GC in some areas but loses out in others.  Check here for a detailed comparison.  The reason I consider the PS2 superior is because of the features it has surplus to the standard specs.  The games released on both consoles were good; I own them both, and prefer the PS2 simply because Sony seemed to get the better licenses for excellent games, while Nintendo seemed to get little apart from its own brands, and the multi-platform games.  Either way, your argument doesn't hold much merit.

People who buy a PSP are making an investment; they're buying more than a portable games console straight off.  They don't have to go through the rigmarole of ordering tons of add-ons to get a decent multimedia experience; they don't have to fart about with losing styluses; they don't have to get frustrated about having to keep another Nintendo handheld with them if they want to play a GBC game... and if the figures you're comparing are quite recent, consider that the DS was released before the PSP before you make any judgements.  Also, where are you getting these figures from?  I'd like to keep an eye on them in the coming weeks. :)

[Spectral Paladin]

You gave an excuse, one I frankly don't believe.  As proved by the PS2 having the PS1, the DS could have had the GBC as well.

I can't see why the Nintendo would like to give Nintendo DS a -1, if it was that easy. Apparently they did the comparison and deemed it more profitable to release it without the ability to play GBC and original GB games.

You gave an excuse, one I frankly don't believe.  As proved by the PS2 having the PS1, the DS could have had the GBC as well.  I played UT2004 on the PC just yesterday, and using a keyboard and mouse is definitely not retarded; using a D-Pad, a Touch-Screen and 2 shoulder buttons is retarded.  To compare the two is absurd; they're nothing alike.

Have you actually played a FPS on a DS? I have, and I can tell you the feel is very much the same as using a keyboard & mouse. I don't see what is absurd in the comparison.

I have listed what the DS lacks many times; I've also listed what the PSP has.  Check previous posts for full details of the PSP's superiority.

Ah, and I 've listed how the DS gets those as answer to your previous posts. If you still insist using those previous posts to say what the DS lacks, I guess it's nothing at all.

As I said, the only difference is in quality.

The games released on both consoles were good; I own them both, and prefer the PS2 simply because Sony seemed to get the better licenses for excellent games, while Nintendo seemed to get little apart from its own brands, and the multi-platform games.  Either way, your argument doesn't hold much merit.

My argument is that multiplatform games were better on the gamecube.

People who buy a PSP are making an investment; they're buying more than a portable games console straight off.  They don't have to go through the rigmarole of ordering tons of add-ons to get a decent multimedia experience; they don't have to fart about with losing styluses; they don't have to get frustrated about having to keep another Nintendo handheld with them if they want to play a GBC game...

From what I gather, the one who gets a PSP is the one that spends 100$ more just so that he doesn't have to bother about his console. You don't need anything more than 1-2 add-ons to get the multimedia experience the PSP offers. Furthermore, do you think that before the DS, people without gameboy advanced carried GBC around? I don't think so. So if anyone buys the DS he probably won't care.

It's like when getting a new comp or new car or whatever; if you build it yourself it will be cheaper and better than a premade solution.

[Dragoon Knight]

Profitable?  Whoop-de-shite; I'm talking about playability here.  DS users are being denied the backwards compatibility that they could have easily got.

The absurdity in comparison is because the controls are like a PS2 controller, not like a keyboard and mouse... except the touch screen isn't going to be spring-loaded like the PS2's Analog-Sticks, so playing will be more difficult.  They're trying to hard to make the touch-screen do everything.  And what happens if you lose the thumb-attachment?  Now you can't play the game without risking damage to your screen. ::)

You've listed how the DS gets them, but you're avoiding the point again.  The PSP is better than the DS from the outset; all the DS can do is aspire to be almost as good as the PSP is.  Even at its most "kitted-out", the DS still can't do everything the PSP can.  There's no denying this; it's why I consider the PSP to be the superior console.

Er... multiplatform games were almost identical from console to console, bar a couple of interface changes, and a few games that decided to have different levels / challenges.  These differences were designed with no "superior" console in mind, and so decisions about which games were "better" is purely opinion, and not basis to claim that one console is better than another.

