Alpha 2 - Bene Gesserit version out

[stefanhendriks]

rofl.

I do understand that in abstract distances the units are vertically moving shorter then diagonally, but since we use a squared based game this is not a big drawback. Its just that visually it does not look 100% right.

if you want an engine doing no squares, i'd say, its 'almost not possible'. It IS possible ofcourse, though its not handy and hard to code. (especially a path finder). I can imagine an engine where you can freely put tiles on , does not matter size and such. I can imagine how to code such a thing, but it aint easy. Not my intention either ;) Anyway....

In D2 afaik, the units move to all directions as fast. So does D2TM.

I agree that D2TM should have more ingredients so bad planned attacks have consequences, instead of the RA style: The more units the more chance you win... I hate such tactics. It should be different. Like, take position A out with launchers, attack B with trikes, for distractions of turrets, rush in some tanks then etc.

I was taking chess as a figure of speach, as mr Fliblle explained.

I think good PLAYING gameplay is more important then good LOOKING gameplay. Or did you mean that ant? :)

Good thinking here btw. I thought you mentioned (ant) you where working on a document how to get a 'good/nice' physics combat system? If it is simple enough to implement (ie, not having dozens of variables, etc, etc). I am pretty interested ofcourse.

[ant222]

ROFL too. It's not a visual drawback. What is a square-based game? That is a game where the surface is divided into squares. It is done for the simplicity of pathfinding, working with graphics, e. t. c. But if we see that in four directions a unit travels at speed V, and in the remaining four directions at a speed equal to 1,41 times V, it not only

[Winter Dragon]

Feedback for Alpha 2 Bene Gesserit:

Time played: ~18 hours (over four evenings)

Bugs found: ~12

Other issues: 3

THE MAKER MODE

- I can click on the dark grey territorys that reveal original map colors, including one region for each house. Beyond that I cannot seem to do anything further at this time.

DUNE 2 MODE

- Harvesters collect spice too quickly (explained further down)

- No WOR structure for Ordos. Only barracks. (In dune 2, Ordos had both)

- Carryalls don't always face the way they are flying, sometimes they sort of 'slide' on an angle. In the several maps I played they did this on almost every angle, so I don't think it's any specific angle that can narrow down the problem.

- There seems to be a limit as to how far structures (including concrete slabs) can be built in relation to the construction yard. I was unable to build beyond a certain distance from my construction yard even though there was ample rock above and below my base.

- Some individual tiles of rock cannot be built on, but adjacent tiles of rock that look exactly the same can be built on. In the several tests I played these problematic tiles always border on sand tiles.

- When building the quad as atreides, the Trike icon next to it turns to an icon of a Trooper. Once the quad is completed, the Trooper icon changes back to a Trike icon.

- Harvesters seem to randomly disappear, or, after a while they vanish. I'm not sure how or why this happens, but the enemy can't attack so they didn't destroy it, and there seems to be no worms on any of the maps either.

- Enemy Carryalls appear to fly near your base carrying something, but what they drop off doesn't seem to appear.

- No enemy harvesters sighted (I know enemies don't really work yet, but wouldn't the harvester at least sit next to their refinerys?

- MCVs don't work yet (probably mentioned)

- Nor do starports (mentioned)

- Some vehicles get stuck next to or around walls and structures. I'll see if I can narrow down where this specifically occurs.

- You cannot build a :: slab on a :. area of rock. The upper right tile would be sand, spice or mountains. (Is it a bug though?) - Just in Dune 2 you could do this which made me wonder why we can't do it in this. (the slab on sand would automatically disappear.)

- Money counts down faster than the time taken to upgrade, build units and structures.

Just a couple of other things to report.

Harvesters collect spice far too quickly. Well, at least in the ten maps I play-tested. I was getting more money than I knew what to do with and this was after building a steady stream of tanks and structures. Money was coming in far too quickly and a lot of precious spice on the map was being wasted.

The sidebar at the moment covers the bottom edge of the map. If you have a base down there any rock below the sidebar cannot be built on because the sidebar is in the way. In the several maps I played there was only one real case of irritation here.

The inability to distinguish an ordos raider trike with an ordos normal trike without a unit portrait could become problematic, just as it is impossible to tell the difference between a deviator and a missile tank (unless they fire.) Will unit portraits come back in the future or will some other identification system replace this?

Other than that, looking great!

[nemafakei]

"- Carryalls don't always face the way they are flying, sometimes they sort of 'slide' on an angle. In the several maps I played they did this on almost every angle, so I don't think it's any specific angle that can narrow down the problem."

I agree, in Bene this isn't fully fixed. The main problem occurs at when carryalls move halfway between two 45 degree directions. It would look more realistic either

- if curved flight paths were calculated

- if carryalls were dissuaded from moving at (45n+22.5) degree angles

- if more angles were drawn (difficult)

- perhaps if the computer offset the drawing of some rows/columns of pixels to slant the sprite when it moves in non-45-degree directions

"- Enemy Carryalls appear to fly near your base carrying something, but what they drop off doesn't seem to appear."

I think this is for backgound/effect purposes rather than undropped cargo.

[stefanhendriks]

Great to see you played 18 (!!!) hours just to test out all of these things. And there is not even one single combat system. Thanks.

A lot of things you mention are known. The angle bug even appears in the old D2TM (v0.92). Basicly i have detatched the carry-alls from the cells in their movement. So i just let them go 'straight' from cell A to cell B (calculated X,Y position). I think the'bug' appears because i take the upper-left pixel of the unit and calculate then the 'proper angle' from that to the actual destination (which is also the uppr-left of the cell!). I don't know if it will make a lot of a difference if i change the destination into (cell-width / 2 and cell-height / 2), and taking the starting position the middle of the unit. It might help, but i don't know for sure.

The D2TM mode is not finished , therefor it does nothing but 'revealing areas'... :)

[nemafakei]

Since the effect of using (cell-width / 2 and cell-height / 2) is just one of translation, it shouldn't.

It might havee affect bigger units like harvesters whose graphics are bigger than 32 by 32 - if they flew.

[heavy trooper]

I've been playing the Beta version of The Maker for an hour or so. Here are a few things that merit being mentioned:

- if a unit is selected, the selection-frame also fades/flashes

  I find this a very irritating thing especially when more units are selected

- units don't seem to do what they are ordered to do

  e.g. if i order a deviator to attack, it moves into the opposite direction at first

- graphical interface of the game is really GREAT, but unit information (like in C&C) should finally     

  be added

- the "caryall bug" discussed above appears to me very strange and disturbing

  I'm also of the opinion that caryalls should move more smovely if possible

+ shell hits on tanks and other vehicles look great, especially the siege tank

I must congratulate Stefan for developing such a great Dune II based game.

For me the best so far.

I hope very much that the game is gonna be finished one day including a mutiplayer mode.

Thanks to all of those who keep the good old Dune alive!