Not having to order extras for your console to get a full experience is a bad thing?  I'm sorry, I don't see the logic there; you're running out of excuses for the DS' lack of, well... quite a lot. :P  And no, before the DS, people with GBA's did not run about with another GBC... because (and here's the punchline) the GBA could play all previous GameBoy games! :)

Build your own console?  Cheaper, yes... better?  Not a chance.  More time consuming?  Definitely.  More chance of losing fiddly little attachments?  Yup.  Once more, loud as you can, how does it go?

PSPwns. :P

[Spectral Paladin]

Profitable?  Whoop-de-shite; I'm talking about playability here.  DS users are being denied the backwards compatibility that they could have easily got.

Surely you don't think that a company like Nintendo would make such a silly move - deny DS users backwards compatibility even though it could easily give it to them at almost no cost... ::)

The absurdity in comparison is because the controls are like a PS2 controller, not like a keyboard and mouse... except the touch screen isn't going to be spring-loaded like the PS2's Analog-Sticks, so playing will be more difficult.  They're trying to hard to make the touch-screen do everything.  And what happens if you lose the thumb-attachment?  Now you can't play the game without risking damage to your screen. ::)

Well I 've played the Metroid Hunters demo (which will probably turn out into a great game) and Rogue Agent on the DS and I can tell you the feel is very much like playing FPS on PC. It's not difficult at all; find someone with a DS and see for yourself. Losing the thumb-attachment is really not an argument; for one that would be your fault. First of all, you should know that the thumb-attachement can stay strapped on the DS, and there is storage space for 1 stylus too. Secondly, you can get a case where to store your DS along with other stuff. And thirdly, even you lose the thumb-attachment you can very easily get a replacement one. They 're really cheap, duh.

You've listed how the DS gets them, but you're avoiding the point again.  The PSP is better than the DS from the outset; all the DS can do is aspire to be almost as good as the PSP is.  Even at its most "kitted-out", the DS still can't do everything the PSP can.  There's no denying this; it's why I consider the PSP to be the superior console.

I 'm trying - in vain - to tell you, that at its most "kitted-out", the DS can do everything the PSP can.

Er... multiplatform games were almost identical from console to console, bar a couple of interface changes, and a few games that decided to have different levels / challenges.  These differences were designed with no "superior" console in mind, and so decisions about which games were "better" is purely opinion, and not basis to claim that one console is better than another.

Will you be buying Killer 7 (if you do) for ps2 or gc?

Not having to order extras for your console to get a full experience is a bad thing?

Of course it's not, as long as you don't pay more than you should. And in the psp's case, you do.

And no, before the DS, people with GBA's did not run about with another GBC... because (and here's the punchline) the GBA could play all previous GameBoy games! :)

Um, read my post again. I said people without GBAs. Do you think that after so many years they still run around their GBCs?

Build your own console?  Cheaper, yes... better?  Not a chance.  More time consuming?  Definitely.  More chance of losing fiddly little attachments?  Yup.  Once more, loud as you can, how does it go?

Yes, it isn't better (better is in the example I used, when building your own comp).  But it is cheaper. And losing the add-ons isnt really an argument - there are plenty of solutions to store them properly. I could ask you the same - what if you lose your PSP? You lose everything then. But that again isn't really an argument.

Oh and DS>PSP :P

[ExSPlug]

Who needs the thumb attachment? Get yourself those protective anti-scratch flims and use your nails ;D

(BTW, did you get one for your PSP? Really not worth the risk to scratch the screen in order to save ~$5US...)

Emm...most of the games in Linky 2 only have their release date out, even I count those that their JP version are out still doesn't fill up half of the list. Personally only Coded Arms, PSE 5, Lumies and Ape Acadmey sounds promising. Maybe RR too, but I don't really like racing games unless in arcade.

Talking about FPS games, NDS have better potentials for better controls, as the touch screen can be converted into more buttons or other better ways of control...